Vfacts March 2011

[Brazen]

Sigh....

[ivorya]

I'd like to question how holdens figures are obtained.
My Father In-Law had purchased a (spew here) Daewoo-Barina. He was told it was brand new and that it would be off the boat in a number of weeks.
He's just had some modifications done to it (towing behind a Winny), when the engineers looked furthur into the history, the car had been registered in November still had a jan 2011 compliance plate.
Question is. Is Holden, and i'm sure they're all doing it, registering cars that they are making before they are sold? and maybe putting later compliance plates on the vehicles to get their numbers up?

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by ivorya

I'd like to question how holdens figures are obtained.
My Father In-Law had purchased a (spew here) Daewoo-Barina. He was told it was brand new and that it would be off the boat in a number of weeks.
He's just had some modifications done to it (towing behind a Winny), when the engineers looked furthur into the history, the car had been registered in November still had a jan 2011 compliance plate.
Question is. Is Holden, and i'm sure they're all doing it, registering cars that they are making before they are sold? and maybe putting later compliance plates on the vehicles to get their numbers up?

Cant be done....

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Brazen

They should wish for AU, it was selling 6000 a month.

You need to accept the fact that the large car segment has been in decline for over a decade and will never be the same again. There is no point in bringing up the point that X car sold X many back in 1999 because it is not relevant in today's market. The end.

And just because your beloved Holden does something doesnt mean to say Ford should - not everyone loves or wants a Sportwagon and for Ford to "invest" scarce capital into a product in a declining segment would be literally like tipping money down the drain.

Oh and for what it's worth, Ford already build a wagon - the Territory. A car which has just had $500 Million spent on it and is about to hit the streets.

[ivorya]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Cant be done....

Well it's happening.

He even had the engineering guy ring the RTA to find out how they did it.

RTA were no help at all... they were all shocked.

[stevz]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Oh and for what it's worth, Ford already build a wagon - the Territory. A car which has just had $500 Million spent on it and is about to hit the streets.

The Territory is not a wagon, it is an SUV. Not everyone wants a car of this size or weight.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by stevz

The Territory is not a wagon, it is an SUV. Not everyone wants a car of this size or weight.

then buy a mondeo wagon.

ford is not the falcon car company. they don't have to make the falcon in every variation of body style.

want a wagon - buy a mondeo/territory
want a ute - buy a ranger/falcon ute

seriously, why does everyone want the falcon to do everything that holden do, even though for all its sales, holden don't seem any better off!!

i believe ford actually increased market share this month while holden and toyota slipped??

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by ivorya

Well it's happening.

He even had the engineering guy ring the RTA to find out how they did it.

RTA were no help at all... they were all shocked.

You cant register a car that has not yet been Australian complied, won't be on the RTA system..

Dealers even have issues with Aussie built cars like HSV's sometimes not being processed because the factory had only just complied them days earlier, and them not being on the RTA database.

[Wretched]

[CODE]Ford 2,011 2,010

Ford Escape 393 216
Ford Falcon 1,719 2,496
Ford Falcon Ute 581 980
Ford Fiesta 1,477 971
Ford Focus 1,033 808
Ford Mondeo 772 455
Ford Ranger 4X2 428 463
Ford Ranger 4X4 1,175 629
Ford Territory 881 964
Ford Transit 176 83
Ford Transit Bus 32 3
Ford Transit C/C 31 24
Ford Total 8,698 8,092

Change of 7.5%

Holden 2,011 2,010

Holden Astra 0 1
Holden Astra Convertible0 0
Holden Barina 494 1,213
Holden Barina Spark 444 0
Holden Caprice 164 135
Holden Captiva 5 114 381
Holden Captiva 7 556 1,074
Holden Colorado 4X2 178 227
Holden Colorado 4X4 895 1,053
Holden Combo 31 54
Holden Commodore 4,170 4,209
Holden Cruze 2,804 2,125
Holden Epica 82 159
Holden Monaro 0 0
Holden Statesman 0 49
Holden Utility 4X2 884 1,114
Holden Viva 0 1
Holden Total 10,816 11,795

Change of -8.3%

Hyundai 2,011 2,010

Hyundai Accent 0 1
Hyundai Elantra 17 105
Hyundai Getz 1,463 1,836
Hyundai Grandeur 4 0
Hyundai i20 579 0
Hyundai i30 2,376 3,678
Hyundai I45 452 0
Hyundai iLOAD 680 629
Hyundai iMAX 145 290
Hyundai ix35 982 533
Hyundai Santa Fe 428 366
Hyundai Sonata 0 54
Hyundai Tiburon 0 1
Hyundai Tucson 0 304
Hyundai Total 7,126 7,797

Change of -8.6%

Toyota 2,011 2,010

Toyota Aurion 800 1,027
Toyota Avensis 0 68
Toyota Camry (4 cyl) 1,639 1,985
Toyota Coaster 34 39
Toyota Corolla 3,067 3,555
Toyota FJ Cruiser 209 0
Toyota Hiace Bus 282 239
Toyota Hiace Van 654 729
Toyota Hilux 4X2 1,349 1,502
Toyota Hilux 4X4 2,679 2,433
Toyota Kluger 1,370 1,309
Toyota Landcruiser PU/CC721 599
Toyota Landcruiser Wagon956 979
Toyota Prado 1,628 2,087
Toyota Prius 66 190
Toyota RAV4 1,318 1,284
Toyota Rukus 114 0
Toyota Tarago 119 167
Toyota Yaris 1,461 2,114
Toyota Total 18,466 20,306

Change -9.1%

Volkswagen 2,011 2,010

Volkswagen Amarok 4X2 2 0
Volkswagen Amarok 4X4 112 0
Volkswagen Caddy 163 272
Volkswagen Caddy/Camper 50 24
Volkswagen Caravelle 16 3
Volkswagen Crafter 45 73
Volkswagen Eos 22 62
Volkswagen Golf 945 1,267
Volkswagen Jetta 177 185
Volkswagen Multivan 88 17
Volkswagen Beetle 10 35
Volkswagen Beetle Cabrio1 15
Volkswagen Passat 22 211
Volkswagen Passat CC 56 56
Volkswagen Polo 266 81
Volkswagen Tiguan 1,107 565
Volkswagen Touareg 3 24
Volkswagen Transptr 119 141
Volkswagen Transptr C/C 24 3
Volkswagen Total 3,228 3,034

Change 6.4%
[/CODE]

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by prydey

then buy a mondeo wagon.

ford is not the falcon car company. they don't have to make the falcon in every variation of body style.

want a wagon - buy a mondeo/territory
want a ute - buy a ranger/falcon ute

seriously, why does everyone want the falcon to do everything that holden do, even though for all its sales, holden don't seem any better off!!

i believe ford actually increased market share this month while holden and toyota slipped??

The Mondeo wagon in Diesel is a better fleet hack then Falcon ever was... The reps love them because they are comfortible and have some cool tech (compared to a BF3 Wagon) and the fleet managers also love them because of better fuel economy and probably resale..

The MC Mondeo is just starting to fly... About time!

[stevz]

Originally Posted by prydey

then buy a mondeo wagon.

ford is not the falcon car company. they don't have to make the falcon in every variation of body style.

want a wagon - buy a mondeo/territory
want a ute - buy a ranger/falcon ute

seriously, why does everyone want the falcon to do everything that holden do, even though for all its sales, holden don't seem any better off!!

i believe ford actually increased market share this month while holden and toyota slipped??

Mondeo wagon: a fwd import with a low towing capacity. No thanks.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by prydey

ford is not the falcon car company

This. People on this forum and motoring reporters need to get this concept into their skulls. Sure I would like to see Falcon outselling Commodore and everything in between, but there is more to the Ford Motor Company than one vehicle.

And a quick look at those figures Wretched has posted, shows that 4x4 Ranger, Focus and Mondeo had a great month. And the Territory adequately accounted for BOTH variants of the Craptiva. Blam.

[stevz]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

You cant register a car that has not yet been Australian complied, won't be on the RTA system..

Dealers even have issues with Aussie built cars like HSV's sometimes not being processed because the factory had only just complied them days earlier, and them not being on the RTA database.

I think they have their wires crossed, the car was probably built in november and complied in january. That would make more sense.

[janddbone]

Wagon would sell a minimum 50,000 units over the 10 year life of the vehicle. How could you not make money on it? Wagon specific costs could easily be contained to $2000 per veicle...

[Benjamin Smith]

Originally Posted by stevz

I think they have their wires crossed, the car was probably built in november and complied in january. That would make more sense.

my mum kia is like that has the plate that say's June 06 but has a sticker on it that say's built july 05,

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

The Mondeo wagon in Diesel is a better fleet hack then Falcon ever was... The reps love them because they are comfortible and have some cool tech (compared to a BF3 Wagon) and the fleet managers also love them because of better fuel economy and probably resale..

The MC Mondeo is just starting to fly... About time!

I mentioned last month that I think Mondeo has started to really gain some traction. I also think that many fleets have been converted by Ford from the BF3 to the MC Mondeo diesel wagons. This deserves credit to Ford.

I got told that February 2011 was just likely to be a one off. I am sticking to my beliefs. It is now a clear second in the segment. Well done Ford.

[phillyc]

Ford 2011 2010
Ford Falcon 1,719 2,496
Ford Falcon Ute 581 980

The reason is LPG. If 25% of sedans and 40% of utes were LPG as previously stated by Ford. The drops VERY neatly marries up to lack of LPG.

The imminent EcoLPi with better outputs than petrol, significant consumption reduction and 6spd auto will surely help.

PS Some BF3 wagons were in the 2010 Falcon figure.

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by phillyc

Ford 2011 2010
Ford Falcon 1,719 2,496
Ford Falcon Ute 581 980

The reason is LPG. If 25% of sedans and 40% of utes were LPG as previously stated by Ford. The drops VERY neatly marries up to lack of LPG.
.

So where did those buyers go then, Commodore and Ute sales were down from 2010, so they didnt go there. Aurion and Camry are down, they didnt go there.

Its quite the mystery!!!!!!!! Maybe the ute buyers went and bought a Ranger, some of the Falcon buyers went and bought an escape, some bought a Mondeo. Maybe the reason is, Ford are now starting to offer proper choices to buyers, which could explain the 7.5% increase in sales.

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by bobthebilda

Maybe the reason is, Ford are now starting to offer proper choices to buyers, which could explain the 7.5% increase in sales.

Indeed, they are. Ford are holding onto 3rd in the market. (But, YTD it must be pretty close between Ford & Mazda with Hyundai in a watching brief in 5th). Even with Falcon, Ute and Territory at a low.

[Windsor220]

Yeah the way I see it Ford are doing quite well at the moment with most of their models becoming successful. Just Falcon needs the gas engine and newTerritory comes out now. In a few months we will be flying.

I've noticed Holden has become the Commodore/Cruze company. All of their other models are starting to suffer.

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by prydey

well said. every month the experts come out of the woodwork shouting gloom and doom, but i agree, ford would have known they would have to endure a bit of a bleak period.

Predey: Extreme optimist with soft spot for Ford Australia Management. See White Star Line, Titanic. ;)

Predey man, I really admire your optimism, but as I think about that piece of junk GT I use to own that I sold in six months, which made the BA XR8 before it with the vibrating brakes, mild rust and the broken air circulation control, look like a Lexus for build quality. Or the Territory sitting in the driveway now with its rust, shruken door and tailgate seals and second lot of ball joints and the half dozen other things to go wrong with it.

I can't help thinking there is more to this then a grand plan from Ford Australia management.

[Wretched]

[CODE]Mazda 2,011 2,010
Mazda BT-50 4X2 547 338
Mazda BT-50 4X4 372 325
Mazda CX-7 778 944
Mazda CX-9 302 415
Mazda MX5 41 47
Mazda RX8 12 21
Mazda2 1,544 1,043
Mazda3 3,979 3,562
Mazda6 464 758
Mazda Total 8,039 7,453

Change of 7.9%

Subaru 2,011 2,010
Subaru Forester 1,227 1,382
Subaru Impreza 1,336 1,065
Subaru Liberty 685 576
Subaru Outback 538 531
Subaru Tribeca 115 125
Subaru Total 3,901 3,679

Change of 6.0%

Nissan 2,011 2,010
Nissan 350Z 0 2
Nissan 370Z 140 121
Nissan Dualis 1,068 284
Nissan GT-R 27 16
Nissan Maxima 323 279
Nissan Micra 920 759
Nissan Murano 318 308
Nissan Navara 4X2 217 195
Nissan Navara 4X4 2,358 1,959
Nissan Pathfinder 282 43
Nissan Patrol PU/CC 236 186
Nissan Patrol Wagon 379 428
Nissan Tiida 487 1,062
Nissan X-Trail 1,034 916
Nissan Total 7,789 6,558

Change of 18.8%

Jeep 2,011 2,010
Jeep Cherokee 151 149
Jeep Grand Cherokee 202 16
Jeep Patriot 162 117
Jeep Wrangler 241 235
Jeep Total 756 517

Change of 46.2%
[/CODE]

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by Windsor220

Yeah the way I see it Ford are doing quite well at the moment with most of their models becoming successful. Just Falcon needs the gas engine and newTerritory comes out now. In a few months we will be flying.

I've noticed Holden has become the Commodore/Cruze company. All of their other models are starting to suffer.

And with over 70% of its sales soon to be manufactured in Australia, it is going to hurt them very much when it comes to pricing. people see the commodores advertised for $36990 drive away, but I am betting that alot of them go for alot less than that.

I was reading thru an old readers digest today (from 1991), and saw a Nissan Maxima advertised for $34999 plus on road costs. In saturdays paper, I saw them for $32999 driveaway.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by DanielXR8

Predey:
Predey

not once, but twice. can't be that hard to type surely.

you've had a bad experience, so therefore all fords are bad. great generalisation there. mine have all been pretty good. (every model since xf). based on my experience, ford build great cars.

[stevz]

Originally Posted by Windsor220

I've noticed Holden has become the Commodore/Cruze company. All of their other models are starting to suffer.

Barina, Colorado and Epica are all ageing and are due to be replaced with next generation models in the not too distant future.

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by prydey

not once, but twice. can't be that hard to type surely.

you've had a bad experience, so therefore all fords are bad. great generalisation there. mine have all been pretty good. (every model since xf). based on my experience, ford build great cars.

I've also had a bad dealer experience too, but know I'm not saying that its always bad. I've owned more then one Falcon for example. What I am saying is much of the crap that Ford customers experience were quite capable of being addressed by a good management team and that is very often missing.

In my opinion they got caught with their pants down when they screwed up the product development for Diesel and LPG, not some grand plan as you suggest.

[naddis01]

Originally Posted by Brazen

when its the very bodystyle itself which is the problem.

I happen to agree with Brazen on this one. I have said it before but out of the 6 (new) vehicles that my wife and I have had not one of them has been a sedan and I don't see this changing any time soon.

Just tonight one of her friends asked me for a recommendation for a new car between $30 - $40k.

First off I suggested XR6 50th anniversary - no need a wagon.
Second was Territory - no don't need an SUV and the fuel bills to go with it. So I said get the new model but they still don't want an SUV.
Third suggestion was Mondeo - no have to be able to tow a boat and don't want FWD to do it.

So what did I recommend next? SV6 Sportswagon. They are going to check them out tomorrow.

[1TUFFUTE]

i personally think ford has and is doing a better than local average with their lineups...and soon will be lookinh much cruisier. At my wifes government work they have a car pool consisting of 1 very unused prius, acouple of subi foresters,xtrails,corrolas and a lancer. So much for price being the be all and end all....

[drew`SEVNT5]

Originally Posted by Ford_The_Win

Because there is! I know a lot of ex-Falcon owners that would never go back to one after repeated problems or dodgy dealerships...

+1

My best mate picked up a G6ET.

His subsequent issues and lack of service from Ford Dealers, along with the problems he has had in the past.... He has vowed this is his LAST Ford...


And I am heading the same way... In fact, I cannot think of any of the falcons & territorys any of me/my family/my friends have bought in the past 5 years that have been satistfactory in regards to product issues & dealership service...

[Windsor220]

Originally Posted by drew`SEVNT5

+1

My best mate picked up a G6ET.

His subsequent issues and lack of service from Ford Dealers, along with the problems he has had in the past.... He has vowed this is his LAST Ford...


And I am heading the same way... In fact, I cannot think of any of the falcons & territorys any of me/my family/my friends have bought in the past 5 years that have been satistfactory in regards to product issues & dealership service...

I've said this a million times on this forum, if this is affecting Ford so much then why isnt it affecting Holden when they are the same if not worse in the reliability/service department?