Bali 9

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by GasOLane

I don't think Indonesia is biased in Executions, and as far as 'sticking it up Australia' goes there have been 12 executions there this year from other countries, all for Drug Trafficking.

Netherlands 1
Brazil 2
Indonesia 2
Nigeria 5
Vietnam 1
Malawi 1

How many of those had Sukoi Fighter Escorts, how many had 20 paramilitaries "Escorting" each of them to death island.

Rubbish this is payback for ' the boats', ' phone tapping', and "East Timor".

[Spinner77]

Bulls-eye, Barraxr8. East Timor in particular was a humiliation for them. They can't show open contempt for the US, which was the key, so we will do.

Which raises the point, at some time in the future, about whether an Indonesia is in our interests. Or would a dozen little Indonesias be better?

Indonesia is just what the Dutch once owned. It is not a nation. Is there anything more absurd than West New Guineans being Indonesian?

Indonesia is something like what the old Soviet Union was. That was broken into I think about 12 countries. The Russians were top dog there. The Javanese are the top dogs in Indonesia.

Could be a message there, some day.

[blue sleeper]

Originally Posted by damo76

I haven't been on here much lately because i bought a jeep but in regards to these people who have been executed, they are someone's sons. Sad really because i would think executions should have been phased out 100 years ago.

I didn't know Jeep's infamous unreliability extended to the internet too, now that's impressive!

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by vztrt

If they were caught here you would have never heard another word about these people.

Exactly and these guys would be back into the business of importing drugs into Australia in no time

Originally Posted by GasOLane

I don't think Indonesia is biased in Executions, and as far as 'sticking it up Australia' goes there have been 12 executions there this year from other countries, all for Drug Trafficking.

Netherlands 1
Brazil 2
Indonesia 2
Nigeria 5
Vietnam 1
Malawi 1

I love the conspiracy theorists and tin foil hat brigade, I think people over estimate the importance of Australia and how much they (Indonesia) care about us.

They have executed two Australians that were sentenced to death back in 2006, they listened to all the appeals and went through all the processes, then finally after all avenues were exhausted the original sentence passed in 2006 was finally carried out. Indonesia have already executed 13 other persons this year, with plenty more to go, yet some tin foil hat wearers somehow think that they (Indonesia) are sticking it up Australia, when all they are doing is enforcing the law of the land.

Which part of 'the death penalty applies for drug smugglers in Indonesia' don't people understand, no need to make more out of it than what it is, it's the law over there, get over it, it's not a law they implemented for Australians, there are plenty of other countries, some more developed than us, that still have a death penalty.

[iCat]

I just heard this avo on 3aw that some secondary school is naming a couple of scholarships after these two. You have to be kidding me?

[Ruination]

Everyone is burning their bintang singlets in protest.
Next week they will all be looking for the cheapest flights to Bali.

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by iCat

I just heard this avo on 3aw that some secondary school is naming a couple of scholarships after these two. You have to be kidding me?

I seriously hope that was just a sick joke, imagine a scholarship named after a major drug dealer, lets start naming our public buildings after rapists and murderers

[BENT_8]

To clarify my position, i dont condone what they did, nor do i excuse their ignorance of Indonesian law.
Hell, im not even against the death penalty in certain situations.

But were talking about a country that views drug exportation as a greater crime than terrorism and mass murder.

And when you think that over the last 15 years Australia has done so much to help Indonesia when they have faced tragedies.
They have no conscience.

Im not saying they should have walked free, they broke the law, but to execute 2 blokes who by all accounts had turned their lives around, who had worked hard to help others.
Some have said that every inmate finds God if it helps him out, and in some cases im sure that is true, but if being faced with a firing squad wasnt enough for these 2 to take it serious and actually make amends, then there is no hope for anyone to be rehabilitated.
To suggest that is to believe no one can change their ways, we might as well do away with prisons and shoot the lot.
Except the terrorists obviously, cut their sentence in half for a job well done.

But in reality nothing will come of this, Australia has a knack for sweeping things under the carpet.
A few months ago that bloke shot up the Lindt Cafe, sure we were all offended but within a week we dismissed terrorism, declared him a 'lone wolf' and moved on.
An islamic dude, claiming to have a bomb in his backpack, creates a hostage situation whilst displaying a flag associated with extremists and then kills 2 innocent people, but its not terrorism.
Not in Austraya.

Australians are weak as ****, too scared to offend anyone.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

I love the conspiracy theorists and tin foil hat brigade.

So anyone who shares a different opinion to yours is a conspiracy theorist or tin foil hat wearer, i assume that makes you the truther in the saga.

Were all crazy because you are right.

Nice...

[Charliewool]

This entire stuff-up began with the public outpouring of sympathy when Shappelle was busted...
Our Govco decided that she just HAD to come home at all costs..
The general populace were screaming blue murder about the poor girls wrongful arrest/setup... This sweet, attractive, innocent young lady!

A certain Mick Keelty advised our Govco that he could "do a deal" with the Indos to get Shappelle home if he gave them some "live ones"... 9 of em in fact!
All leaving Aussie to go to Indo and bringing some "real stuff" back here...
"We'll fill you guys in when they're arriving, let em "load up" and they're all yours"

Anyone doubting this.... Do tell WHY our AFP let those 9 depart Australia???

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

To clarify my position, i dont condone what they did, nor do i excuse their ignorance of Indonesian law.
Hell, im not even against the death penalty in certain situations.

But were talking about a country that views drug exportation as a greater crime than terrorism and mass murder.

And when you think that over the last 15 years Australia has done so much to help Indonesia when they have faced tragedies.
They have no conscience.

Im not saying they should have walked free, they broke the law, but to execute 2 blokes who by all accounts had turned their lives around, who had worked hard to help others.
Some have said that every inmate finds God if it helps him out, and in some cases im sure that is true, but if being faced with a firing squad wasnt enough for these 2 to take it serious and actually make amends, then there is no hope for anyone to be rehabilitated.
To suggest that is to believe no one can change their ways, we might as well do away with prisons and shoot the lot.
Except the terrorists obviously, cut their sentence in half for a job well done.

But in reality nothing will come of this, Australia has a knack for sweeping things under the carpet.
A few months ago that bloke shot up the Lindt Cafe, sure we were all offended but within a week we dismissed terrorism, declared him a 'lone wolf' and moved on.
An islamic dude, claiming to have a bomb in his backpack, creates a hostage situation whilst displaying a flag associated with extremists and then kills 2 innocent people, but its not terrorism.
Not in Austraya.

Australians are weak as ****, too scared to offend anyone.

I 100% agree with most of this!!

There possibly is no consistency in their sentencing, but unfortunately our legal system is the same in that regard, except obviously we do not have a death penalty.

I also believe your last sentence is 100% spot on, and I think Australia needs to toughen up before we get over run.

Personally I do not believe in the death penalty myself, but I also believe in not interfering with other countries legal system and believes. Imagine if another country came here and tried to intimidate us into executing someone, just because it was done so in their country??

Even though I don't agree in the death penalty, in this case it is out of our hands and has nothing to do with us, and we should not be placing sanctions on other countries just because we don't agree with their rules and laws.

[Falcman0o7]

How many familys would have been destroyed had they made it here with that crap.



I'm pretty sure they could read...

[Charliewool]

Originally Posted by Falcman0o7

How many familys would have been destroyed had they made it here with that crap.

image

I'm pretty sure they could read...

It was NEVER going to hit the street here...
The AFP KNEW all about it... They set the 9 up!
Their little deal backfired when the Indos reneged on letting Shappelle go

[Stefan]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Let me get this straight, an Indonesian chap kills 20 people, 4 of them Aussies and he is released mid last year with his sentence halved due to his good behaviour, yet 2 Australian drug smugglers, attempting to remove drugs from Indonesia are executed by firing squad despite obvious efforts to be rehabilitated.
Now i suppose you'll say drugs are a real problem in Indonesia and an example needed to be made.
Thats fine, but looking back over the last 15 years Terrorism has also been a real problem, so problematic that we direct millions of dollars in aid to help prevent radical Islam from taking over and so problematic that it has led to the loss of many lives including Aussies, yet somehow returning a terrorist to society is ok because Indonesia says so.

Does no one see the irony.

UMM 3 Bali bombers were executed! WTF are you on about dude?

[Bucknaked]

Originally Posted by Syndrome

How many people remember the execution of Barlow and Chambers? Not many I suspect. And this issue will also blow over given enough time.

When ever I hear of Aussies getting caught for smuggling drugs in Asia, I always remember those 2. I'll remember these 2 now.

[Bearman]

There is no place in civilized society for the death penalty.

Those 2 guys could have stayed locked up for the rest of their lives for all I care but not executed. At least in prison they were actually doing some good and giving some sort of meaning in theirs and others lives. Now they're gone.

What really gets me is the way the Indonesians behaved:
- The disgraceful way they treated the families concerned.
- Dismissing the clemency pleas out of hand, not giving it due consideration.
- letting them hang around for nearly 10 years after sentence is passed giving them false hope they may survive or maybe even eventually be released.
- That ridiculous show of force in the transfer from Kerbokan Jail to the island.
- The selfies taken with the condemned men on the flight over.
- The snubbing of all diplomatic approaches.

The douchebaggery from the Indonesians was just appalling. It was designed to make themselves look badass, with their middle finger directed straight at Australia.

I know what those guys did. I know they had done it before. I know the drug run was planned and not a spur of the moment thing. I'm not putting them up on a pedestal, I reckon they should have spent the rest of their lives in jail but not executed.

The fact that the Indonesian law enforcement and judiciary are so appallingly corrupt the application of the death penalty pretty much hinges on a brown bag full of money. Totally unacceptable.

The irony is that others in the syndicate that were caught and dealt with here are now free.

[Ruination]

Originally Posted by Bearman

There is no place in civilized society for the death penalty.

Those 2 guys could have stayed locked up for the rest of their lives for all I care but not executed. At least in prison they were actually doing some good and giving some sort of meaning in theirs and others lives. Now they're gone.

What really gets me is the way the Indonesians behaved:
- The disgraceful way they treated the families concerned.
- Dismissing the clemency pleas out of hand, not giving it due consideration.
- letting them hang around for nearly 10 years after sentence is passed giving them false hope they may survive or maybe even eventually be released.
- That ridiculous show of force in the transfer from Kerbokan Jail to the island.
- The selfies taken with the condemned men on the flight over.
- The snubbing of all diplomatic approaches.

The douchebaggery from the Indonesians was just appalling. It was designed to make themselves look badass, with their middle finger directed straight at Australia.

I know what those guys did. I know they had done it before. I know the drug run was planned and not a spur of the moment thing. I'm not putting them up on a pedestal, I reckon they should have spent the rest of their lives in jail but not executed.

The fact that the Indonesian law enforcement and judiciary are so appallingly corrupt the application of the death penalty pretty much hinges on a brown bag full of money. Totally unacceptable.

The irony is that others in the syndicate that were caught and dealt with here are now free.

Why would you expect otherwise from a third world country?

[Franco Cozzo]

You can kill as many people at the bottom rungs of the drug trade as you can kill, there is still going to be more tempting fate, as long as you wave cash in front of people they'll keep coming.

The problem is killing the people on the bottom tiers of the operation isn't going to fix anything, they should spend their efforts looking for the people up the chain.

Isn't the dude who was above Chan and Sukumaran living life alright in Sydney? He even won the lotto or something.

I like to imagine your 'smarter than the average bear' drug lord is a baby boomer, gray hair or bald, gets around in a suit, drives some form of European car, looks like an accountant and you pass the dude on the street or talk to him when having coffee in the morning at the cafe.

Not some young punk with heroin taped to their body hoping to make it through a few airports for a 4 or 5 figure payout.

I'm not saying the young punk should go unpunished, but executing them is a bit rough.

[Bearman]

Originally Posted by Ruination

Why would you expect otherwise from a third world country?

Well, they claim to be a civilized democratic society. Benefit of the doubt perhaps? Or naive?

Anyway, it's not anywhere I've ever wanted to go.

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

How many of those had Sukoi Fighter Escorts, how many had 20 paramilitaries "Escorting" each of them to death island.

Rubbish this is payback for ' the boats', ' phone tapping', and "East Timor".

There were 8 executions that morning.

[zilo]

Lucky for the Fillipino girl that someone confessed to setting her up......!!!

she was meant to be executed as well.

I guess later they could have said...woooops..we got it wrong?????

[99AUXR]

I do find the method of execution ****** up though :/

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by 99AUXR

I do find the method of execution ****** up though :/

I have actually thought about that and that is one of the reasons I am not a fan of capital punishment, I don't think there is a good way to go.

Getting shot in the heart/chest can still take some time to die, getting shot in the head can mean lights out instantly.

As a hunter I know that an animal can in some cases still cover quite some distance even with a dead centre hit through the heart with a high powered rifle. Death is fast but not instant. While something hit through the head or spine near the head will generally drop instantly on the spot.

[OCTANEBOSS]

Edited

[pottery beige]

Bali 7

[cheap]

Originally Posted by Charliewool

A certain Mick Keelty ...

Anyone doubting this.... Do tell WHY our AFP let those 9 depart Australia???

Nonsense!

If the Bali 9 had been left "alone" and Indonesian not informed, then in all probability.

1. Only the 7 mules would have been carrying drugs into Australia
   
2. The two ring leaders would denied everything, gotten away with it and moved on to another day with another bunch of mules. (they have history in drug running)
   
3. Instead the AFP tipped off Indonesia and all 9 got caught.
   
4. The ring leaders have finally got what they deserver.
   
5. The mules are in jail (as they deserve to be).

I've made it as simple as I can.

Stop blaming the AFP, they were doing their job!

Put the shoe on the other foot, if Indonesia found out about 9 terrorists planning to attack Australia, should they let the terrorists do their work and arrest them once they land back in Indonesia, or should they tell the AFP?

[EFIwindsor]

[Falcman0o7]

Originally Posted by Charliewool

It was NEVER going to hit the street here...
The AFP KNEW all about it... They set the 9 up!
Their little deal backfired when the Indos reneged on letting Shappelle go

Don't know what to believe! So many conspiracies these days.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Falcman0o7

Don't know what to believe! So many conspiracies these days.

I too sometimes like to don the tin foil hat and dabble in the odd conspiracy.

[XW-BAXR6T]

They knew Indonesia DIDN'T **** around with drug traffickers! So they paid the price. That's it!!