Covid 19 -

[russellw]

Data valid as at 00:00 GMT September 20th 2021.

Note: As not all Australian States report at the same time, the data below is based on the previous full day reporting.

1,486 new cases for Australia and 5 deaths so the CMR is 1.339%.

22 new cases and no deaths for NZ so CMR is 0.661%.

The UK had 35,702 cases yesterday and 49 deaths for a CMR of 1.812%.

133,725 new cases in the USA yesterday and 1,203 deaths (some carried over from the weekend) sees CMR at 1.611%.

Other notable points:

Only -
Syria (204); and
French Guiana (445)

... recorded new highs; those in blue for the second consecutive day and those in red for a third or more consecutive day.

No countries move above the 90th percentile for the 10 day period while Ireland and Kazakhstan drop below.

[russellw]

NSW/VIC

NSW records 1,023 cases in the current period and the 10-day average growth rate increases to 0.9627 (from 0.9573) while the actual line is almost back to the predictive trend line and based on the 4th order polynomial, that trend line now has a downward curve.



VIC records 603 cases in the current period (another high for this outbreak) and the 10-day average growth rate decreases to 1.0420 (from 1.10714) while the actual line moves closer to the predictive trend line.

[Syndrome]

[russellw]

Originally Posted by tweeked

Yes I agree, sweeping generalisations about Sutton. But reading his bio, I am underwhelmed. Going off to do humanitarian medicine in Afghanistan plus a few years of public service does not prepare someone to make determinations that affect the financial viability of people, businesses and states. So I actually stand by my opinion. Through luck more than good management!

Professor Brett Sutton has extensive experience and clinical expertise in public health and communicable diseases, gained through emergency medicine and field-based international work, including in Afghanistan and Timor-Leste. He represents Victoria on a number of key national bodies including the AHPPC (Australian Health Protection Principal Committee).

Professor Sutton is a Fellow of the Royal Society for Public Health, a Fellow of the Australasian College of Tropical Medicine and a Fellow of the Australasian Faculty of Public Health Medicine (AFPHM). He is also a member of the Faculty of Travel Medicine.

... is a bit more than you actually stated and he is only one of a much larger group of experts in a variety of fields who agree on the advice that should be presented to the Government but you keep belittling him because I'm sure you must know better.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by T3rminator

Where is Dutton? Yesterday's footages needs to be sent to ASIO. There are reports that those at the front of the queue protesting were not actually members....who knows. I agree its spreading. As previously mentioned, one of my best mate is in the industry, and recently any conversations I have with him always turns into "communism this" and "communism that", its crazy.

Got nothing to with Dutton! Vic police will collaborate intelligence with relevant security organisations if needed otherwise they will deal with it.

Why does everyone think it is all left wing and communism with unions is beyond me; your mate needs education with politics and unionism to understand how it all works.

[cs123]

Originally Posted by Syndrome

image

Yup,
Having a job matters.
Having to eat your lunch outside doesn't matter.

Yesterday they were chanting shut it down. Now they have their wish.

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by Stambolova

This isn't about the "odd protest". This is a sort of culmination of the past 18 months; 540-odd days of the nation being saturated with lie after lie and subjugated with fear.

In your opinion.

And not a bad effort for someone who's only been a member for 1 day

[PG2]

Originally Posted by GasoLane

In your opinion.

And not a bad effort for someone who's only been a member for 1 day

I have a funny feeling that they have been around for more than one day - just under a different name.

[T3rminator]

Originally Posted by Itsme

Got nothing to with Dutton! Vic police will collaborate intelligence with relevant security organisations if needed otherwise they will deal with it.

Why does everyone think it is all left wing and communism with unions is beyond me; your mate needs education with politics and unionism to understand how it all works.

Reference to Dutto was a bit of tongue and cheek. However, ASIO have publicly warned us that right wing extremists are the no 1 security threat to this country, so it would actually fall into his portfolio IF it does turn out it is these fringe groups causing the scenes we saw yesterday?

And yes, I feel said mate is slipping into the ether. Hard to have a normal conversation with him these days. Politics or not, everything inevitably somehow comes back to "communism"

[tweeked]

Just took the dog for a walk, was in a park by myself. No one within 200 metres of me, but I had to wear a facemask.

These are the rules that will lose people. Why do they not go back to the "mask outdoors where you cannot socially distance". That made sense. I will happily comply if I feel like I am remotely making a difference. This is just dumb and takes away hugely of one of the few freedoms left.

Worst of all, this will not go away in Vic until 80% 2nd jab. It just proves that no matter how many fellowships our CHO has he is not a Fellow of common sense. In my opinion of course!

[FPV8U]

Originally Posted by tweeked

Just took the dog for a walk, was in a park by myself. No one within 200 metres of me, but I had to wear a facemask.

These are the rules that will lose people. Why do they not go back to the "mask outdoors where you cannot socially distance". That made sense. I will happily comply if I feel like I am remotely making a difference. This is just dumb and takes away hugely of one of the few freedoms left.

Worst of all, this will not go away in Vic until 80% 2nd jab. It just proves that no matter how many fellowships our CHO has he is not a Fellow of common sense. In my opinion of course!

Agreed, the vast majority are willing to comply with logical rule sets.

Where I live I’d say mask compliance on my regular walk is down to single percentage figures and of those that are wearing it I’d estimate 5-10% actually wear it covering they nose and mouth.

Compare that to down at the shops indoors or outdoors and compliance would still be easily over 95%.

Whether it’s Sutton, Andrew’s or the advisory board they need to remember that what’s ideal from a risk minimisation perspective with only Covid cases in mind, is not ideal in terms of mental or physical health, let alone economic impacts and community division, the middle ground is nowhere near our current pathway.

[cs123]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Except the government wants people to forgo their human right to refuse medical treatment. It's in the UN Charter on Human Rights. Everyone has the right to refuse medical treatment.

Except if you are in the middle of a pandemic with a virus with a 99.7% survival rate, then you must give up your human rights, be kicked out of your job, and eventually you won't be able to go anywhere or do anything.

And people are happy to accept this? We've become a nation of apathetic sheep.

The government will hit the vaxx rates they want, just leave anyone else who doesn't want it alone ffs. No wonder people are getting angry. It's only going to build from here.

Nobody is holding them down and injecting them. They don't have to get vaccinated. They just might need to work in a different job.

I am happy to accept this.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by cs123

Nobody is holding them down and injecting them. They don't have to get vaccinated. They just might need to work in a different job.

I am happy to accept this.

Yeah, just take away their livelihoods cause they don't comply. Not something you would see in a communist state at all.

It's forcing them to by stealth. Yeah they aren't being held down, but if we take away their job, make their life not worth living and basically ensure they can barely leave their house, then what choice do you give them?

Now they are firing tear gas at the protestors. If you didn't think Dan Andrews was trying to crush anyone who dares question his authority, this should be all the proof you need.

It's probably a diversion away from todays news story about him selling out his countrymen. Treasonous scum.

It is mandating by coercion. The net result will be a modern form of apartheid.

[Polyal]

But if its just a shot for the lowly flu what are you worried about?

Unreal that construction workers get locked down for 2 weeks and how many other industries have been shut for how long? Or is it because most of these people would struggle to have savings to get them through two weeks?

Industry advised on incoming requirement, "members" stage illegal protest and warned they would be shut down. Shut down occurs and its all surprise?

No wonder most people dont go into politics.

[cs123]

Originally Posted by Stambolova

It is mandating by coercion. The net result will be a modern form of apartheid.

I don't recall seeing too many protesting about this

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Jab,_No_Pay

No Jab No Pay is an Australian policy initiative which withholds three state payments – Child Care Benefit, the Child Care Rebate and a portion of the fortnightly Family Tax Benefit part A per child – for parents of children under 20 years of age who are not fully immunised or on a recognised catch-up schedule. No Jab No Play is a related policy that disallows unvaccinated children from attending preschool and childcare centres, and imposes fines on childcare centres that admit unvaccinated children.[The system allows exemptions for children who cannot be safely vaccinated for medical reasons.

It's mandating by coercion too.

[hawkgirl]

Originally Posted by Stambolova

It is mandating by coercion. The net result will be a modern form of apartheid.

Oh please

Its very simple
Dont want to be vaccinated? Dont tnen

But dont whinge if you cant work somewhere where its a requirement of employment.
You shouldnt be entitled to free medical treatment should you refuse vax & then become seriously ill from covid. If it was up to me treatment should be refused.

Freedom of choice does not mean freedom from consequences.

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Those vaccines actually work. And stop you from getting and transmitting it. Proven over decades of use.

These crappy covid "vaccines" (which technically aren't even vaccines) hardly even work, and aren't proven medium to long term. Heart issues seem to be the most common form of side effect.

Sure, none of them are 100% safe, but i'd put my house on these long term ones that work, rather than these experimental ones rushed onto the market.

No offence boss, but if you like the idea of the the long term ones that (are proven to) work, why don't you go out and get one.

That's right, you can't. In the meantime, go out and get yourself something that has been proven to work in the short term. It gives you a better chance of surviving the pandemic than holding out for something that doesn't exist.

There's no point in comparing the existing treatments with something that doesn't even exist. You'll just burst your boiler getting agitated about it and we'll all go crazy from hearing the same stuff time and time again.

[MITCHAY]

I've had my TV going all day and man there a lot of angry hi vis kicking off in Melbourne. Totally ****ing up the Westgate.

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

Originally Posted by Stambolova

If it really was a choice, conditions wouldn't be applied.

Every choice we make in life has repercussions. No different in this case.

Actually, thinking about this a bit more, I don't actually have a problem with people making the choice to not get the covid-19 vaccine.

The impact from the people not getting a vaccine is that the number of cases, hospitilisations and deaths will be grater than what has been predicted, and based upon those figures, when the states will start to open up again.

As long as those who choose not to get a vaccine don't rely on our public health system when (not if) they catch covid and clog up our heath system for those who have made a choice based on their own health, their families health, or the greater good of the community they live in, then feel free to make the decision you want. Just don't allow your choice make an impact on the rest of us.

[slowsnake]

Originally Posted by Itsme

I don't where you have been all these years as this is nothing new in Australia; the odd violent protests have been going on since Adam was a boy.

In more states and territories than you, find something else to protest about and not my posts, which by the way are from me, not the newspapers or the internet.
Think up something of your own to deride


Cheers Billy

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

I'm jumping out for a bit before this gets out of control. This has the potential to go south pretty quickly.

I understand people's views and choices, even though I may not agree with them.

[FTE217]

A day in a life.......
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...rs-2021-09-16/

[russellw]

Originally Posted by Stambolova

If it really was a choice, conditions wouldn't be applied.

No - it's still a choice. You might not like the consequences but you can still make that choice for yourself. It's not much difference to the consequences of breaking the criminal code - you can choose to murder someone if you want to but the consequence will be a long stay at one of Her Majesty's Holiday Camps with nocturnal activities thrown in as a bonus.

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Yeah, just take away their livelihoods cause they don't comply. Not something you would see in a communist state at all.

It's forcing them to by stealth. Yeah they aren't being held down, but if we take away their job, make their life not worth living and basically ensure they can barely leave their house, then what choice do you give them?

Now they are firing tear gas at the protestors. If you didn't think Dan Andrews was trying to crush anyone who dares question his authority, this should be all the proof you need.

Nothing stealthy about it. The Government (and many employer's) have made their stance on vaccinations transparently clear. Yes, if you choose not to be vaccinated without a medical reason then you probably won't have a job and your freedoms will be somewhat inhibited and if you choose to break those restrictions you'll face sanctions for that as well but the choice is still yours.

As for firing tear gas at protesters - if they intend to behave in the aggressive and rabid manner they have been so far then what else would you expect? Or would you prefer a baton charge, rubber bullets, water cannon instead? If you want to act like an animal then don't whine if you get treated like one.

Originally Posted by Stambolova

It is mandating by coercion. The net result will be a modern form of apartheid.

About the only thing you've said so far that has any merit. Yes, those who choose not to be vaccinated are going to be a different class of citizens but unlike apartheid, it will be by their own choice.

I could understand all the bleating if we were dragging people off the streets and forcing vaccines into their arms but we aren't and our Governments (and various employer groups) have a responsibility to provide a safe environment for the rest of us.

As for the stupid comments about the efficacy of the vaccines, go and read the research that has been conducted in the US and UK about just how effective they are in terms of reducing your chance of dying by somewhere between 25x and 30x and that is what actually matters.

Here is a final warning for the anti-vax and anti-Government posters. Go find some other far whichever wing forum where your views might find a sympathetic audience of like minded nutters because your views aren't welcome here and future posts of that nature are just going to be deleted so you'll be wasting your effort.

[slowsnake]

Originally Posted by Polyal

But if its just a shot for the lowly flu what are you worried about?

Unreal that construction workers get locked down for 2 weeks and how many other industries have been shut for how long? Or is it because most of these people would struggle to have savings to get them through two weeks?

Industry advised on incoming requirement, "members" stage illegal protest and warned they would be shut down. Shut down occurs and its all surprise?

No wonder most people dont go into politics.

As soon as you join a public forum and post in a thread, then disagree with that person's view, that makes you political!,,,,or a politician!...
Politics is part of every stream of everyday life!.....


Cheers Billy

[slowsnake]

Originally Posted by FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0

I'm jumping out for a bit before this gets out of control. This has the potential to go south pretty quickly.

I understand people's views and choices, even though I may not agree with them.

Can I come too......
Please get me outta here!....

Cheers Billy

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by Stambolova

Specious reasoning comparing murder to "voluntary" vaccination. They do have something in common, they are both premeditated...

Apartheid by any other name is still apartheid

What they are doing is probably worse as they make a mockery of one's choice.

I'm curious. Did you join a car forum to talk about your car, presumably a Ford, or just to find somewhere to argue your beliefs?

^ I'm after a Mondeo wagon, I've started a thread in the appropriate place GasoLane

[Tassie f100]

Originally Posted by hawkgirl

Oh please

Its very simple
Dont want to be vaccinated? Dont tnen

But dont whinge if you cant work somewhere where its a requirement of employment.
You shouldnt be entitled to free medical treatment should you refuse vax & then become seriously ill from covid. If it was up to me treatment should be refused.

Freedom of choice does not mean freedom from consequences.

Too too simple hawk girl.The whole country is going to be subject back door mandatory vaccination even though they all said in the early days that mandatory vaccinations would not happen.Everyday another employer comes out and says NO jab NO Job.So how long before there won’t be a job that doesn’t reqiuire employees to be jabbed,then how long before shops start enforcing the same rule

So let me ask this question.

Why is it so verboten to counter the official narrative and subsequent actions by the governments, here and around the world?