12 production days cut for next 3 months - Page 5

JPFS1 · 22-02-2011, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobman

Have to wonder how they have money to make a different tail light from XT to G6 or XR6 to G6E (minimal differences) or continue making XTs.

Even the G6 and XR6 could be merged and the amount of money saved in trim differences or other nonsense would surely help. No wonder things are going bad.

Good point and you will notice many common parts across Fords Global products. You can see it on exterior and interior items in the upcoming Territory. That will help save mega dollars.

The point I was getting at in previous post, which Dash GT touched on... I think we will see some sort of sales incentive return...

bobthebilda · 22-02-2011, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

There's nothing to tell.

Poor sales, no other reason.

You don't have 17 plus downdays in the first few months of the year because you're doing anything but trying to balance production with sales.

The scary thing will be if FoA decide to rebalance and reduce the daily rate in the assembly plant. A lot of people will then be redundant across manufacturing.

Most of this can be attributed to poor product planning and the LPi "Balls up".

I suppose they wont make any hasty decisions until they see how the first few months of the year pan out. Obviously they have been caught a bit short by the poor sales of Falcon and Ute in January (probably planned for high 2000's sales at the very least). AT least with down days, they can retain the employees, still cut costs, and just see how things pan out.

But you got to admit, in early december, there werent really any obstacles in the way of maintaining normal sales. Now they are faced with depressed conditions in QLD, a 1/3rd of NZ buyers who have bigger things on their mind, and potential buyers who are watching the price of crude oil sky rocketing in the last few days. These things wouldnt be too much of an issue in good times, but coming from a low base, they may be insurmountable.

Smoke Pursuit · 22-02-2011, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobthebilda

I suppose they wont make any hasty decisions until they see how the first few months of the year pan out. Obviously they have been caught a bit short by the poor sales of Falcon and Ute in January (probably planned for high 2000's sales at the very least). AT least with down days, they can retain the employees, still cut costs, and just see how things pan out.

But you got to admit, in early december, there werent really any obstacles in the way of maintaining normal sales. Now they are faced with depressed conditions in QLD, a 1/3rd of NZ buyers who have bigger things on their mind, and potential buyers who are watching the price of crude oil sky rocketing in the last few days. These things wouldnt be too much of an issue in good times, but coming from a low base, they may be insurmountable.

They didnt have anything big planned for January.. 2000+ units was never going to happen without LPG or a wagon anymore...

They need LPG tomorrow, and Diesel on Friday to survive. They have the technology but are too affraid to invest in it, because they are simply too far behind the 8 ball... Global V6 has indiscretely killed Falcon, while it may have been inevitable its going to happen sooner then later. They spent too much time with the V6 and neglected the I6 (especially from a Gas perspective), which was common sense when they were going to phase the I6 out for euro 4 compliance.

So what do fleet customers do? Go buy Hybrid Camry's and LPG Berlinas instead. Once you start changing a fleet over to anther brand its hard to go back, especially when your costs start to reduce and you see better resale at auction time. (fixed price servicing on toyota, and a good resale on hybrids for taxi market at auction time!!).

Ford have well and truely made some huge mistakes over the last few years!!

Chilliman · 22-02-2011, 08:36 PM

One could be forgiven for thinking Ford is about to axe local production sooner rather than later.

Ford had better have some good news stories to give to the press soon or it won't matter what their future plans are - the perception is already out there amongst the unwashed masses that Falcon is finished!

Road_Warrior · 22-02-2011, 08:41 PM

Yeah and we're seeing next to no TV advertising for ANY Ford product at the moment as well. Can't be helping.

prydey · 22-02-2011, 08:44 PM

the negativity and 'ford are doomed' stories aren't in the press, they are right here on AFF. if anyone looking to purchase a falcon decided to do some reseach and browse the internet, it would be bad news for ford if they stumbled across a so called 'ford enthusiast/fan' website called AFF.

Joe5619 · 22-02-2011, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Yeah and we're seeing next to no TV advertising for ANY Ford product at the moment as well. Can't be helping.

You need to watch TV more.. There are Ford adds all over about 2010 plated cars!!

Road_Warrior · 22-02-2011, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe5619

You need to watch TV more.. There are Ford adds all over about 2010 plated cars!!

Not in Wait Awhile there isnt.

jpd80 · 22-02-2011, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

the negativity and 'ford are doomed' stories aren't in the press, they are right here on AFF. if anyone looking to purchase a falcon decided to do some reseach and browse the internet, it would be bad news for ford if they stumbled across a so called 'ford enthusiast/fan' website called AFF.

At the moment, the problem is very few people are actually looking to buy a Falcon...

Pretty sure most potential buyers do their research using Drive, Wheels, Motor and the like.

[Sarcasm] They only have to see some of the anti-Ford stories there to realise all is lost [/Sarcasm]

Joe5619 · 22-02-2011, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Not in Wait Awhile there isnt.

Like I said.. You need to watch more TV... I saw a few just tonight alone!!

bobthebilda · 22-02-2011, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe5619

You need to watch TV more.. There are Ford adds all over about 2010 plated cars!!

Seriously tho, people dont watch TV hoping to see a car for sale ad. In fact they tend to run off and do other things whilst the ads are on. It may grab the attention of the veiwer if the manufacturers are having sales (little light goes on in head), like the 2010 plated sales, but generally they are being done at same time as all others, so its just like running to stay in the same spot.

The thing I notice where Ford are falling down on is the lift out (motoring) sections in the Saturday papers. Very rarely do Ford have the full page ads like the others. Just a quick browse here with preliminary car specs (fuel economy, airbags, pricing etc), probably is the beginning of where most uneducated car buyers begin their searches. From there, its off to the dealership to check out what you saw in the paper.

Joe5619 · 22-02-2011, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobthebilda

Seriously tho, people dont watch TV hoping to see a car for sale ad. In fact they tend to run off and do other things whilst the ads are on. It may grab the attention of the veiwer if the manufacturers are having sales (little light goes on in head), like the 2010 plated sales, but generally they are being done at same time as all others, so its just like running to stay in the same spot.

The thing I notice where Ford are falling down on is the lift out (motoring) sections in the Saturday papers. Very rarely do Ford have the full page ads like the others. Just a quick browse here with preliminary car specs (fuel economy, airbags, pricing etc), probably is the beginning of where most uneducated car buyers begin their searches. From there, its off to the dealership to check out what you saw in the paper.

I agree.. I never said TV adds where the best, just that Ford does have allot of them on at the moment... But I've never seen one in the Saturday motor section of the paper, which I think is a problem.

jpd80 · 23-02-2011, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe5619

I agree.. I never said TV adds where the best, just that Ford does have allot of them on at the moment... But I've never seen one in the Saturday motor section of the paper, which I think is a problem.

There's a lot less Ford ads on Austar and Foxtel...

Advertising is expensive so no doubt Ford is putting money where its research says the most potential buyers are. Spend more on ads, sell more but make less profit? I think that's the trouble at the moment but I also think they are cash restricted in the first place and need to be seen as profitable by head office.

Dr Smith · 23-02-2011, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe5619

I agree.. I never said TV adds where the best, just that Ford does have allot of them on at the moment... But I've never seen one in the Saturday motor section of the paper, which I think is a problem.

Re print, Ford mostly advertise in the Friday papers such as Carsguide. And the Herald Sun is actually the largest selling paper in Australia by a fair margin...only problem is Graham Smith also writes in it, lol.

pottery beige · 23-02-2011, 10:31 AM

see more fastfood than Ford advertising... hmmm.. pass me a burger....

DanielXR8 · 23-02-2011, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

the negativity and 'ford are doomed' stories aren't in the press, they are right here on AFF. if anyone looking to purchase a falcon decided to do some reseach and browse the internet, it would be bad news for ford if they stumbled across a so called 'ford enthusiast/fan' website called AFF.

Conversely if Ford Aust had bothered to read and act on some of the concerns on this forum, they would have seen the trends developing and turned it around.

Problems with AU, B series cars and Terri, dealers, warranty issues, disassifaction with various advertising, marketing, sales, decontenting of cars, rust issues, warranty, pathetic state of the Ford dealer network etc were common knowledge issues and discussed on here for years. Long before the media or the great unwashed knew and decided not to buy Ford. Many of here said their farewells from Ford branded product, but not before they left the reasons why. You would have thought that this was invaluable information for a car company.

You would think that, but it didn't change Ford Australias attitute one bit. Problems with rust on Terri, keep churning them out for years with the same problem. Same with the flawed front suspension. People not happy with the dealerships, do nothing. Model has a design flaw, ignore the punters who bought them and slip a fix in quietly on the next release. No one will care. They just kept on making one screw up after another. Even when it cause huge problems for them, even after every years sales chart showed continued decline, a poor performance again'st GM and increasingly disfranchised customers leaving the brand, they went right on ahead and did it all over again. Year, after year after year.

So explain to me again how that the mess Ford Australia setup for themselves is this communities fault? The stories on here were peoples experiences, the ones with the capacity in many, many cases to learn, adapt and improve from it was Ford Australia. On many occassions Ford had the opportunity to step in here and turn a bad news story into a good one. The silence from Ford corporate was deafening. They chose not to and that is their problem, not this forums or its members. Most of us would have bent over backwards to assist them if they had come to the members and asked for constructive feedback and details on issues members had with the brand.

Hell they haven't even bothered to have an official voice on here - even as they stack the unsold Falcons around the factory. Says it all really.

Dan

DanielXR8 · 23-02-2011, 02:54 PM

To be fair I must acknowledge David Flint from FPV who actually did act on things in these forums. He was certainly a big help to me on one occasion and actually got things moving for me on his last day of the job. I am still appreciative of his efforts to this day.

prydey · 23-02-2011, 03:01 PM

this forum is a very small % of the actual market place and hardly a fair cross section. also, those that have issues are much more likely to voice their concerns compared to those who have no issues, so the 'poor' stories are largely a misrepresentation of the actual truth. for every bad report on here, there are probably 2 or 3 good reports that no one hears about because there is no reason to get on here and have a whinge.

i've stayed at many luxury resorts on the gold and sunshine coast. all the ones i've stayed at have been fantastic, and yet, if i look up some online reviews of these same places, they paint an entirely different picture! why is that? same thing, only those with issues bother to take the time to voice their opinion.

i've owned every ford falcon model since xf, so i must apologise to all as apparently i bought the only good car from each model. apparently all the rest are no good.

stang65 · 23-02-2011, 03:39 PM

[QUOTE=DASH GT]They didnt have anything big planned for January.. 2000+ units was never going to happen without LPG or a wagon anymore...

good resale on hybrids for taxi market at auction time!!).

This is incorrect the Hybrids according to Racv and other publications are actually selling for thousands less than there non hybrid counterparts. The reason for this is once the warranty is gone these things can cost a fortune to repair and replace parts ( Battery pack especially).

prydey · 23-02-2011, 03:45 PM

as an aside, camry hybrid is only 4 star ancap rated.

jpd80 · 23-02-2011, 06:28 PM

[QUOTE=stang65]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DASH GT

They didnt have anything big planned for January.. 2000+ units was never going to happen without LPG or a wagon anymore...

good resale on hybrids for taxi market at auction time!!).

This is incorrect the Hybrids according to Racv and other publications are actually selling for thousands less than there non hybrid counterparts. The reason for this is once the warranty is gone these things can cost a fortune to repair and replace parts ( Battery pack especially).

Urban Myth.
In the ten years that Toyota have been selling hybrids here, only one Prius has needed replacement batteries.
Any cab operator will tell you that they recover the price difference on the Hybrid inside 12-18 months,
after that it's all money in the bank with fuel savings.

A lot of people don't understand that later Hybrid batteries are getting better and better ...

stang65 · 23-02-2011, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

Urban Myth.
In the ten years that Toyota have been selling hybrids here, only one Prius has needed replacement batteries.
Any cab operator will tell you that they recover the price difference on the Hybrid inside 12-18 months,
after that it's all money in the bank with fuel savings.

A lot of people don't understand that later Hybrid batteries are getting better and better ...

We are talking about second hand values, te public perceive tem s being expensive to repair out of warranty and as a result people aren`t willing to take the risk which has pushed down resale this was according to racv. Also isn`t replacement battery meant to be over $7000? they say $5000 just for the battery, they also say it will last the life of the car?

What is their definition of life of the car?

Also there are cars that aren`t hybrid that offer the similar sort of economy, i doubt this technology will be here for long anyway.

bobthebilda · 23-02-2011, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

You don't have 17 plus downdays in the first few months of the year because you're doing anything but trying to balance production with sales.

The scary thing will be if FoA decide to rebalance and reduce the daily rate in the assembly plant. A lot of people will then be redundant across manufacturing.
.

When did they announce the 17 days (as the thread only started with 12), over what length of time are the 17 days falling and do they include the normal monthly RDO or are they extra?

Road_Warrior · 23-02-2011, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

Urban Myth.
In the ten years that Toyota have been selling hybrids here, only one Prius has needed replacement batteries.
Any cab operator will tell you that they recover the price difference on the Hybrid inside 12-18 months,
after that it's all money in the bank with fuel savings.

A lot of people don't understand that later Hybrid batteries are getting better and better ...

OK a cab operator might be able to recoup that outlay within 12-18 months, that's to be expected from constant use, however what about a private user? There is a reason the fleets haven't fallen all over them, especially government fleets (contrary to what I predicted) so there must be something scaring the punters off. We have a grand total of one in our fleet carpark and have had for a while. However the rest of the normal Camry fleet seem to get cycled regularly (Camrys are getting replaced with RAV4's on occasion, work that out)

WOTDAH · 23-02-2011, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobthebilda

When did they announce the 17 days (as the thread only started with 12), over what length of time are the 17 days falling and do they include the normal monthly RDO or are they extra?

12 down days are for the beginning of this year. If you include the dd from the end of last year it probably is 17 all up in the last 6 months, and no that doesn't include RDO/PRO.

jpd80 · 23-02-2011, 09:40 PM

How come new Falcons are piling up, I thought Ford only made Falcons to order?

Sounds like Ford are making car that dealers don't want to carry on their floor plan....

Are we heading towards the greatest Falcon sale in recent times...$29,990 drive away?

Smoke Pursuit · 23-02-2011, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

OK a cab operator might be able to recoup that outlay within 12-18 months, that's to be expected from constant use, however what about a private user? There is a reason the fleets haven't fallen all over them, especially government fleets (contrary to what I predicted) so there must be something scaring the punters off. We have a grand total of one in our fleet carpark and have had for a while. However the rest of the normal Camry fleet seem to get cycled regularly (Camrys are getting replaced with RAV4's on occasion, work that out)

Well QLD police just bought a pile of them, and most of QLD governments are buying them, they are greener and meet their strict emission standards.

Road_Warrior · 23-02-2011, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

How come new Falcons are piling up, I thought Ford only made Falcons to order?

Sounds like Ford are making car that dealers don't want to carry on their floor plan....

Are we heading towards the greatest Falcon sale in recent times...$29,990 drive away?

Werent some dealers offering XR6's for $29,990 last year??

Quote:

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Well QLD police just bought a pile of them, and most of QLD governments are buying them, they are greener and meet their strict emission standards.

They're most definitely greener, and the Statefleet vehicle selection matrix definitely has them in the list, but I'm perplexed as to why GovCo over here isnt falling all over them...

Brazen · 23-02-2011, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Werent some dealers offering XR6's for $29,990 last year??

They're most definitely greener, and the Statefleet vehicle selection matrix definitely has them in the list, but I'm perplexed as to why GovCo over here isnt falling all over them...

Because the 4 cylinder fleet has downsized for cost reasons under the guise of environmental reasons.

Most fleets dont need a 4 cylinder car as big as a Camry, Corolla size is perfect and has good resale.

jpd80 · 23-02-2011, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Werent some dealers offering XR6's for $29,990 last year??

A small number of pre-Euro IV models with 5-speed autos, I was thinking of
a huge sale but maybe Ford is not prepared to push the panic button just yet..

(next week is end of February already so not too long until we see the figures..)