Sold out: why Australia doesn’t have enough electric vehicles to go around

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by kypez

As in the other thread where you jumped the gun, Tesla didn't report the wrong numbers.

4417 is the yearly number. 3097 was March. Literally in the publications that says exactly that.

I'll await you accepting you got that wrong and were too eager to criticise Tesla. You're a kind of fanboi yourself. The Anti Tesla Fanboi.

Not what i'm hearing. Lol at expecting Tesla to be accurate with the numbers, when they have already been busted using false figures.

We will see what next months numbers show.

I have an issue with bull****ters, not Tesla itself. They do themselves no favours continually being loose with the truth.

[kypez]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Not what i'm hearing. Lol at expecting Tesla to be accurate with the numbers, when they have already been busted using false figures.



We will see what next months numbers show.



I have an issue with bull****ters, not Tesla itself. They do themselves no favours continually being loose with the truth.

But they weren't here. They literally gave two numbers. YTD and the month as requested. I know cause I know the people who did it.

If some idiot reporter didn't read it right or is trying to be silly, for the extra clicks, that's on them. The number is accurate in this thread as well.

4417 YTD
3097 March

It's not rocket science.

So you won't accept you got that wrong I take it? Why am I not surprised

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[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by kypez

But they weren't here. They literally gave two numbers. YTD and the month as requested. I know cause I know the people who did it.

If some idiot reporter didn't read it right or is trying to be silly, for the extra clicks, that's on them. The number is accurate in this thread as well.

4417 YTD
3097 March

It's not rocket science.

So you won't accept you got that wrong I take it? Why am I not surprised

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If i'm wrong, i'm wrong. Dodgy figures are a Tesla specialty though. Next months figures will give a better indication of where they are really at.

Post proof if you are that in the know, and i'll retract my statement if true.

[kypez]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

If i'm wrong, i'm wrong. Dodgy figures are a Tesla specialty though. Next months figures will give a better indication of where they are really at.



Post proof if you are that in the know, and i'll retract my statement if true.

What's next month got to do with last month? Next month would be less no doubt. Their ships don't come in monthly.

So March was 3097 and Jan and Feb made 1320. April should be around that 1000 number with delays they've had.

But again, what does next month have to do with this result?



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[ozrunner]

Originally Posted by kypez

What's next month got to do with last month? Next month would be less no doubt. Their ships don't come in monthly.

So March was 3097 and Jan and Feb made 1320. April should be around that 1000 number with delays they've had.

But again, what does next month have to do with this result?

LOL, you screwed you own answer with "Their ships don't come in monthly" thus meaning none of their monthly figures could actually be accurate including March.

You also avoided this comment from the article that basically says the same, meaning the 3097 could include a bucket load of February figures as all are dependent upon when the ship came in !!.

"Tesla doesn’t have consistent monthly tallies because customer orders tend to be delivered in gluts or batches"

https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-new...orolla-and-i30

[kypez]

Originally Posted by ozrunner

LOL, you screwed you own answer with "Their ships don't come in monthly" thus meaning none of their monthly figures could actually be accurate including March.



You also avoided this comment from the article that basically says the same, meaning the 3097 could include a bucket load of February figures as all are dependent upon when the ship came in !!.



"Tesla doesn’t have consistent monthly tallies because customer orders tend to be delivered in gluts or batches"



https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-new...orolla-and-i30

Again, Vfacts works on registered cars. Which, if you recall, was how brands tried to lift numbers by registering demos back in the day. Are you guys in a race to show how poor your comprehension skills are?

it doesn't matter when the car is ordered. Nor when the ship arrives. Just how many they deliver to customers in the month.

So even if the ships turn up once a quarter, the sales numbers for March stay the same.

Hence the two numbers. I'll spell it out for you again.

4417 YTD
3097 March.



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[Falcon SXR8]

So it made 3097 because of a one off big shipment and if you average the numbers its 1472 a month this year so far.

The real reason tesla hasn't been supplying consistent figures ( I'm an insider ) is because they were actually counting them as an electrical appliance you plug into your house so hidden in with fridge and washing machine sales.

[ozrunner]

Originally Posted by kypez

Again, Vfacts works on registered cars. Which, if you recall, was how brands tried to lift numbers by registering demos back in the day.

Are you guys in a race to show how poor your comprehension skills are?

I think you meet that criteria more than us.

it doesn't matter when the car is ordered. Nor when the ship arrives. Just how many they deliver to customers in the month.

if the ships turn up once a quarter, the sales numbers for March stay the same.

So you're saying if a ship only turns up in one quarter, eg March with say 5000 cars on board all ordered since 1 January they will all be treated as being March sales as that's when they landed and were registered. Thus, no Vfacts sales should have been or can be recorded for Jan or Feb.

So as you describe there could be months when Tesla may have to record no sales as a ship didn't arrive in that month. Correct ?

Again I refer you to this quote from the article you made reference to.

"Tesla doesn’t have consistent monthly tallies because customer orders tend to be delivered in gluts or batches"

Unless it is absolutely gospel that a ship docked during a particular month and all its cars were delivered in that month and given your quote, "..........Their ships don't come in monthly." thus without ships every month Tesla CANNOT provide a valid MONTHLY sales figure and the above quote applies. Correct ?

[GT1533]

VFacts is not based on registrations. It’s based on manufacturers voluntarily reporting their retail and fleet sales. It’s an honour system regarding accuracy of reported numbers.

[JasonACT]

I'm thinking... Gone are the days when they'll have unordered/unsold cars at dealers, where you can make a deal, rather than pay the (possibly inflated) full price.

I hope I'm wrong. But we're going to have to average out the numbers here, and wait, before pointing any fingers I guess.

[Dr Smith]

Maybe we need to find a way of counting the number of vehicles a dealership actually hands over to a real buyer…as in gets the keys and drives out only to return for first service or a warranty job

[kypez]

Originally Posted by ozrunner

I think you meet that criteria more than us.



it doesn't matter when the car is ordered. Nor when the ship arrives. Just how many they deliver to customers in the month.



if the ships turn up once a quarter, the sales numbers for March stay the same.



So you're saying if a ship only turns up in one quarter, eg March with say 5000 cars on board all ordered since 1 January they will all be treated as being March sales as that's when they landed and were registered. Thus, no Vfacts sales should have been or can be recorded for Jan or Feb.



So as you describe there could be months when Tesla may have to record no sales as a ship didn't arrive in that month. Correct ?



Again I refer you to this quote from the article you made reference to.



"Tesla doesn’t have consistent monthly tallies because customer orders tend to be delivered in gluts or batches"



Unless it is absolutely gospel that a ship docked during a particular month and all its cars were delivered in that month and given your quote, "..........Their ships don't come in monthly." thus without ships every month Tesla CANNOT provide a valid MONTHLY sales figure and the above quote applies. Correct ?

Special kind of.... Ford Mustangs don't arrive every month. They arrive in batches. Yet we get monthly numbers. Ford Escape, Puma, etc all don't come in regularly either. With the new model Ranger coming, and the production line halting with new stock not made yet, I guess we stop counting them too cause there might not be consistent ships arriving.

Mercedes, Lexus, Ferrari, Lambo, "insert brand here", literally all don't get regular monthly deliveries (bar maybe Toyota). So they don't count?!

Seriously... No cure for what you have.

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[jgmdat]

Is now a good time to mention how boring and ugly Tesla interiors are?

[fiestaz]

Originally Posted by ozrunner

LOL, you screwed you own answer with "Their ships don't come in monthly" thus meaning none of their monthly figures could actually be accurate including March.

You also avoided this comment from the article that basically says the same, meaning the 3097 could include a bucket load of February figures as all are dependent upon when the ship came in !!.

"Tesla doesn’t have consistent monthly tallies because customer orders tend to be delivered in gluts or batches"

https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-new...orolla-and-i30

Hang on a sec... How does the fact the Tesla Ships come in quarterly, make the figures any less accurate??? They are still the figures. Vfacts reports on vehicles registered and delivered to customers (not demonstrators anymore). So if its 3097 in March, its still 3097 in March isn't it? And less in January and February. How is this not accurate figures??

[ozrunner]

Originally Posted by kypez

Special kind of.... Ford Mustangs don't arrive every month. They arrive in batches. Yet we get monthly numbers. Ford Escape, Puma, etc all don't come in regularly either. With the new model Ranger coming, and the production line halting with new stock not made yet, I guess we stop counting them too cause there might not be consistent ships arriving.

Mercedes, Lexus, Ferrari, Lambo, "insert brand here", literally all don't get regular monthly deliveries (bar maybe Toyota). So they don't count?....

FFS I should have known. The same ol Kypez response, ignore the questions and deflect with abuse.

"Seriously... No cure for what you have." Really, newsflash just for your brain.

Ford and others in Oz carry a stock of cars that are distributed to individual dealers for showroom stock, demo's and immediate sales. Those stocks are periodically replenished including any specific orders and the remaining stocks held in holding yards and distributed to dealers as required.

Thus consistent accurate registered "sale" figures are able to be provided for each month as per your statement below along with your self appraisal.

Originally Posted by kypez

Again, Vfacts works on registered cars. Which, if you recall, was how brands tried to lift numbers by registering demos back in the day. Are you guys in a race to show how poor your comprehension skills are?

From what I understand Tesla does not have dealer networks with cars available unlike Ford et al.

Tesla has STORES with no available STOCK with maybe an example or two to just look at if you're lucky. You cannot buy a Tesla from this store and take it home that day or the next as they don't have any!!!. You can ONLY ORDER one and when a ship comes to town you will get it. Correct ?

Can you now see the difference or do you still need more help.

Ford and others can give correct monthly sales (via actual registrations) as they have actual cars on hand to sell, register and count for that month.

Tesla stores DO NOT have any cars on hand to actually sell direct, register and count so its monthly figure relies on when a ship arrives notwithstanding that it may also contain cars that were also ordered in preceding months.

As you yourself have stated they don't get 12 ships a year thus unless they do it means unlike Ford et al they cannot provide accurate monthly figures as theirs will always be tainted. Correct ?

[jpd80]

I’m beginning to think that a of late, all vehicle importers are the same as Tesla in that they have very little dealer stock and most of the ships arrive with already sold vehicles. It’s only for the fact of regular monthly shipping deliveries that all the non-Tesla brands have consistently monthly reporting. Tesla clearly needs to book more ships to reduce its wait times.

Heard a nasty rumour that either Q4 or Q1 2023, Tesla revenue is expected to equal or surpass Ford, that is a huge effort if it happens. The irony of that is Tesla is making almost all of its revenue and profits off the compact car and SUV segments where Ford and GM don’t seem to make much profit, so this looks to be taking profit more from German premium brands and the likes of Acura and Lexus?

[kypez]

Originally Posted by ozrunner

FFS I should have known. The same ol Kypez response, ignore the questions and deflect with abuse.

"Seriously... No cure for what you have." Really, newsflash just for your brain.

Ford and others in Oz carry a stock of cars that are distributed to individual dealers for showroom stock, demo's and immediate sales. Those stocks are periodically replenished including any specific orders and the remaining stocks held in holding yards and distributed to dealers as required.

Thus consistent accurate registered "sale" figures are able to be provided for each month as per your statement below along with your self appraisal.



From what I understand Tesla does not have dealer networks with cars available unlike Ford et al.

Tesla has STORES with no available STOCK with maybe an example or two to just look at if you're lucky. You cannot buy a Tesla from this store and take it home that day or the next as they don't have any!!!. You can ONLY ORDER one and when a ship comes to town you will get it. Correct ?

Can you now see the difference or do you still need more help.

Ford and others can give correct monthly sales (via actual registrations) as they have actual cars on hand to sell, register and count for that month.

Tesla stores DO NOT have any cars on hand to actually sell direct, register and count so its monthly figure relies on when a ship arrives notwithstanding that it may also contain cars that were also ordered in preceding months.

As you yourself have stated they don't get 12 ships a year thus unless they do it means unlike Ford et al they cannot provide accurate monthly figures as theirs will always be tainted. Correct ?

And there is the problem. You don't understand how Tesla work. When I bought my Model S, it was Inventory Stock. Even when I bought my First Model 3. Thing is, they are now selling more than they can supply, doesn't mean they don't have inventory at times. People cancel orders all the time and they come up as inventory. Before the demand jump, you could walk in, they'd find a car to meet your specs and you could just order that car from the "yard". That will happen again with Model 3 when Model Y get to the market and many waiting on their Model 3 will jump to the Model Y. Its still what happens overseas where Tesla have more supply than demand.

You're starting to embarrass yourself with you lack of understanding here.

Anyway, as others have pointed out, you have no idea what you're on.

Like I said, if I go to Ford and ask for a Mustang today, chances are they WONT have a car in stock and it will have to be ordered. You can't understand your own argument. Most brands now require you to order and you won't get a car off the floor anymore because they simply don't have stock and want to keep their demos.

FORD DONT HAVE 12 MUSTANG ships a year!

[kypez]

Originally Posted by jpd80

I’m beginning to think that a of late, all vehicle importers are the same as Tesla in that they have very little dealer stock
and most of the ships arrive with already sold vehicles. It’s only for the fact of regular monthly shipping deliveries
that al the non-Tesla brands have consistently monthly reporting. Tesla clearly needs to book more ships to reduce its wait times.

Heard a nasty rumour that either Q4 or Q1 2023, Tesla revenue is expected to equal or surpass Ford, that is a huge effort if it happens.
The irony of that is Tesla is making almost all of its revenue and profits off the compact car and SUV segments where Ford and GM don’t
seem to make much profit, so this looks to be taking profit more from German premium brands and the likes of Acura and Lexus?

Yeah. But you see, people don't want Electric cars! Ford and the others have to balance their interests (think dealers) which Tesla just don't need to.

Everyone said, Wait till the Euros arrive. Well, they did. And they couldn't build at the same price point. Heck, Tesla are flogging them in their home ground. Giga Berlin will be a game changer for supply.

So either there are millions and millions of fanboi's as people claim... or just maybe, they have a decent product that is exactly what a lot of the market is looking for at this moment.

[ozrunner]

Originally Posted by kypez

.......... doesn't mean they don't have inventory at times. People cancel orders all the time and they come up as inventory.

So given it was reported in an article sometime ago that Tesla only ships sold cars and only ships them when the ship allocation is full you are confirming that in normal circumstances, ie no covid or chip shortage, Tesla's inventory is made up of cancelled orders ?

[kypez]

Originally Posted by ozrunner

So given it was reported in an article sometime ago that Tesla only ships sold cars and only ships them when the ship allocation is full you are confirming that in normal circumstances, ie no covid or chip shortage, Tesla's inventory is made up of cancelled orders ?

You take the article as 100% gospel... Problem with everything you say is that your initial premise is incorrect. They have orders for the next 8 months. Of course they'll all be orders being shipped. They can't meet demand. It's easy to order the car, $150 (now $350), buying it is different; finance might fall through for example. So, at the moment, they would be cancelled orders. But it wasn't the case before the market went car hungry.

I put money on an iX BMW but won't go ahead with it after seeing the EQS SUV. That car is still on order because the dealer wanted stock and asked me not to cancel just yet cause BMW will only send what has been purchased at the moment.

Makes sense to only ship when the ship is full. Do other mass manufacturers set sail without a full load?

Just stop for a moment. Stop digging yourself into a hole. Read what you're trying to say. See that others are saying that you've got it wrong. And see your misunderstanding.



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[jpd80]

Actually, we know that some small amount orders fall over, they either become dealer inventory or
get offered to people waiting in line who want a similar vehicle that hasn’t been built yet.

Either way you slice it, whenever you have more buyers than available vehicles, there’s no discounting
and a fairly long ordering line. Manufacturers know that if you keep buyers hungry, they pay full price.

[ozrunner]

You just can't help yourself and have to always resort to pathetic innuendo's to dodge a question or admit you're on shaky ground. Well remember you've set the goalposts

You take the article as 100% gospel...

Yep a lot more than your tripe and it made sense as Tesla shops are not franchised.

......... They have orders for the next 8 months. Of course they'll all be orders being shipped. They can't meet demand.

So by definition obviously this demand was not able to be met from the inventory. Thus, you are confirming some future Tesla monthly sales will have to be noted as zero unless a few sales are cancelled and subsequently met from a small inventory or by some miracle 8 monthly ships arrive. You can't dodge it. But I'm betting Tesla will come up with some BS.

Makes sense to only ship when the ship is full. Do other mass manufacturers set sail without a full load?

What would you think Einstein. But this is about Tesla sales no one else as the others operate a franchise business model. Do you need assistance with comprehension.

[kypez]

Ok... Of course there might be zero months. I literally said that and so have others. Doesn't change the March number. Literally mentioned that Jan and Feb only generated 1320 sales combined.

Your claim that if you can't have cars every month, then any month total doesn't count is absurd as has been noted by others here.

You're probably headed for a holiday from the forum anyway.

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[ozrunner]

Originally Posted by kypez

Ok.....................Your claim that if you can't have cars every month, then any month total doesn't count is absurd as has been noted by others here.

And there we have it. Post a furphy to avoid the heat. Show me where I said that ?

You're probably headed for a holiday from the forum anyway.

You're pathetic and now trying to influence the Mods.

[zilo]

Should be a flood of cheaper electric vehicles soon, so far only the chinese have been using LiFep04 in their cars (they have a disregard for patents...LOL)...but this will change this year as the patent rights expire in 2022.

The company that has had the patent on LiFeP04 chemistry and has never used it apart from royalties?

BASF


A big benefit is it doesn't catch on fire...well not nearly as much...

[b0son]

Originally Posted by zilo

Should be a flood of cheaper electric vehicles soon, so far only the chinese have been using LiFep04 in their cars

Tesla have been using it in its chinese-made standard range cars, not sure if any of those were exported.

[FTE217]

Originally Posted by GT1533

VFacts is not based on registrations. It’s based on manufacturers voluntarily reporting their retail and fleet sales. It’s an honour system regarding accuracy of reported numbers.

Ah ok very interesting, a honour system that has always been abused......


Sold out thread title, they are BTO no, they never worked the way of the typical OE even though covid has changed supply so much nowadays.
Just as a matter of interest re T units sold.
I expect Kypez will say otherwise for I mentioned this before in another thread sometime ago, the Aftermarket Industry I'm in use's this software sourcing SKU#'s (spare parts) by Vin # or by Rego # to supply to the Trade and Retail......
https://autoinfo.com.au/wp/oscarcatalogue/
It relys on the monthly Gov data from RMS's etcetc....
Are they suspect figures ? I would expect not unlike the VFACTs "honour" process.
Most companies in the game use this software daily, aid for sales and data use.

I got one of my staff to do a blanket Tesla VIO check (Vehicles In Operation) in other words, registered vehicles.
He looked up incl NZ might I add.

So combined
Model 3 < by far the largest numbers
Model S
Model X
Roadster

Incl NZ Total rego's = 27,542 Teslas registered.
Australia is at 22,268 regoed NZ 5,274 regoed.
This figure prob hasn't updated the March units ?? still no big deal.

Tesla combined market share Aus/NZ 0.151%
Matter of interest VIO's of all hatchbacks/sedans/SUV's incl NZ = 18M,254,673.000
That 18M+ doesn't even incl Dual Cabs other type of commercials etcetc might I add
I asked just for general fred daly day to day transport.

Read into it what you like.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by FTE217

Ah ok very interesting, a honour system that has always been abused......


Sold out thread title, they are BTO no, they never worked the way of the typical OE even though covid has changed supply so much nowadays.
Just as a matter of interest re T units sold.
I expect Kypez will say otherwise for I mentioned this before in another thread sometime ago, the Aftermarket Industry I'm in use's this software sourcing SKU#'s (spare parts) by Vin # or by Rego # to supply to the Trade and Retail......
https://autoinfo.com.au/wp/oscarcatalogue/
It relys on the monthly Gov data from RMS's etcetc....
Are they suspect figures ? I would expect not unlike the VFACTs "honour" process.
Most companies in the game use this software daily, aid for sales and data use.

I got one of my staff to do a blanket Tesla VIO check (Vehicles In Operation) in other words, registered vehicles.
He looked up incl NZ might I add.

So combined
Model 3 < by far the largest numbers
Model S
Model X
Roadster

Incl NZ Total rego's = 27,542 Teslas registered.
Australia is at 22,268 regoed NZ 5,274 regoed.
This figure prob hasn't updated the March units ?? still no big deal.

Tesla combined market share Aus/NZ 0.151%
Matter of interest VIO's of all hatchbacks/sedans/SUV's incl NZ = 18M,254,673.000
That 18M+ doesn't even incl Dual Cabs other type of commercials etcetc might I add
I asked just for general fred daly day to day transport.

Read into it what you like.

Was waiting on someone to do VOR data from Autoinfo or PartsDB

[hayseed]

I'm Curious to hear both Kmav & kypez's Take on this .??

https://www.drive.com.au/news/tesla-...-owed-refunds/

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by hayseed

I'm Curious to hear both Kmav & kypez's Take on this .??

https://www.drive.com.au/news/tesla-...-owed-refunds/

$150 deposit !