Ford finally admit their marketing isn't working

[TMC]

Wouldn't it be great if Ford started a competition for people to come up with concepts for an Ecoboost Falcon advert and an EcoLPi Falcon advert. The one they use wins and as a prize wins an Ecoboost Falcon or EcoLPi Falcon. That is an advert in itself.

[turbodewd]

Originally Posted by TMC

Wouldn't it be great if Ford started a competition for people to come up with concepts for an Ecoboost Falcon advert and an EcoLPi Falcon advert. The one they use wins and as a prize wins an Ecoboost Falcon or EcoLPi Falcon. That is an advert in itself.

here here!

[GTMOND]

galaxy xr8 and naddis if you read my message i do my own services i'm just saying theres a lot of people that don't want to or know how to. Im a mechanic in the mines in the territory and we have new v8 cruisers (pieces of ---t) common rail qoute for injectors and pump around 10 grand. All due to a bit of water contamination. The old mechanical ones you just empty the filter away ya go. Thats all i'm tying to say. I just think they need to be a bit more realistic with there parts pricing and they might get more people buying of them if there is only 20 bucks different to what ya can get on line

[platinumXR]

Do Ford have marketing? I remember seeing something during Bathurst, and that cute Jess girl talking about Facebook or something...

[jpd80]

In the recent past, around 75% of Falcon sales were to fleets,
how do you market to fleets that no longer want your product?

[TMC]

Originally Posted by jpd80

In the recent past, around 75% of Falcon sales were to fleets,
how do you market to fleets that no longer want your product?

That being the case, and this has been said before, the two things that would have driven fleet buyers away in the past, is 1.) not being able to supply an LPG Falcon when the Egas option was stopped and 2.) dumping the station wagon. For both those reasons the fleet buyers would have been forced to look elsewhere and now they are happy with what they already have and will have for a little while longer until it's time to upgrade. As for point number 2, very few if any would have migrated to the Territory from the Falcon wagon.

The other area outside of fleet buyers that traditionally would have bought a Falcon, were the cashed up bogans, who work on the mines and want a V8. True they can buy an FPV, but what if they don't want to spend that sort of money. With no XR8 Ford have missed out there. They've lopped off the only things that collectively would have kept the Falcon range relevant.

[Brazen]

I still shake my head at how Holden can sell 1200 V8s a month and Ford doesnt think there is a market there for a new Supercharged V8 that would whips Holden's @rse.

I have said all along - Ford needs to move the Falcon to the premium end of the market with diesel and return of XR8. Fleets have moved on to Cruze/Corolla for 20 grand on road - they are not coming back.

Ironically the V8 has become more important than ever to ensure local survival - although most on here would disagree vehemontly at that idea. Whether you like it or not people see small cars and SUVS as the sensible family or fleet choice. The market has shifted, buying a large sedan is seen as buying a luxurious or performance vehicle, its about bloody time Ford started treating the Falcon like one.

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by jpd80

In the recent past, around 75% of Falcon sales were to fleets,
how do you market to fleets that no longer want your product?

Here’s a question then, what is Ford doing in the marketing area for fleet customers? Is there any fleet managers on here that can tell me what Ford is doing to win Fleets sales??? If you want to win fleet sales back, go out & get them. Drive days, free extended test drives for Fleets managers, dinners for fleet’s manager, advertising directly to fleets managers, discount servicing, product pitching to fleet managers, do something..

I don’t believe people think advertising is not a good thing.. Why do some many people buy coca-coke over Pepsi, KFC over red rooster, red bull over Monster.. etc etc etc etc !!

[dimka100]

People there is no quick solution to the Falcon sales issues, believe me if there was Ford would have already implemented it, as a company they have access to significantly more information than most of the forum warriors here do, they also have access to various consultancy firms that specialise in market analysis and so forth, if quick solutions would have been available then they would have been implemented ages ago already.

Reversing the sales trend would take time, a fair bit of it actually, it would also take significant R&D resources in streamlining the Falcon to meet the true market demands, it would also highly depend on the economic conditions experienced both in Australia and Overseas, and finally there would be a bunch of political issues to sort out … all these things take time, patience, dedication, and most importantly lots of dollars … will Ford as a global company be willing to do that? Well I guess only time will tell as so far the company has not been sufficiently transparent of its future plans and strategy.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by TMC

That being the case, and this has been said before, the two things that would have driven fleet buyers away in the past, is 1.) not being able to supply an LPG Falcon when the Egas option was stopped and
EcoLIP Has been on sale for quite some time to fleets, they don't really seem to want it..
2.) dumping the station wagon. For both those reasons the fleet buyers would have been forced to look elsewhere and now they are happy with what they already have and will have for a little while longer until it's time to upgrade. As for point number 2, very few if any would have migrated to the Territory from the Falcon wagon.
In fact the bulk of Territory sales in the past were former wagon buyers, S/W was kept for mostly Telstra fleet sales..

Ford dropping models like the S/W were a reaction to falling sales and insufficient justificationfor funding FG replacement.
Doing that would have robbed funding from other areas like FGII and SZ updates...

The other area outside of fleet buyers that traditionally would have bought a Falcon, were the cashed up bogans, who work on the mines and want a V8. True they can buy an FPV, but what if they don't want to spend that sort of money. With no XR8 Ford have missed out there. They've lopped off the only things that collectively would have kept the Falcon range relevant.

Holden has seen similar drops in its sales of Commodore across the board,
most of the V8 sales have been to private buyers and even more SS Utes than sedans.
Sad to say but loss of flkeet sales is ripping the guts out of SV6 and XR6 sales,
increases in fuel costs have slowed sales of SS and XR6T as well as luxury equivalents too.

[TMC]

As for the EcoLPI already been on sale for a long time, all I'm saying is there was a gap in the supply of LPG vehicles from Ford, long enough for the normal fleet buyers to move off elsewhere.

Many companies used the Falcon SW not just Telstra. Look at the taxi companies. Again they're moving on to other things. And contrary to what some people say there were those private buyers who wanted a Falcon wagon and moved on once the wagon was dropped. Some did move to Territory, others left Ford altogether.

As for V8's dropping off in sales, I'm in WA, where the place is loaded with Sportswagon V8's. They must all be coming to WA then if sales are on the decline. Holden V8's are everywhere here, because WA has money to spend.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by TMC

As for the EcoLPI already been on sale for a long time, all I'm saying is there was a gap in the supply of LPG vehicles from Ford, long enough for the normal fleet buyers to move off elsewhere.

Yes, I agree the gap in LPG sales opened the door to fleet managers looking at alternative vehicles,
no matter what Ford says to these fleet managers, they have discovered that their new
acquisitions fill the roles well and no need to change...

Many companies used the Falcon SW not just Telstra. Look at the taxi companies. Again they're moving on to other things. And contrary to what some people say there were those private buyers who wanted a Falcon wagon and moved on once the wagon was dropped. Some did move to Territory, others left Ford altogether.

Again, the cost of a new S/W falcon was looked at and not considered viable in terms of return.
"Build me a (insert car type) or I'll go elsewhere" only works if enough people say it...

As for V8's dropping off in sales, I'm in WA, where the place is loaded with Sportswagon V8's. They must all be coming to WA then if sales are on the decline. Holden V8's are everywhere here, because WA has money to spend.

Normalcy, we look around at our location and think that everywhere else is the same,
Another person might see Prados every where, someone else might see Mazda 3s everywhere...

By the by, when Sportwagon was introduced, there was considerable evidence to show that it was in fact,
canabalizing Commodore sedan sales as Wagon buyers ditched sedan and jumped back into Sportwagon.

TMC,
I understand and share your frustration, it's hard to watch our old friend ebb away but unfortunately,
in these days of hard nosed accountancy, everything is being reduced down to dollars and cents.
Yes, this is the way Ford wants to play its hand, we may not like it but what they're doing probably
makes good corporate financial sense, we don't know or even imagine the big picture.

I believe that Ford head office is in fact, making every appeasement to FoA to allow continuance of Falcon,
if thay were the A-holes every one thinks, they would have closed up years ago. Territory is our best hope..

[TMC]

Yes, the Territory has really taken over from Falcon and that is because it is a great car despite those who point at balljoints and this or that. Unfortunately there is no market now for a large base model sedan. It has to have an edge of some sort or else the buyer goes and buys a Hyundai diesel or something.

I think it was you jpd80 that mentioned having an XR Territory. I think that's a great idea. If everyone has left the Falcon then the Territory is where these sort of options should go. As the only AWD is the diesel, and the reason for no V8 Territory in the past was that it was too hard to make it RWD, why not an XR8 Territory RWD???? And why not bring back the Turbo 6 Terry in RWD only guise. There are a lot of people buying V8 Jeeps (admittedly 4WD) why not a supercharged V8 Territory? Spice the mix up a bit.

BRING THE BONNET SCOOP BACK FORD!!!!!!!!!

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by jpd80

In the recent past, around 75% of Falcon sales were to fleets,
how do you market to fleets that no longer want your product?

But they have now said they are chasing more profitable private sales instead, so what are they doing to get that?

Absolutely nothing.

[MITCHAY]

It isn't working because it doesn't exist in the first place lol. For example I have not seen one TV commercial for the Ecoboost Falcon which is a completely new engine so you'd think it would be all over the place.

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by jpd80

fuel costs have slowed sales of SS and XR6T as well as luxury equivalents too.

I completely disagree, fuel prices impact the base 6 cylinder versions MUCH more than the V8 or performance versions. Fleet 6 cylinder buyers will move to small cars, V8 buyers WANT a V8 they dont care about fuel prices as much base engine buyers.

There was a classic study done many years ago that showed a tax on private jet purchases would actually increase the amount of private jet sold! As the exclusivity and prestige of having a private jet would increase.

Hence why in recent years V8 sales for Holden were at record highs during high fuel prices whilst 6 cylinder sales fell through the floor. There is no other FU to society than driving a V8 around people who have been downgraded to Corollas. It's definately a status thing, and that sells cars.

[TMC]

Originally Posted by Brazen

I completely disagree, fuel prices impact the base 6 cylinder versions MUCH more than the V8 or performance versions. Fleet 6 cylinder buyers will move to small cars, V8 buyers WANT a V8 they dont care about fuel prices as much base engine buyers.

There was a classic study done many years ago that showed a tax on private jet purchases would actually increase the amount of private jet sold! As the exclusivity and prestige of having a private jet would increase.

Hence why in recent years V8 sales for Holden were at record highs during high fuel prices whilst 6 cylinder sales fell through the floor. There is no other FU to society than driving a V8 around people who have been downgraded to Corollas. It's definately a status thing, and that sells cars.

It also comes back to how the car makes you feel. Driving a camry makes you feel like a nobody, a number, boring and average by comparison to a nice V8.

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by TMC

It also comes back to how the car makes you feel. Driving a camry makes you feel like a nobody, a number, boring and average by comparison to a nice V8.

Exactly, and no one is going to spend 40grand on a vehicle which isnt somewhat special, not nowadays. The sensible price range has moved below the Falcon and Commodore price range, Falcon and Commodore to be successful has to be aspirational.

People look at the GDP or average earnings and think Australians are getting wealthier and that large cars more attainable - nothing could be further from the truth. GDP increases are largely based on mining investments from foreign companies. If you remove the mining factor - the average Australian's purchasing power decreased by 3%, meaning the average Australian has become 3% poorer and this has been happening for many years. Hence why I say that the future of Falcon and Commodore means shifting up the luxury or premium or perfomance factor. A brand new Falcon or Commodore is a luxury, Corolla and Cruze have taken over the every-man role. The future for cars over 40 grand relies on V8s, diesels and features. LPG and Ecoboost are an absolute waste of time, any economist knows that and I am writing a paper on this purchasing power of the average Australian.

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by Brazen

Exactly, and no one is going to spend 40grand on a vehicle which isnt somewhat special, not nowadays. The sensible price range has moved below the Falcon and Commodore price range, Falcon and Commodore to be successful has to be aspirational.

People look at the GDP or average earnings and think Australians are getting wealthier and that large cars more attainable - nothing could be further from the truth. GDP increases are largely based on mining investments from foreign companies. If you remove the mining factor - the average Australian's purchasing power decreased by 3%, meaning the average Australian has become 3% poorer and this has been happening for many years. Hence why I say that the future of Falcon and Commodore means shifting up the luxury or premium or perfomance factor. A brand new Falcon or Commodore is a luxury, Corolla and Cruze have taken over the every-man role. The future for cars over 40 grand relies on V8s, diesels and features. LPG and Ecoboost are an absolute waste of time, any economist knows that and I am writing a paper on this purchasing power of the average Australian.

Going luxury does not necessarily mean V8's & Diesel's. Do Lexus sell these types of engines? I’ll give you features though!!

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by Joe5619

Going luxury does not necessarily mean V8's & Diesel's. Do Lexus sell these types of engines? I’ll give you features though!!

But the trick is to use the advantages you have! Right now there are diesels and supercharged V8s sitting withing 3 feet of Falcons on the assembly line - why restrict them to Territories and FPVs?

[Shonky.]

maybe in time the memories of Falcon taxi and xr6 fleet cars will fade and it will start to elevate in peoples minds

may not be enough time for that though

[bangm001]

I dont think there are huge things that need to be done really, our cars are pretty great for the money. My only gripe is the diff bush/rear end setup, and lack of nice grippy rear rubber. But most of all AFTER SALES SERVICE!!! There is none at ford. I leave very disappointed every time I leave a ford dealer, to the point where I never want to take any of my vehicles there every again.

[drwevil]

@bangm001 I have pretty much the exact opposite feeling after my car is serviced at Rec Gorell in Geelong they have been great....from the test drive to aftersales service. They even had a problem with my tint fixed without question.
I think that a lot of Ford dealers could use them as a case study on how to do it right...

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by drwevil

@bangm001 I have pretty much the exact opposite feeling after my car is serviced at Rec Gorell in Geelong they have been great....from the test drive to aftersales service. They even had a problem with my tint fixed without question.
I think that a lot of Ford dealers could use them as a case study on how to do it right...

They must have done a complete 360 cause what I and others have experienced there over the last decade has been nothing short of discraceful.

Trying to get things fixed under warranty was as much fun as having teeth pulled.

They were masters of "they all do that".

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Brazen

I completely disagree, fuel prices impact the base 6 cylinder versions MUCH more than the V8 or performance versions. Fleet 6 cylinder buyers will move to small cars, V8 buyers WANT a V8 they dont care about fuel prices as much base engine buyers.

Yes they do, a lot of the V8 Ute trade has slowed up lately, Holden used to sell a lot more of them last year.
And for the record, G6ET and XR6T have slowed quite a lot this year and FPV have sold a lot less.
So bang, there goes your theory right there, and in the first place I agree with what you say about Big sixes.

There was a classic study done many years ago that showed a tax on private jet purchases would actually increase the amount of private jet sold! As the exclusivity and prestige of having a private jet would increase.

Well, we're not talking about jet planes, we're talking about cars and the cost of jet maintenance and insurance has skyrocketed since 911
Most companies now either lease or charter private jet services..

Hence why in recent years V8 sales for Holden were at record highs during high fuel prices whilst 6 cylinder sales fell through the floor. There is no other FU to society than driving a V8 around people who have been downgraded to Corollas. It's definately a status thing, and that sells cars.

Again, I'm not arguing about six cylinders, I'm keen to see the six month figures to June,
I'm predicting a big drop in I-6T & V8 sales for Ford, FPV and Holden..HSV might be OK though..

[39ClevoUte]

I wonder what the global Ford statergy is? I wonder if it fits everyones opinion above? Government assistance to help wind down, not wind up? Then oh well that didn't work, but now we have to do....X. I think a lot of people know whats comming, but the corporates will take us on a journey anyway and in the end.........it'll be their plan and we'll buy it.

[mr smith]

Originally Posted by Brazen

Exactly, and no one is going to spend 40grand on a vehicle which isnt somewhat special, not nowadays. The sensible price range has moved below the Falcon and Commodore price range, Falcon and Commodore to be successful has to be aspirational.

People look at the GDP or average earnings and think Australians are getting wealthier and that large cars more attainable - nothing could be further from the truth. GDP increases are largely based on mining investments from foreign companies. If you remove the mining factor - the average Australian's purchasing power decreased by 3%, meaning the average Australian has become 3% poorer and this has been happening for many years. Hence why I say that the future of Falcon and Commodore means shifting up the luxury or premium or perfomance factor. A brand new Falcon or Commodore is a luxury, Corolla and Cruze have taken over the every-man role. The future for cars over 40 grand relies on V8s, diesels and features. LPG and Ecoboost are an absolute waste of time, any economist knows that and I am writing a paper on this purchasing power of the average Australian.

I think your spot on. Falcon cannot compete with the C class cars for value.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by mr smith

I think your spot on. Falcon cannot compete with the C class cars for value.

For the same price as an XR6 Falcon drive away, you can get a Titanium Focus..

[mr smith]

Originally Posted by jpd80

For the same price as an XR6 Falcon drive away, you can get a Titanium Focus..

Exactly, what is essentially the base model Falcon for private buyers, you can get the top of the range Focus.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by mr smith

Exactly, what is essentially the base model Falcon for private buyers, you can get the top of the range Focus.

What really gets my goat though, is how Ford charges $49K for Mondeo Titanium when the thing retails for like 21,500 pounds in England.

The Focus titanium retails there for 20,940 pounds so the Mondeo Titanium should be much closer to Focus than the G6E...