Speed Limit Tolerances to be Lowered in QLD

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by flappist

Have no influence over?

In your dreams comrade......

Sept 14 we are all about to have a lot of influence as we all do at various times every 3 or 4 years.

Governments have been rolled over issues when the people have just had enough. Ask Anna Bligh or Rob Borbige what happens when you push the people too far.

The only problem is that no politician of any party is going to run on a platform of removing all speed cameras and putting in a sensible tolerance (not a stupidly big one, a sensible level like the much guessed at 10%) to allow for the fact that humans are in control of machinery with fallible and possibly inaccurate speed indicating devices.

[Trump]

Flappist, yes Bligh and Borbidge were shown the door. But did anyting change for the better when they departed?

[JC]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

....................
Our 2011 Triton dual cab is way out. According to the good Navman GPS fitted in it, a genuine 100kph is an indicated 108, and a genuine 110 is an indicated 120. That's way outside the allowance that it's supposed to have according to the ADR's, but it is at least on the slow side...and this is a factory standard vehicle with factory standard sized wheels and tyres.
.........................

Your Triton speedo is almost smack on the tolerance, as is my 380. Must be a Mitsubishi thing. 108 - 10% of 108 = 97.2, but actual is 100, so it's within the tolerance. 120 less 10% of 120 is 108, actual is 100; again this is within the tolerance, and is the right way around (ie the actual speed must not be more indicated speed)......

[cs123]

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

Flappist, yes Bligh and Borbidge were shown the door. But did anyting change for the better when they departed?

Nope, not at all. Campbell introduced tougher hoon laws recently and this latest change to police tolerance has also happened under his watch. He is a inner city bloke and has made his thoughts on these things known. The term "make no apologies" has been a feature of his discussions about being tougher on hoons.


I was listening to ABC radio yesterday and they had the police commissioner on there to speak about this. Interestingly road safety never came up. It was all about making sure people were below the speed limit no matter what. He also said don't speed and you won't get a ticket.

[TheSneakiness]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

Our 2011 Triton dual cab is way out. According to the good Navman GPS fitted in it, a genuine 100kph is an indicated 108, and a genuine 110 is an indicated 120. That's way outside the allowance that it's supposed to have according to the ADR's, but it is at least on the slow side...and this is a factory standard vehicle with factory standard sized wheels and tyres.
It does however mean that if I want to get anywhere and not hold up traffic, I sit with the needle in an area where a small variation either way would see me now fined under the new perfectly safe roads we will be driving on (because hey, if people never speed, they'll never have an accident!).

Our 2008 Paj is exactly the same with the same indicated speeds. I tell my wife this and she still likes to sit on indicated 100 (about 94km/h).

I will sit on indicated 105km/h in a 100km/h zone (roughly 99-100km/h) genuine and indicated 115-118km/h in a 110km/h zone (roughly 109-111km/h) genuine. This is also with factory sized tyres too.

[The Monty]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

Of course a kilometer or two isn't noticeable. Anyone who says otherwise is just plain lying about thier god-like abilities behind the wheel. There. I said it...

The report on the news a few minutes ago said "one kilometer over and you will be fined". Anyone who can explain how the difference between 60 and 61 or 59 and 61 is going to have any impact in any way on the severity of an accident is a better man than the rest of us.
Making the "tolerance" zero, or "one kph over" just makes the whole long-running scam come out into the light...it's not road safety, it's money raising.



Yes, the hypothetical old granny (and a lot of the rest of us) will cop fines...if they're speed cameras where it turns up weeks later, potentially a lot of fines all at once.

Best thing I ever did was put a two way in the Triton and keep a hand held in the Celica...you get plenty of warning about "snakes in the grass" by the roadside...

And theres the problem. "The report on the news". That information was not what the police have stated or even the government. Its what was stated by police and govco twisted and misenterpreted into crap by the media, and youve taken it as gospel.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by The Monty

And theres the problem. "The report on the news". That information was not what the police have stated or even the government. Its what was stated by police and govco twisted and misenterpreted into crap by the media, and youve taken it as gospel.

Anything that comes from govco these days is pretty twisted and loaded with double talk, the media wouldn't have to do much at all...

Originally Posted by cs123

Nope, not at all. Campbell introduced tougher hoon laws recently and this latest change to police tolerance has also happened under his watch. He is a inner city bloke and has made his thoughts on these things known. The term "make no apologies" has been a feature of his discussions about being tougher on hoons.


I was listening to ABC radio yesterday and they had the police commissioner on there to speak about this. Interestingly road safety never came up. It was all about making sure people were below the speed limit no matter what. He also said don't speed and you won't get a ticket.

So I'll ask, is voting actually effective in instigating real change or is it a charade desgined to give the illusion of choice and a voice?

[EVLKNEVL]

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

So I'll ask, is voting actually effective in instigating real change or is it a charade desgined to give the illusion of choice and a voice?

http://www.caradvice.com.au/231260/a...eral-election/

[martinijosh]

Already noticing more clowns on the go slow since all the media attention for this.

The commute to work just got even slower. Thanks QGov.

[Ford_The_Win]

Originally Posted by flappist

Have no influence over?

In your dreams comrade......

Sept 14 we are all about to have a lot of influence as we all do at various times every 3 or 4 years.

Governments have been rolled over issues when the people have just had enough. Ask Anna Bligh or Rob Borbige what happens when you push the people too far.

As far as I know, none of the major parties differ on their speed camera policies...

[MAD]

ADR 18/03 says the speedo must read slower than actual speed and must fall within the following tolerance...

0 ≤ (V1 – V2) ≤ 0.1 V2 + 6 km/h; (V1 - indicated, V2 - actual)

Using this formula the maximum discrepancy between indicated and actual at the required test speeds can be as much as the following.

Indicated speed - actual speed - discrepancy
40 - 30 - 10
80 - 66 - 14
120 - 102 - 18


As an example you could be driving in an 80 zone, thinking you are speeding at 85km/h, when in fact you're actually holding everybody up sitting at something more like 71km/h.



I have no idea how they think that is safe.
The flow-on affects from one slow traveler on a busy freeway are huge.

[cs123]

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

So I'll ask, is voting actually effective in instigating real change or is it a charade desgined to give the illusion of choice and a voice?

Just walking into the ballot box and making a voted based on that, NO it isn't.

What you have to do is to tell your sitting member and also other candidates your feelings on the matter. They have to know it's a deal changer for you over and above all their other policies. Then you have to get a significant amount of others to do the same.

A case in point is the recent kerfuffle over the electoral funding. People kicked up a stink and they backed down.

This won't happen with speeding tickets and the pollies know it.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by cs123

Just walking into the ballot box and making a voted based on that, NO it isn't.

What you have to do is to tell your sitting member and also other candidates your feelings on the matter. They have to know it's a deal changer for you over and above all their other policies. Then you have to get a significant amount of others to do the same.

This is the most difficult part.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Ford_The_Win

As far as I know, none of the major parties differ on their speed camera policies...

Then upset them by voting against all of them.

All major parties have only ONE policy and that is "do whatever is needed to be voted into power".

These thing really show up the wowser mentality.

It is not "lower the speed limit".
It is not "raise the penalties".
It is lower the tolarances so we can get more income from those who are only just over the magic number on the sign.

This wowser supported policy will NOT:
Stop drink drivers.
Stop unlicensed drivers.
Stop unregistered cars.
Make any difference to people driving at dangerously high speeds in inappropriate places.

The policy will:
Increase revinue from speed cameras.
Cause delays in travel times.
Increase frustration and therefore the incidence of road rage.
Reduce any remaining respect for the Police force from the vast majority of Queenslanders i.e. not the wowser brigade.
Reduce any remaing respect for the current Government from the vast majority of Queenslanders.

Remember this is the state where we completely destroyed the National Party for their backflip and failure to follow the will of the people of Queensland.

I wonder why all the experst are not showing the statistics of deaths caused by exceeding a speed limit by 5km/h.........

[Shonky.]

from the article:

Originally Posted by csv8

The state’s road toll currently stands at 138 - 16 more than at the same time last year, 28 more than in 2011 and 30 more than in 2010.

So the road toll continues to rise against a backdrop of increasing emphasis on and policing of speed limits.

Doesn't this demonstrate that the current road safety strategy (if we are to accept that this is road safety not revenue raising) is not working?

Kinda makes sense to me. You continue to provide disinformation about the causes of road fatalities then people will adjust their behaviour accordingly. The result of this education based on a flawed premise is that more people will die, not less.

[Chopped]

A caller rang the ABC radio program yesterday morning and said that the traffic fine operation is going to be privatized. Lowering tolerances will increase the revenue and make it more attractive to potential buyers. The caller said he was told this buy a friend who is a traffic cop. The QLD government want it sold by the end of the year.

Based on rumour, yes BUT sounds plausible to me.

[csv8]

Originally Posted by Chopped

A caller rang the ABC radio program yesterday morning and said that the traffic fine operation is going to be privatized. Lowering tolerances will increase the revenue and make it more attractive to potential buyers. The caller said he was told this buy a friend who is a traffic cop. The QLD government want it sold by the end of the year.

Based on rumour, yes BUT sounds plausible to me.

Can Do has mentioned that a few times....it will happen...but when ??

[Chopped]

Originally Posted by csv8

Can Do has mentioned that a few times....it will happen...but when ??

Soon from the sounds of it.

[martinijosh]

Originally Posted by MAD

ADR 18/03 says the speedo must read slower than actual speed and must fall within the following tolerance...

0 ≤ (V1 – V2) ≤ 0.1 V2 + 6 km/h; (V1 - indicated, V2 - actual)

Using this formula the maximum discrepancy between indicated and actual at the required test speeds can be as much as the following.

Indicated speed - actual speed - discrepancy
40 - 30 - 10
80 - 66 - 14
120 - 102 - 18


As an example you could be driving in an 80 zone, thinking you are speeding at 85km/h, when in fact you're actually holding everybody up sitting at something more like 71km/h.



I have no idea how they think that is safe.
The flow-on affects from one slow traveler on a busy freeway are huge.

Case in point, b series falcons are generally 105/100

WT Fiestas are 109/100

If you went on a 110 zone motorway in the fiesta at a marked 110 you'd actually be doing 100... Feels pretty unsafe to me.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by Chopped

A caller rang the ABC radio program yesterday morning and said that the traffic fine operation is going to be privatized. Lowering tolerances will increase the revenue and make it more attractive to potential buyers. The caller said he was told this buy a friend who is a traffic cop. The QLD government want it sold by the end of the year.

Based on rumour, yes BUT sounds plausible to me.

Well, Civic Compliance Victoria is run by Tenix Solutions, a private company. How they legitimised that I have no idea:

http://online.fines.vic.gov.au/fines...t.aspx?page=87

As for speedo accuracy, I just got back from Geelong and they have one of those speed checks on the Little River overpass. I had the cruise on 100km/h, it indicated 99km/h, as did my GPS (99.4km/h).

[TyLeR3397]

With all this speedo inaccuracy rubbish, does this mean a cars "0-100" is actually only 0-89?

[joolz]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

And those cases are discovered and rectified, certainly not often enough to incite a riot.

Just like the camera on Eastlink in Melbourne on the Wellington Rd overpass. One of the highest money makers in Victoria and the camera funny enough tested FINE!! Even with the media coverage about this camera and the public knowing its location it was still making lots of cash....Almost forgot to add that there has been not one death on this Tollway even with the thousands of speeding fines handed out over the years..

Honestly with all the so called data telling us every 5km/h over you risk of crashing doubles. So in the recent news of a motorbike travelling at 270km/h (160km/h over the limit) on the Hume near Benalla should have certainly died. Yet they are still trying to find this "hoon"... Inatention kills and not 10km/h over the limit..

[loony888]

Originally Posted by Ford_The_Win

And the tin hat wearing "It's all a conspiracy!!!" brigade too...don't forget those guys... full of hot air, sitting behind their computers whinging about something that they have absolutely no control or influence over... are you all going to protest and write letters to your local MPs and petition until every camera is gone? I don't think so... it's all well and good to talk the talk.

it's not tin mate, that's too expensive, it's alfoil, and it's crinkled up to scramble my thought processes just in case they're listening..........

[Outbackjack]

No-one should be surprised about this happening. As polititicians are disrespected more and more (not that they dont deserve it) we are seeing people with common traits getting elected. Anyone with any kind of intelligence would steer away from politics.

We are seeing more and more ideologically driven people heading for parliment. Ideologies are expensive and need to be paid for..... Drivers are seen as cash cows by corrupt and psychopathic low life's in government.

Federation is broken.

Now they want the constitution to recognise local councils as legitimate governments.... Imagine that!! Another layer of tax's and fines levied at random!!

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by joolz

So in the recent news of a motorbike travelling at 270km/h (160km/h over the limit) on the Hume near Benalla should have certainly died...

I'm curious to know how they SAFELY ascertained that he was doing 273kph?

[Franco Cozzo]

I don't think there is much you can do about it, its coming just like it did for Victoria.

[joolz]

Originally Posted by KIWI-1

I'm curious to know how they SAFELY ascertained that he was doing 273kph?

I guess it was a radar. If it was helicopter he would have been followed. They said the chase was cancelled. More like by the time they pulled out for a chase the bike was gone!!.
I dont condone that sort of speeding but 10-15km/h over on a dual lane Hwy is not going to kill you or others. Flame suit on for the do gooders...But maybe the limits on perfecty good Hwys are set too low and could handle at least 130km/h.

[Falcon SXR8]

When you really think about our roads I mean we have cars going 100kmh towards each other with only half a metre between them our road toll is pretty good.

[joolz]

Originally Posted by Falcon SXR8

When you really think about our roads I mean we have cars going 100kmh towards each other with only half a metre between them our road toll is pretty good.

Yet in Victoria they have fixed cameras on dual hwy's (Hume bypass from Western Ring rd and 30 k,s onwards). But in the bush on 1.25 lane dirt roads with wash outs, corrigations and pot holes you can also legally drive at 100km/h. The locals dont seem to have head ons and die. Same speed limit but completely different road conditions.

[MAD]

Originally Posted by joolz

Yet in Victoria they have fixed cameras on dual hwy's (Hume bypass from Western Ring rd and 30 k,s onwards). But in the bush on 1.25 lane dirt roads with wash outs, corrigations and pot holes you can also legally drive at 100km/h. The locals dont seem to have head ons and die. Same speed limit but completely different road conditions.

Statistics is what make it safe or not. The more people, the more chance of crash.
Nothing to do with actual safety.