Families stung by fuel costs

[ronwest]

Originally Posted by djjase

It seems as though no one has lived life until they have had kids - what a joke. Just because you have had a kid doesnt make your life any different to mine - I breath the same polluted air, I pay the same excessive petrol price, I have bills. If it is such a burden then why did you have a family.

C'mon mate, you're obviously smarter than that...

I guess that until you have kids you can't know the difference. Everybody who has kids knows the difference. Those without kids tend to assume there is no difference.

Oh, and it's not my kids who have the health problems. I deal in other people's kid's health problems. I actually *do* know what I'm talking about with regard to the hardships that peolpe incur (but you may believe that or not...up to you).

[4.9 EF Futura]

Originally Posted by GreenEL

How about taxing us once instead of twice?

Fuel excise was "pinned" at 38cpl when the GST was brought in. That was part of the deal. Previously, the excise was indexed to the CPI.

So.

Would you be better off:

Paying 38cpl + gst on the total price of fuel.

Or

Removing the GST and indexing the excise to the CPI.

Remembering:

You cant have your cake and eat it too.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by djjase

Actually angry beaver, my taxes are paying for those lazy sods on the dole, my taxes are paying for health care of those on lower wages... why because I pay a crap load more because I am a single in the higest tax bracket.

Bwahahaha.. clueless. Guess what.. I'm in the highest tax bracket too. I asl pay for my families own private healthcare (to the tune of $2.5K a year). As for paying more tax.. you dont know what you are saying. The tax system is based around income earned, not if you are in a family. In fact the tax system is biased towards single people. As a family we get to cop "duel income means testing" but have to deal with "single income based PAYE tax". We also get to pay GST on all of those wonderfully excessive family items like nappies, female hygene products and other health based items. Fortunatly for you condoms are GST free.

Originally Posted by djjase

When i do my tax return I can't claim a child, I dont get any money from the Govt for a child or two.

Damn.. could be cause you DONT HAVE ANY!!!!???

Originally Posted by djjase

All of you who have kids dont forget that I am paying for you to receive that money so shut the up when it comes to petrol prices.

Wrong again. Once again the tax system actually favours you. You pay nothing to me. Take it out on the dole bludgers and the uni dropouts.. but families? You havent got a clue do you? You obviously have absolutely no tax based knowlegde or you would realise jsut how dumb that comment is.

Originally Posted by djjase

You have no idea of what I was saying do you. Go back and read my very first post. Not once was I picking on you or anyone else in this forum. I stated the obvious - I was referring to families that I know of and have a lot of contact with.

Yes, and then you effectively lumped all familiys into that same bucket as a gross generalisation.

Originally Posted by djjase

Why have you all just picked on ShockWaveXR6na and myself for stating the obvious - not once have we picked on YOU !!!! your all taking it personally when that was not nor never the intentions. Go and learn how to read and understand what has been written.

Not picked on? .. like this comment from this very post?

Originally Posted by djjase

All of you who have kids dont forget that I am paying for you to receive that money so shut the up when it comes to petrol prices.

Sounds like picking on to me.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

AB, at the risk of individually addressing a comment... this "kind of statement" concerns me.

"enough is enough"

Is it?

Is it really the government's job to 'step in' and take specific action to combat the price of an international commodity?

I mean not to belittle anyone - but i dont see it as a realistic proposition. Sure, i'd rather not be paying $1.42 a litre to fuel a car that destroys 20 litres per 100km travelled... but anything the government can do (which i personally believe they should not) will be a short term solution. We WILL end up back at square one, with a massive hole in the budget (a hole which will be filled by removing public schools, hospital beds and welfare payments).

In my opinion, a better proposition would be for us all to gear ourselves to cope with the new fuel pricing environment... but your preference appears to be for the status quo with state intervention to ensure that families need to make no adjustments to their lifestyle?

I dont see either as being right or wrong... but i think ive made my preference fairly clear...

Not really about the fuel prices. More to do with the tax system as a whole being geared to not be supportive of the family unit in general. Its a "Single persons" tax system.. The only time family income as a total is used os to stop the govenement having to pay back money.

[EA2BA]

Originally Posted by GreenEL

I don't have a problem with the cost of living going up but I do have a problem when wages don't go up to match it. By the way I don't have any kids yet and won't until my circumstances change so that I can give them everything that I didn't get when I was a kid.

There will NEVER be a good time to have kids, just have them, put up with the costs and enjoy your kids for all they happiness they bring.

[brenx]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

AB, at the risk of individually addressing a comment... this "kind of statement" concerns me.

"enough is enough"

Is it?

Is it really the government's job to 'step in' and take specific action to combat the price of an international commodity?

Yes. Why? It's the only import that we get that is taxed at a rate that is unsustainable for the user.

You don't see a BMW or Merc getting taxed so viciously the price doubles if not triples.

Gov't's have plenty of opportunities to take people. They should limit the taxes on basic necessaties. Petrol is one of those as it assists people to get to work. If they can't work the gov't will get no tax $ from them. Instead they'll have to fund their unemployment benefit's making their budget book look ordinary again.

The only issue maybe how to fund road works but then again I see good roads being dug up for no reason. Then a crappy road sits in ruins. Some of the road works in my area are just PR excersises. Not what the area needs.

[RG]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

Fuel excise was "pinned" at 38cpl when the GST was brought in. That was part of the deal. Previously, the excise was indexed to the CPI.

So.

Would you be better off:

Paying 38cpl + gst on the total price of fuel.

Or

Removing the GST and indexing the excise to the CPI.

Remembering:

You cant have your cake and eat it too.

Not the GST, the state taxes. I believe QLD did this a while ago. Seems to work up there.

[djjase]

C no one know what type of life I have had, I lived with a girl for 5 years who had a child. So don't go telling me I dont know what it is like. The child was just under 2 I had the pleasure of teaching her potty training, I paid for everything for the child and her mother. I had a very very close friend who had a child, her boyfriend left her, I was there for her and she struggled very hard. I helped as much as I could at the time. I went without food and stuff so she could feed the child, she wasnt even my GF but I did my part because I felt sorry for her. So trust me I know what it is like. My younger sister went through a lot of hardship too, I brought her things to help like a dryer to dry the nappies etc. What it seems to me is that people are just using the excuse of "I Have a family and I can't afford to pay $1.45 for petrol" you dont know me I might be up to my eyeballs in debt and paying $1.45 is outragous for me too. Lucky that i am not because I choose to pay for things when i can afford it. I dont live beyond my means and put things on credit cards or use the 1year interest free terms to buy a dishwasher that i dont really need. I dont like paying more for petrol just like everyone else, but like Shockwave has said... I accept it and have to make modifications to my budget to accomodate it.

[4.9 EF Futura]

Originally Posted by brenx

Yes. Why? It's the only import that we get that is taxed at a rate that is unsustainable for the user.

I guess we have a difference of opinion on this. I mean, remove the excise and the GST... dont tax fuel at all. It's only a matter of time before the price of oil sends pump prices back to where they are. Considering the increase in demand you would see by bringing the price down that much, i dont think it'd take long.

Short term solution to a long term problem. WE need to deal with the problem, not the government.

The only issue maybe how to fund road works but then again I see good roads being dug up for no reason. Then a crappy road sits in ruins. Some of the road works in my area are just PR excersises. Not what the area needs.

Beuarocracy and governments lead to inefficiency - what you describe is a by-product of this. Privatise the roads and let the market sort it out. Did i mention im a stout capitalist? lol

[Casper]

Originally Posted by djjase

C no one know what type of life I have had, I lived with a girl for 5 years who had a child. So don't go telling me I dont know what it is like. The child was just under 2 I had the pleasure of teaching her potty training, I paid for everything for the child and her mother. I had a very very close friend who had a child, her boyfriend left her, I was there for her and she struggled very hard. I helped as much as I could at the time. I went without food and stuff so she could feed the child, she wasnt even my GF but I did my part because I felt sorry for her. So trust me I know what it is like. My younger sister went through a lot of hardship too, I brought her things to help like a dryer to dry the nappies etc. What it seems to me is that people are just using the excuse of "I Have a family and I can't afford to pay $1.45 for petrol" you dont know me I might be up to my eyeballs in debt and paying $1.45 is outragous for me too. Lucky that i am not because I choose to pay for things when i can afford it. I dont live beyond my means and put things on credit cards or use the 1year interest free terms to buy a dishwasher that i dont really need. I dont like paying more for petrol just like everyone else, but like Shockwave has said... I accept it and have to make modifications to my budget to accomodate it.

so we are in the wrong to accuse you of not understanding.. but you are perfectly in your right to stereotype all families as needing to stop whinging and living beyond our means? Of crying foul about fuel prices because we are not smart enough or too selfish to budget for it like you?

Damn.. I suppose paying CASH for a more efficient and reliable familiy van just last week was pretty "unstereotypical" of this whinging family and our crappy budgeting system.

Just as you ask us not to assume your history and circumstances... do not assume others.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

I guess we have a difference of opinion on this. I mean, remove the excise and the GST... dont tax fuel at all. It's only a matter of time before the price of oil sends pump prices back to where they are. Considering the increase in demand you would see by bringing the price down that much, i dont think it'd take long.

Short term solution to a long term problem. WE need to deal with the problem, not the government.



Beuarocracy and governments lead to inefficiency - what you describe is a by-product of this. Privatise the roads and let the market sort it out. Did i mention im a stout capitalist? lol

I actually agree with this 100%. Let the free market rule. Stop the tax and let a bit of common sence reality work instead.

[ronwest]

Originally Posted by djjase

C no one know what type of life I have had,

true, so I'll leave discussing it any further with you other than to say that I hope that you can see that whatever hardships you have endured will seem like a walk in the park for many others who have had it far, far worse.

I could cite examples but it tends to become a circular argument.

[Laminge]

This thread has lost the bloody plot, I cannot believe the arrogance and stupidity of so many in a desperate attempt to hold an unrealistic value to ones own importance in life, and then to cry fowl while undermining others in the community.

So much for the original topic to hand!