Covid 19 -

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by T3rminator

It's funny how some people thought the SOE gave politicians unlimited powers to do what they wanted. Where in actual fact it transferred powers to a chief health officer

I must admit, this pandemic has given me a crash course on how our political and health system works. A lot of it has come from putting up topics like these for discussions on forums.

Read and understand what I stated, I never said politicians have unlimited powers, never said CHO does not have powers in SOE.
Government legislation sets the terms & powers of CHO, I merely stated the CHO assists government ministers in carrying out the SOE.
Maybe I should have worded my previous comment better.

[T3rminator]

Originally Posted by Itsme

Read and understand what I stated, I never said politicians have unlimited powers, never said CHO does not have powers in SOE.
Government legislation sets the terms & powers of CHO, I merely stated the CHO assists government ministers in carrying out the SOE.
Maybe I should have worded my previous comment better.

That wasn't directed at your comment actually. Was just remembering all the noise regarding SOE extensions, and how some people thought it was gov over reach etc etc.

[slowsnake]

Watched on TV last night, maybe SBS, a bunch of medics at a US Military Base, soldiers all lined up for their vaccine injections?
I would of thought all the world's armed forces, in particular the close quarters of naval personnel would of all been vaccinated as a priority?


Cheers Billy

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by T3rminator

It's funny how some people thought the SOE gave politicians unlimited powers to do what they wanted. Where in actual fact it transferred powers to a chief health officer

I must admit, this pandemic has given me a crash course on how our political and health system works. A lot of it has come from putting up topics like these for discussions on forums.

it has certainly pushed how our political system really works to the forefront. My adult kids had no idea until COVID

[T3rminator]

Very rarely does a parliament speech capture the attention of both sides.
Regardless of what political spectrum you align with, well worth a watch....

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by Trevor 57

it has certainly pushed how our political system really works to the forefront. My adult kids had no idea until COVID

Once the dust settle we need to reignite the republic and stop with the interstate differences.

Sure it has its advantage but for the most part it is incredibly inefficient.

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Once the dust settle we need to reignite the republic and stop with the interstate differences.

Sure it has its advantage but for the most part it is incredibly inefficient.

The COVID situation has reaffirmed my view that Australia has one too many levels of government. My view is that we could, and should, do away with State governments, leaving us with just one Federal government and local governments.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Once the dust settle we need to reignite the republic and stop with the interstate differences.

Sure it has its advantage but for the most part it is incredibly inefficient.

No bloody way, I don't want Scomo or any of his NSW cohorts having any say in the health and welfare of my state, I'll stick with Marshall and Co. thanks.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

No bloody way, I don't want Scomo or any of his NSW cohorts having any say in the health and welfare of my state, I'll stick with Marshall and Co. thanks.

Again we need to keep sight of the bigger picture not just ourselves.

Heard Dubbo is now joining Tamworth in a lock down.

Im still confused (and don't want to really google) how covid can be picked up in poop samples? Tough bugger it is.

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Heard Dubbo is now joining Tamworth in a lock down.

Yep. And Melbourne lockdown extended by another 7 days.

[Citroënbender]

Originally Posted by Polyal

…Im still confused (and don't want to really google) how covid can be picked up in poop samples?

That’s Caromavirus.

[russellw]

Data valid as at 00:00 GMT August 10th 2021.

Note: As not all Australian States report at the same time, the data below is based on the previous full day reporting.

383 new cases for Australia and 3 deaths so the CMR is 2.548%. NSW set another daily case high with 360 cases.

12 new cases and no deaths for NZ so CMR is 0.896%.

The UK had a lower 23,827 cases yesterday and higher 146 deaths for a CMR of 2.133%.

A lower 113,482 new cases in the USA yesterday and higher 532 deaths sees CMR at 1.723%. Florida recorded another new daily record with 28,317.

Other notable points:
North America passes 44M cases;
India passes 32M cases;

Martinique (2,446) - weekly reporting; and
Georgia (5,697) - the previous high on 5/12/20

... recorded new highs; those in blue for the second consecutive day and those in red for a third or more consecutive day.

Norway moves above the 90th percentile for the 10 day period and Angola drops below.

[Metdevil]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ple-vaccinated

tl;dr - Choose not to get the vaccine, pay for your own damn tests...

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

No bloody way, I don't want Scomo or any of his NSW cohorts having any say in the health and welfare of my state, I'll stick with Marshall and Co. thanks.

Don't alarm yourself, no State will ever give up its sovereign right to govern and no way a Federal government can take away state powers.
People are dreamers if they think this can happen.

[cs123]

Originally Posted by Itsme

Don't alarm yourself, no State will ever give up its sovereign right to govern and no way a Federal government can take away state powers.
People are dreamers if they think this can happen.

I always wonder if people understand the Federation when they say we should do away with the states.

It would require the states to say we don't want to exist any more

[.:4:.]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Im still confused (and don't want to really google) how covid can be picked up in poop samples? Tough bugger it is.

Im the same, dont really want to know how or why some people choose to go in to the business of monitoring waste. But it sort of has to a degree given to a loose degree of general areas where theres higher cases, and also, to a degree has also indicated other factors like areas with higher illicit drug use.
Sounds like an pretty not for most line of reasearch and a crappy job taking samples.

[russellw]

We are going to see more measures like the German ones from other countries including, at some point, our own.

I'm not averse to those measures once we have reached the point at which everyone who chooses to be vaccinated (wants might be too strong a word) has been given the opportunity to do so but at the current rate I can't see that percentage of people being fully vaccinated before the end of this year.

[T3rminator]

Originally Posted by Itsme

Don't alarm yourself, no State will ever give up its sovereign right to govern and no way a Federal government can take away state powers.
People are dreamers if they think this can happen.

I've always thought it was a bit inappropriate that some premiers would refer to their residents as "citizens of *state*". But now I kinda get the meaning.

However, I don't think it really matters what system we have in place. If/When someone in power goes rogue, it'll all turn into a pile of heap.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by cs123

I always wonder if people understand the Federation when they say we should do away with the states.

It would require the states to say we don't want to exist any more

Perhaps, but the current system with the apparent lack of power from the Feds when it counts seems to be a hinderance.

[cs123]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Perhaps, but the current system with the apparent lack of power from the Feds when it counts seems to be a hinderance.

I think the Feds have too much power to be honest.

IMO it would have been a disaster if the Feds called all the shots during this pandemic.

[hayseed]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Perhaps, but the current system with the apparent lack of power from the Feds when it counts seems to be a hinderance.

I think it's more a case of a Distinct lack of Leadership at the Federal level. (from Both Sides of the House) being the Current Problem..Causing the States to pick up the Slack..

[russellw]

In terms of countries that are still having issues we have some new ones to add plus a few that have been in strife for awhile.

Asia
Pakistan is just over the 90th percentile (4,525) with a 10DA of 4,569;
Philippines is over the 90th percentile (7,450) with a 10DA of 8,802;
Iraq is well over the 90th percentile (7,300) with a 10DA of 10,569;
Sri Lanka is over the 90th percentile (2,232) with a 10DA of 2,602;
South Korea is well over the 90th percentile (950) with a 10DA of 1,564;
Uzbekistan is well over the 90th percentile (590) with a 10DA of 906;
Bangladesh is well over the 90th percentile (6,214) with a 10DA of 12,683;
Georgia is well over the 90th percentile (2,775) with a 10DA of 3,631 including a new record high;
Iran is almost 2x the 90th percentile (19,486) with a 10DA of 36,786 including five days with new records;
Indonesia is more than 2x the 90th percentile (14,224) with a 10DA of 30,916;
Myanmar is more than 2x the 90th percentile (1,509) with a 10DA of 3,838 but it has been improving;
Japan is well over 2x the 90th percentile (5,098) with a 10DA of 13,015 including three days with new records;
Kazakhstan is well over 2x the 90th percentile (2,716) with a 10DA of 7,654 including two days with new records;
Malaysia is almost 3x the 90th percentile (6,824) with a 10DA of 18,650 including three days with new records;
Thailand is almost 5x the 90th percentile (4,059) with a 10DA of 20,071 including five days with new records; and (worst of all)
Vietnam is more than 20x worse than the 90th percentile (368) with a 10DA of 8,245 including three days that set new records.

Europe
Finland is over the 90th percentile (511) with a 10DA of 664; and
Ireland is over the 90th percentile (1,260) with a 10DA of 1,441.

Africa
Algeria is over the 90th percentile (843) with a 10DA of 1,195;
Kenya is over the 90th percentile (981) with a 10DA of 1,054;
Tunisia is over the 90th percentile (2,588) with a 10DA of 2,673;
Mozambique is over the 90th percentile (871) with a 10DA of 1,231;
Zimbabwe is over the 90th percentile (775) with a 10DA of 840;
Mauritania is well over the 90th percentile (164) with a 10DA of 303;
Libya is almost 2x 90th percentile (1,059) with a 10DA of 2,070;
Senegal is more than 2x the 90th percentile (297) with a 10DA of 605; and
Morocco is more than 2x the 90th percentile (3,944) with a 10DA of 8,757 including two days that set new records.

North America
Honduras is just over the 90th percentile (1,104) with a 10DA of 1,192;
Mexico is over the 90th percentile (12,081) with a 10DA of 14,889;
Guatemala is well over the 90th percentile (1,596) with a 10DA of 2,589; and
Cuba is more than 5x the 90th percentile (1,489) with a 10DA of 9,051 including two days with new records.

No South American countries have a 10DA over their 90th percentile.

Other countries that are starting to have issues include:
Germany: the 10DA has increased to 2,652 from 569 in early July;
Greece: the 10DA has increased to 2,712 from 356 in late June;
France: the 10DA has increased to 21,249 from 3,299 in early July;
Italy: the 10DA has increased to 5,675 from 742 in late June; and
Spain: the 10DA has increased to 17,776 from 3,520 in late June.

[XR Martin]

Originally Posted by T3rminator

I've always thought it was a bit inappropriate that some premiers would refer to their residents as "citizens of *state*". But now I kinda get the meaning.

However, I don't think it really matters what system we have in place. If/When someone in power goes rogue, it'll all turn into a pile of heap.

I remember Palaszczuk saying at the start of the pandemic that "QLD hospitals are for QLDers"
Umm what?

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

Originally Posted by cs123

I think the Feds have too much power to be honest.

IMO it would have been a disaster if the Feds called all the shots during this pandemic.

Absolutely agree, cs123, but that is a reflection of the respective incumbents rather than the structure of the Australian governmental system.

Imagine if ScMo and the federal liberal party was the sitting government of a(ny) state and one of the current state governments was in the federal seat. Then your opinion might be the opposite.

[T3rminator]

With talks of potentially giving Feds more power, well, it sounds good in theory. After the last pandemic, that is exactly what happened? The contitution was updated to give the Feds the powers to take ownership of critical response features, such as quaratining. So why didn't it happen?

Remember the first lot of returning citizens? They were quarantined offshore, then brought back onshore. Done by the feds as was their right. What happened after that?

It doesn't really matter what power you give someone, if they don't have the capacity to do it (or don't want to do it), then someone else will have to pick up the pieces....otherwise called "delegation".

[shedcoupe]

Regardless of who’s got the power to do what, the minimum requirement is the will of all parties is to make sure that the ‘what’s’ get done.
And not the sitting on hands and looking away that seems to occur all too often.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0

Absolutely agree, cs123, but that is a reflection of the respective incumbents rather than the structure of the Australian governmental system.

Imagine if ScMo and the federal liberal party was the sitting government of a(ny) state and one of the current state governments was in the federal seat. Then your opinion might be the opposite.

Lets all be honest, there are not to many shining lights but honestly I think the system turns educated people into idiots because they have to pander to the lowest common (seems too common) denominator.

Anyway I have probably dragged this OT enough, currently my LGA is literally surrounded by locked down LGA's...how this is OK is a bit odd. But luckily I am "essential" and therefore impervious to covid and any general lockdown so meh.

Carry on.

[cs123]

Originally Posted by FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0

Absolutely agree, cs123, but that is a reflection of the respective incumbents rather than the structure of the Australian governmental system.

Imagine if ScMo and the federal liberal party was the sitting government of a(ny) state and one of the current state governments was in the federal seat. Then your opinion might be the opposite.

That is true.

But I am a fan of competitive federalism. I like that each state has done its own thing. With this pandemic and other aspects of government. It lets each state have it's own approach to governing and you can see what does and doesn't work.

We have had that with the approach to this pandemic. Some states started poorly and were ill equipped, and their responses have evolved. Some states started well and haven't finished too good.

It has helped the whole of Australia learn from what is happening.

Even criticism of states closing borders quickly and locking down. Its their response based on their capabilities... which is fine by me

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Again we need to keep sight of the bigger picture not just ourselves.

1/3 of the population live in Sydney, who do you think would dominate the vote, we'd just become a bigger version of NSW with the likes of Gladys at the helm.
No thanks.

[T3rminator]

One of the top brass at work today mentioned that some sort of legislative change was put through a couple of days ago regarding whether private companies can query or mandate vaccination? Anyhow, this afternoon, said person started to gauge whether employees would mind to a) disclose whether they have been vaccinated b) work with someone who has not been vaccinated.

My response was No and No, provided that vulnerable employees, who can't be vaccinated for medical reasons, were allowed to work from home if they choose to.

Anyhow, I'm getting a feeling that they will go down the check and mandate route, including for visitors, purely because they are concerned that by not doing so, it would open them up to OH&S issues. Does this fall under the company's duty of care to ensure they have a safe working environment for employees?

This is a topic that all companies are going to have to deal with sooner or later.

And yes, we have had deaths of employees that caught covid at our north american offices during the initial outbreak, so the risk tolerance is pretty low.