Government insider reckons Ford's local ops are gone in 2016

[ryeman]

There is a 3D world of manufacturing just round the corner it seems

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Jason[98.EL]

ford U.S have posted this on facebook if ford au have these then design time would be cut by years so could be one of the reasons we have no word on the future of pruduction here as yet

A lot of this sort of stuff is designed here but building the actual tooling or prototype part is farmed out. But yeah it can drastically cut development times. The other thing FoA now has is virtual build technology - the only other places in Ford that have this is Dearborn and Cologne.

[jpd80]

Development of the current taurus was cut by 12 month thanks to virtual build technology, a whole car designed and delivered in three years.
So evolving and reliability checks on next falcon can probably be done in two years, so why would Ford need to announce anything beyond that..

To me, Holden's plans mapping out production in Australia for the next ten years is more about Holden convincing itself than anything else..
How on earth can you solidly commit that far in front without needing to revise plans in the future is beyond me, it's just media spin.

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Development of the current taurus was cut by 12 month thanks to virtual build technology, a whole car designed and delivered in three years.
So evolving and reliability checks on next falcon can probably be done in two years, so why would Ford need to announce anything beyond that..

That is all very nice, but it took Ford Australia 2 years to just put an engine that already existed (EB4) into a car that already existed (FG Falcon)... And you want them to design a whole thing in 2 years. Good luck with that!!

[turbodewd]

Originally Posted by jpd80

The whole point of governments buying and selling new cars at 2 years/40,000 km is so that we, the tax payers are not out of pocket.
The discount that government fleets receive is almost equivalent to the price the cars are sold for two years later at auction.

So holding onto vehicles for an extra year means 1) less sales to local production and 2) a short fall at sale time.
Neither of those two outcomes advantage anyof the stakeholders in the change you propose..


What Ford should be doing is assembling 1.6 Ecoboost and hybrid Fusions here in Australia
do a Toyota and start building vehicles that people and govcos will want to buy..

Mate, the fckin ACT government doesnt even buy Australian in the first place! Ive seen enuff Hyundais n Klugers about to make me sick. Its ridiculous.

I rather see them buy a Falcon and hold it for 3 yrs than a Corolla and hold it for 2. We're just lining the pockets of foreign firms and ruining our balance of trade.

[stevz]

Originally Posted by turbodewd

Mate, the fckin ACT government doesnt even buy Australian in the first place! Ive seen enuff Hyundais n Klugers about to make me sick. Its ridiculous.

I rather see them buy a Falcon and hold it for 3 yrs than a Corolla and hold it for 2. We're just lining the pockets of foreign firms and ruining our balance of trade.

I think its about time a name and shame campaign was started to expose government departments, fleets, companies and even individuals who purchase foreign vehicles. Make them feel guilty for sending our money overseas and supporting foreign industries whilst spitting in the face of the Australian worker and economy in general.
Perhaps even start a campaign to boycott the products and services of companies who buy foreign vehicles. I know I already do.
Something like this really needs to be done.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by stevz

I think its about time a name and shame campaign was started to expose government departments, fleets, companies and even individuals who purchase foreign vehicles. Make them feel guilty for sending our money overseas and supporting foreign industries whilst spitting in the face of the Australian worker and economy in general.
Perhaps even start a campaign to boycott the products and services of companies who buy foreign vehicles. I know I already do.
Something like this really needs to be done.

These government buyers have a duty to keep their budgets under control from ministers eager to prune them further.
If you want to blame someone, blame the people who always whinge that the government wastes money on cars for itself..

[Bossxr8]

I read in yesterdays Herald Sun that a government energy agency was exposed for ordering 40 RAV4's, which were all roughly the same price as the Territory. After they were exposed and embarrased the order was cancelled.


The article re-iterated that all government agencies are to order Australian made vehicles as first choice, so why the hell they even bypassed this regulation and ordered a foreign made SUV is beyond me. What a joke. This regulation needs to be more tightly enforced. There is nothing a RAV4 can do that a Territory can't.

Hopefully the order of 40 cars now goes to Ford, like it should have been in the first place.

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

I read in yesterdays Herald Sun that a government energy agency was exposed for ordering 40 RAV4's, which were all roughly the same price as the Territory. After they were exposed and embarrased the order was cancelled.


The article re-iterated that all government agencies are to order Australian made vehicles as first choice, so why the hell they even bypassed this regulation and ordered a foreign made SUV is beyond me. What a joke. This regulation needs to be more tightly enforced. There is nothing a RAV4 can do that a Territory can't.

Hopefully the order of 40 cars now goes to Ford, like it should have been in the first place.

Hi BossXR8, pretty pathetic reasons for picking the Rav4, and someone might want to tell them that the Rav4 they have ordered no longer has the wheel on the rear door.

If clearance we really an issue, then order a Commodore with country pack or buy the Ford Territory. The fact is that these orders are made by beuracrats who have the same prejudices and biases than anyone else buying a car.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/vic...-1226607454499

STRUGGLING car industry workers have been slapped in the face by a State Government department's decision to buy a fleet of imported cars, a union says.

Energy Safe Victoria, a watchdog that monitors the state's supply of gas and electricity, ordered 40 new Japanese-made Toyota RAV4s to replace its fleet of Australian-made Holden Commodores.

The cost of the order, which was to start being delivered this week, was up to $1.5 million.

There were major job cuts at Ford, Toyota and Holden last year as sales of imported cars soared because the high Australian dollar made them cheaper.

The purchase has embarrassed the State Government, which last year trumpeted that 98 per cent of its fleet was Australian-made.

But it is believed the order will be cancelled after the Herald Sun contacted the State Government yesterday to raise the issue.


Australian Workers Union state secretary Cesar Melhem said the Government was giving workers "a kicking'' with the RAV4 order.


Energy Safe should have bought the Broadmeadows-built Ford Territory, a union official says.

He said there was no reason to replace the Commodores, which are built at factories in Victoria and South Australia.

"I'm at a loss, it doesn't make sense - the RAV4 is no different to a sedan," he said. "This is a waste of taxpayers' money and a slap in the face to workers in the manufacturing industry.

"It's really shameful. The Premier should reverse this decision immediately."

Mr Melhem said Energy Safe should have bought the Broadmeadows-built Ford Territory if it wanted a four-wheel drive.

Toyota RAV4s sell for $37,990, while Australian-made Ford Territory sells for $39,990, according to carsales.com.au.

An email from Energy Safe Victoria director Paul Fearon, obtained by the Herald Sun, confirmed the switch to RAV4s.

"The operational vehicle pool will be made up of a fleet of Toyota RAV4s," he wrote.

"This vehicle has storage capacity that exceeds that of the Commodore wagon and sedan, locates the spare wheel on the outside offering improved access, and its clearance is greater than the bulk of the current vehicles in our fleet, which should offer improved access to challenging work sites."

Llewellyn Rees, an organiser for the Association of Professional Engineers, Scientists and Managers, Australia, said the Government should "wake up, get on the phone and remind Energy Safe Victoria that local jobs are important to our economy".

Energy Safe Victoria spokeswoman Sharon Rainsbury said the body did not have to follow Victorian Government purchasing guidelines.

State Government spokesman Paul Price said: "Following discussions with Energy Safe Victoria, it was agreed the authority will review its vehicle purchasing policy and its plan for specialist fit-for-purpose imported vehicles."

[Bossxr8]

Cheers Brazen, that's the story I was referring too. What a discrace.

Will be interesting to see what they end up ordering now that the RAV4 order has been cancelled.

And the fact the new RAV4 doesn't even have a spare on the rear door anymore

[Gothefalcon]

Some things to consider....

Ford US says it wants to move to it's "1 Ford" strategy.... meaning it want's to be more like the "Toyota's" of this world, and make the same models to be sold all around the world !

The last couple of times popular manufacturers closed down operations in this country... there was a huge backlash from the buying public ! Both Nissan & Mitsubishi sales dived to near bottom.... taking them years to woo the buying public back !

Ford US have been trying to shut Ford AUS down since the 70's... but due to the popularity of the local product, the ingenuity of the local engineers (etc) and the clever business cases put by succesive local senior managements... Ford Aus and the Falcon have survived (for now at least)

in the late 90's/early 2000's Ford US forced Ford Aus to take it's " Falcon alternative" (the Taurus), when the Falcon's sales were still fairly high ! Ford Aus didn't want it.. but Ford US made Ford Aus sell it alongside the Falcon in a "may the best car win" sort of deal ! Taurus lost (for lots of reasons) and Falcon survived... But then Ford US reduced it's funding to Ford AUS yet again !

Engineering wise, the current Falcon is a great car... but by Ford US not giving Ford AUS the resources it needs to "go the extra mile" and spend some money to make the car more "exciting" to the buying public (with more bling, electronic wiz features and differientation between models)... it is allowing the same people to decide that Falcon is "not for me". Couple this with all but zero advertising to tell people just how good this car is (ie: turbo 4cyl Falcon anyone!??) then it becomes fairly obvious (to me) that Ford US want's us to tell them "we don't want Falcon anymore"... so they can then slip in some "1 Ford" alternatives, that the buying public will "now" accept as an alternative to "the car we no longer want" !

The Aussy dollar being so high, doesn't make setting up the Factory for an "All New" vehicle a very viable proposition at the moment... so they'll keep Falcon going whilst Ford Aus is breaking even (in the long run) until such time as our dollar drops in value (which it will... when the rest of the world recovers from the GFC) When this happens... Ford US wont be able to import their "1 Ford" models cheaper than Ford Aus can build them here... so they will then announce the "All New" car and... that it will be built here !!!

The buying public will think that this is all great news... the Govt. will encourage us to get behind it (especially the Vic Govt.) and Ford Aus' advertising budget will be flush with funds again !!

Will the "Falcon nameplate survive???... we can only look to Holden and (to some extent) Nissan !?? The latest Commodore was annonced buy the press as "the last Commodore!" Coincidentally (?)... Commodore sales started to slide fairly dramatically.... then the Boss of Holden came out to tell us all that "Commodore will continue to be built beyond this current model" (though... perhaps not as we know it now)... And since Nissan stopped producing vehicles in this Country... it has struggled to get Aussies excited about it's smalll cars... (even though they weren't made here before)... but it has just revived it's once popular "Pulsar" name-plate... in a bid to win back that market segment ! It goes against the "1 Ford" strategy to rename, say, the Taurus as "Falcon"... as Ford US want's the same car to be recognised as what it is, where ever it is sold.... but.... you can't ignore the facts that the last Taurus here was a flop (rightly so)... and, despite declining sales, the Falcon name-plate (here in Aus) has a legacy few vehicle can boast ! But then again... even though "Falcon" has outlived the "Holden" & "Kingswood"... and put up a great fight to "Commodore... GMH is still here... So Ford AUS would probably survive if "Falcon" doesn't !!?? As a Blue blooded Falcon Bloke... I wouldn't want to see that... but I'd rather see Ford Aus continue in this country... and who knows.. maybe history will repeat itself !!?? The Falcon was a US model, made here, once (a while ago ! )

Conspiracy theory ??? Maybe... Complete fact ??? Can't prove any of it.... Will time prove me right??? We'll have to wait and see !!

Dhru

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

I read in yesterdays Herald Sun that a government energy agency was exposed for ordering 40 RAV4's, which were all roughly the same price as the Territory. After they were exposed and embarrased the order was cancelled.


The article re-iterated that all government agencies are to order Australian made vehicles as first choice, so why the hell they even bypassed this regulation and ordered a foreign made SUV is beyond me. What a joke. This regulation needs to be more tightly enforced. There is nothing a RAV4 can do that a Territory can't.

Hopefully the order of 40 cars now goes to Ford, like it should have been in the first place.

FFS talk about outrageous. And we have a RAV4 in our fleet at work, its an awful car. More road noise in the cabin at 60km/h than a motorbike.

Lets face it, the actual cost difference to the state by buying local instead of imported (assuming the locals are dearer), would be pretty insignificant in the overall scheme of things (ie the state budget) and the extra cost can be justified simply because it is in the public interest to support local produce that keeps people employed - something very dear to a government's heart (i.e. votes) I would think?

[Brazen]

Minor government fleet changes around the country could net thousands of extra Falcon and Territory sales a year.

How about an old tender asking for 135 Toyota Klugers for Defence Dept? Disgraceful.
http://tenders.free-press-release.co...m-qty-135.html

[XR Martin]

Fact is Toyota is ruthless with their fleet pricing, Ford and Holden just arnt willing or able to compete.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Gothefalcon

Stuff about One Ford

'One Ford' phraseology is bandied around quite a bit by people but it is not generally well understood.

It is a strategic plan that was devised to eliminate product, part, supplier and development duplication. Primarily, the Americas and Europe. A classic example being the US market Ford Focus and the European market Focus. The two cars were almost completely different, but did the same job. Looked at in isolation, I'm sure it seemed like a good idea at the time, but when you looked at them in the totality of what the company does, someone went "wait, what?" and made the common sense decision to make two cars from one to compete in the same segment in two different markets.

A little ****ant car making operation down in Oceana doesnt really factor into the decision making process of One Ford when you consider the vehicle and part volumes, the turnover and the wastage of Ford's old ways in the US and Europe. Ford Australia does, however, have the opportunity to tap into the economies of scale that One Ford has created (like the corporate 6 speed auto, EPAS in the SZ Territory for starters) to cut development times and costs on its own vehicles. Ford (Dearborn that is) recognises that they can't just "replace" Ford Australia's local cars with something else they make elsewhere, because they don't have anything else they can replace them with; the product differences are too great to apply the One Ford approach, which is Ford's big conundrum. How they resolve this conundrum...well, that's what we're all waiting to find out.