Major Ford announcement

[westy73]

Originally Posted by GT-spec15

Are you suggesting all those items should still be made locally? Please tell me more!

Nope just simple logic.
You say you would buy an Australian Made product if it was comparable yet ALL industries are forced overseas due to lack of people standing up for our Australian made stuff.

Almost all things listed above could once upon a time be bought as Australian made. That's not too long ago either. All we have done is sat around and like little sheep, go oh well, that will give me choice. Little thought is given to the big picture and the erosion of our ability to look after our own backyard.

BE honest you aren't interested in buying Australian made really. It's almost embarrassing to do so isn't it.

I'll ask another question, would you care if we imported every grocery and food item to this country ? Is there really any need for us to farm our own stuff if we can just import it cheaper and give is greater choice ? I mean where do you stop ? When do you draw the line ?

[stevz]

Originally Posted by GT-spec15

Are you suggesting all those items should still be made locally? Please tell me more!

I purchased a new fridge recently and I chose an Australian made Westinghouse unit over other imported brands.
I will only buy imported products when there is absolutely no locally made equivalent available.

[GT-spec15]

Originally Posted by westy73

Nope just simple logic.
You say you would buy an Australian Made product if it was comparable yet ALL industries are forced overseas due to lack of people standing up for our Australian made stuff.

Well all that does is show that the majority of the country has other priorities, sadly.

And contrary to what you might think, I will buy Australian when I can. That said I don't go massively out of my way to do so. That's not a crime either.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by westy73

What is a waste of time is doing nothing.
Ford produces a green car that the Government would buy in numbers for fleets if only Ford had put in the necessary documentation to be accepted. They didn't. So why is that ? You build a brilliant EcoBoost Falcon, critics raved about it. You don't advertise it. You don't push it to be used in Government fleets as you cannot be bothered filling in the paperwork to be accepted under Euro regs. You then advertise the Mondeo with the same engine instead of EcoBoost. What am I missing here ?

Falcon sales are only dwindling because of lack of interest by Ford themselves. The upper echelons of management has told Ford Oz to slowly can it. Erode sales over time then we can bin it.

Ask yourself why...

Ford don't want to build in Australia because they can make greater profit margins manufacturing in Asia.
It is all about their welfare, they don't care about us.

With this in mind, why should the good people of Australia support a company which will sack 1200 people and threaten the jobs of thousands more in supply to increase their bank balance.

If this was truly about volumes they would give us a share of some of the stuff they build in Asia.
Ford have land, buildings, a workforce and equipment in Australia, all they need to do is allow us to build something we can sell here and export in enough numbers to be viable, but the profits wont be as great as they are elsewhere, so they turn their backs on us and say its our fault for not buying a car that no longer fits the bill.

[GT-spec15]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

With this in mind, why should the good people of Australia support a company which will sack 1200 people to increase their bank balance.

My god.

Ford is a business - they will not indefinitely run an operation that is bleeding money every year simply to keep a few people employed. And yes, on a global scale, 1200 jobs is 'a few'.

Many large Australian businesses have made large numbers of workers redundant in recent years. Are they all evil too?

That's business - Ford USA is not a charity.

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by westy73

I am a Third generation Falcon own and also have a Territory. So I for one have stood up and been counted.

Did you stand up and be counted when you purchased your car knowing it was built with imported components?
Do you stand up and be counted when your vehicles are serviced and tell the Service Manager "I buy Australian Made" and will not have my serviced with imported Motorcraft parts?

[Guzz226]

I heard tonight the factories are actually on Crown land - is this true? And that the lease agreements are up for renewal in 2017 - if true perhaps another factor in the timing of it all.

[Bossxr8]

Can't see how as the Ford plant wasn't built until 1925, a couple of years after Ford purchased the land. And Ford will sell the land off when they are finished with it.

Seems like BS.

There's no way the land was purchased 8 years before the factory was built. More like 2-3 years. There was an old article posted in the Geelong Advertiser last week from back in the 20's, when Ford purchased the land and announced they were building the factories here.

[GT-spec15]

Originally Posted by KIWI-1

Did you stand up and be counted when you purchased your car knowing it was built with imported components?
Do you stand up and be counted when your vehicles are serviced and tell the Service Manager "I buy Australian Made" and will not have my serviced with imported Motorcraft parts?

Some people like to get on a high horse about buying local, but they themselves consume vast quantities of goods and services produced offshore, largely without even realising it.

[westy73]

Originally Posted by KIWI-1

Did you stand up and be counted when you purchased your car knowing it was built with imported components?
Do you stand up and be counted when your vehicles are serviced and tell the Service Manager "I buy Australian Made" and will not have my serviced with imported Motorcraft parts?

What imported components do you refer to ?
The control blade suspension ?
The I6 engine ?
The differential ?
The panels ?
What ? What percentage of components are imported ? I bet it's less than 50% of the car so yes I will stand up and support that. You won't and don't and that's your choice but I WILL !!

Electrical componentry is almost always imported for everything so that can't be what you mean.
The only reason I can't buy those components is because a lot of people who just don't care and haven't cared over the years just love good old globalisation and have sent these makers overseas.
Stuff Australia and our manufacturers. Suck it up you all say.
This country is no longer Australia.....we are just DumpItHere-lia.

[ryeman]

Originally Posted by KIWI-1

Didn't the ALP borrow BILLIONS so Ford, Holden and Toyota could send it overseas? Money that my Great-Grandchildren will have to repay.

http://www.greenleft.org.au/node/39768

And the the others want to give it to private schools...how else are we going to get a sub class of line workers?

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by GT-spec15

My god.

Ford is a business - they will not indefinitely run an operation that is bleeding money every year simply to keep a few people employed. And yes, on a global scale, 1200 jobs is 'a few'.

Many large Australian businesses have made large numbers of workers redundant in recent years. Are they all evil too?

That's business - Ford USA is not a charity.

They are losing money because they choose to build and under marketed and unwanted vehicle, is that too hard to understand.
They will not have the same issue if they built a desired range of vehicles here.

Why do you think they really canned the Focus deal...
Why cant we build Ranger...

Because they can do it cheaper using Asian labour.

I look at it like this, if your going to buy an import, why buy one from a company which puts its profit margin ahead of the wages of Aussie workers.
If no one bought an imported Ford post 2016, they'd lose more money and soon ask why.

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by stevz

I purchased a new fridge recently and I chose an Australian made Westinghouse unit over other imported brands.
I will only buy imported products when there is absolutely no locally made equivalent available.

Westinghouse is part of Electrolux Group (Sweden) and whilst they still do manufacture some products in Australia, they also import from Europe, China, and South-East Asia. 24 Australian redundancies a few weeks ago too!

So if one was to play the devil's advocate, I could say that despite your best intentions, you are supporting an importer who puts profit before workers and sends those profits overseas.

[Lotte]

Originally Posted by GT-spec15

Some people like to get on a high horse about buying local, but they themselves consume vast quantities of goods and services produced offshore, largely without even realising it.

Give it a break mate. People want to support the local industries, and sometimes hands are tied because not all the smaller things that make a bigger thing will be built here in any capacity.

[westy73]

Originally Posted by KIWI-1

Did you stand up and be counted when you purchased your car knowing it was built with imported components?
Do you stand up and be counted when your vehicles are serviced and tell the Service Manager "I buy Australian Made" and will not have my serviced with imported Motorcraft parts?

Oh and I am a proud THIRD generation Falcon owner in case you missed it.
That's standing up and being counted thanks very much.
And the Territory I have has the AUSTRALIAN made I6 not the imported V6 diesel so there !! Standing up again. At least I stand up and don't sit on my hands.

[2011G6E]

I'll buy Australian...but only if it's cheaper and it suits the purpose I want out of it.

People aren't going to pay more for a large expensive to register (unless it's an Ecoboost) Falcon (or Commodore) if it doesn't suit what they need.
The days are long gone of people, as I said, automatically thinking they need to buy a Falcon or Commodore...there are plenty of better packaged alternatives for not only couples but families as well. Fords new TV ad's, which they have been hammering on our local channel tonight, for the Territory are great, but they should have been doing this ages ago.

There are some facts that a lot of people don't want to face:
1: Not everyone is an enthusiast...in fact looking a the big picture, hardly anyone is these days.
2: The majority of buyers couldn't care less about getting the tail out, 0-100 or quarter mile times, FWD or RWD, or horsepower...probably the only one they actually ask about is AWD, mainly because Subaru has been hammering the adverts for many years now with the safety benefits of AWD. For some years now they have cared about economy, servicing costs, and purchase price, after finding a vehicle that suits their purpose.
3: Buyers are better educated...anyone can sit down now and look over a hundred reviews on different models online, and work out what would suit them best. They won't buy purely on where something was made.
4: The majority of buyers now seem to be "badge blind"...they will go for whoever gives them the best deal on what they're after, from whatever maker, not just do what granddad did and walk into the Ford or Holden dealer every two or three years and say "Give us another Falcon/Kingswood like the last one" without even bothering to look at anything else.


Yes, there are people who will be bitterly disappointed that you won't be able to buy a Falcon anymore...but it's not the end of the world as some seem to think.

If you don't like buying "foreign rubbish", then I suggest you don't look too closely at the boxes that an awful lot of the parts and accessories (factory and aftermarket especially) for your dinki-di true-blue Aussie-Aussie-Aussie car come in...they usually say "Made in China/India/Taiwan/Korea"...

[stevz]

Originally Posted by KIWI-1

Westinghouse is part of Electrolux Group (Sweden) and whilst they still do manufacture some products in Australia, they also import from Europe, China, and South-East Asia. 24 Australian redundancies a few weeks ago too!

So if one was to play the devil's advocate, I could say that despite your best intentions, you are supporting an importer who puts profit before workers and sends those profits overseas.

That may be so, but at the end of the day the fridge was manufactured in Australia by Australian workers as opposed to a fridge that arrived in this country in a container.

[GT-spec15]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

They are losing money because they choose to build an under market and unwanted vehicle, is that too hard to understand.
They will not have the same issue if they built a desired range of vehicles here.

But they're not going to, so your comment is pointless.

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by westy73

What imported components do you refer to ?

Next time you get them serviced ask for the boxes: Brake pads, spark plugs, oil, fuel and oil filters.

[Lotte]

Originally Posted by GT-spec15

But they're not going to, so your comment is pointless.

Just as pointless you telling people they shouldn't stand up for what they believe in, because that certainly seems like what you're doing.....

[GT-spec15]

Originally Posted by lotski

Give it a break mate. People want to support the local industries, and sometimes hands are tied because not all the smaller things that make a bigger thing will be built here in any capacity.

My (missed) point was that it's not good enough to beat your chest about buying local when the reality is...the majority of what we consume went offshore many years ago.

Do what you can, but don't rant and deride those who choose to buy foreign products. It is not a crime.

[BENT_8]

Who cares about bloody fridges, this is a motoring forum, show some love for our Auto manufacturing workers FFS.

[Lotte]

Originally Posted by GT-spec15

My (missed) point was that it's not good enough to beat your chest about buying local when the reality is...the majority of what we consume went offshore many years ago.

Do what you can, but don't rant and deride those who choose to buy foreign products. It is not a crime.

Your point wasn't missed. It's just getting tedious.

[Anchor]

My god. This has gotten ridiculous... Shows what happens when "passion" takes over the brain/logic.

[GT-spec15]

Originally Posted by lotski

Just as pointless you telling people they shouldn't stand up for what they believe in, because that certainly seems like what you're doing.....

I am not telling anyone to do anything! You're welcome to stand at the Ford gates with a picket sign if you think it'll help.

I am possibly a little too realistic for some tastes on here, but that's the internet for you. You won't always like what others have to say.

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by stevz

That may be so, but at the end of the day the fridge was manufactured in Australia by Australian workers as opposed to a fridge that arrived in this country in a container.

Not doubting your sincerity or integrity... just pointing out that it's not that easy to buy genuinely Australian owned, Australian made, Australian jobs.

[Lotte]

Originally Posted by GT-spec15

I am not telling anyone to do anything! You're welcome to stand at the Ford gates with a picket sign if you think it'll help.

I am possibly a little too realistic for some tastes on here, but that's the internet for you. You won't always like what others have to say.

I didn't say you were telling anyone to do anything. I was saying you're claiming it's pointless and they shouldn't. There's a difference. Probably wasn't worded well, I've been awake too long.

[Road Games]

*EDIT*

not worth it !!!

[westy73]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Ask yourself why...

Ford don't want to build in Australia because they can make greater profit margins manufacturing in Asia.
It is all about their welfare, they don't care about us.

With this in mind, why should the good people of Australia support a company which will sack 1200 people and threaten the jobs of thousands more in supply to increase their bank balance.

If this was truly about volumes they would give us a share of some of the stuff they build in Asia.
Ford have land, buildings, a workforce and equipment in Australia, all they need to do is allow us to build something we can sell here and export in enough numbers to be viable, but the profits wont be as great as they are elsewhere, so they turn their backs on us and say its our fault for not buying a car that no longer fits the bill.

Well actually it's all about a lack of protectionism in Australian (look out here come the left wingers about to clobber me). We have been drowned out by so many imports. I doubt any other country in the world rivals our models available per capita. In fact I would like to know if these figures exist and where Australia sits on that list. I would guess well above almost all other countries. Wager anyone ??
The Government(s) are to blame pure and simple. The product isn't. It's bloody good bang for your buck and always has been.

[Lotte]

Originally Posted by westy73

Well actually it's all about a lack of protectionism in Australian (look out here come the left wingers about to clobber me). We have been drowned out by so many imports. I doubt any other country in the world rivals our models available per capita. In fact I would like to know if these figures exist and where Australia sits on that list. I would guess well above almost all other countries. Wager anyone ??
The Government(s) are to blame pure and simple. The product isn't. It's bloody good bang for your buck and always has been.

I'm gonna get clobbered by someone, I'm left, I agree with you.