Australia housing bubble

[FairmontGS]

Originally Posted by leesa

Superannuation isn't a burden to the taxpayers of Australia

Not a student of economics then... You're ok with one form of middle class welfare but down on the same tax breaks when applied to housing investment.

Originally Posted by FairmontGS

Not a student of economics then... You're ok with one form of middle class welfare but down on the same tax breaks when applied to housing investment.

How is superannuation a form of middle class welfare?

[FairmontGS]

Originally Posted by leesa

How is superannuation a form of middle class welfare?

When I put money in super I only pay 15% tax where I’d normally be paying ~37% to the national tax revenue. I also get the same concession on earnings in the fund and withdrawals are tax free.

Given that this is a fact, why are you not demonising superannuation like you are property investment?

Originally Posted by FairmontGS

When I put money in super I only pay 15% tax where I’d normally be paying ~37% to the national tax revenue. I also get the same concession on earnings in the fund and withdrawals are tax free.

Given that this is a fact, why are you not demonising superannuation like you are property investment?

Your super contributions don't affect an industry that people rely on for one of the basic necessities of life. The housing industry is subject to supply and demand, which is why this thread is full of people giddy at their valuations going up. I don't think your super contributions will have that kind of pull on the market, it's not going to result in a breastfeeding mother sleeping in her car or first home buyers being outbid at auctions. It doesn't seem like an equal comparison to me.

Originally Posted by danzvtil

The main issue with deals like this is finance and legals. Youd think only having 50% of the debt means 50% of the risk, but if one couple stops paying or splits up, the bank is still going to want 100% of the weekly payment from the remaining party, they can’t repossess half a house.

Sounds good if it works out but sounds like so much could go wrong. What if one person wants to sell and the other refuses? Or what if it's sold to someone you don't want to live with? Whose name does the mortgage go in? What if that person goes rogue and stops making repayments and you get kicked out of your house?

[b0son]

Originally Posted by FairmontGS

When I put money in super I only pay 15% tax where I’d normally be paying ~37% to the national tax revenue.

It's not income at that stage, so why would it be taxed at 37%.

I also get the same concession on earnings in the fund and withdrawals are tax free.

Compared to 18.5% on the property's capital gain. Granted, the deposit (if you paid one rather than using equity) comes out of post-tax funds, but the overall rate of taxation still ends up being less than super (unless you're putting down a 30% deposit). Meanwhile, if the property is negative-geared, you're also reducing the amount of income taxed at 37%, or dropping it a bracket entirely.

Now if you'd highlighted some of the lump sum deposit concessions available to the well-heeled..... yep, I'd agree.

[FairmontGS]

Originally Posted by leesa

Your super contributions don't affect an industry that people rely on for one of the basic necessities of life. The housing industry is subject to supply and demand, which is why this thread is full of people giddy at their valuations going up. I don't think your super contributions will have that kind of pull on the market, it's not going to result in a breastfeeding mother sleeping in her car or first home buyers being outbid at auctions. It doesn't seem like an equal comparison to me.

I’d like to keep this on an objective level rather than emotive as per your reply. Things will go easier if we can agree that and stay on topic.

Given that around 40% of superannuation investment is in property then it’s like a double demonic isn’t it? Tax concessions on investments on properties inside a federally sanctioned tax shelter.

I’m interested as to why you think Superannuation is not similar to property investment?

[b0son]

Originally Posted by FairmontGS

Given that around 40% of superannuation investment is in property then it’s like a double demonic isn’t it?

Only 8% according to ASFA, as at Sep 2021.

Maybe you mean in SMSF's? 40% wouldnt surprise me there.

Originally Posted by FairmontGS

I’d like to keep this on an objective level rather than emotive as per your reply. Things will go easier if we can agree that and stay on topic.

Given that around 40% of superannuation investment is in property then it’s like a double demonic isn’t it? Tax concessions on investments on properties inside a federally sanctioned tax shelter.

I’m interested as to why you think Superannuation is not similar to property investment?

I have no idea what argument you're making, FairmontGS. The original point was about compulsory superannuation contributions, how did we get from there to middle class welfare to superannuation investment in property?

[FairmontGS]

Originally Posted by leesa

I have no idea what argument you're making, FairmontGS. The original point was about compulsory superannuation contributions, how did we get from there to middle class welfare to superannuation investment in property?

I know. Got a bit difficult for you didn’t it.

[GO FURTHER]

Originally Posted by danzvtil

The main issue with deals like this is finance and legals. Youd think only having 50% of the debt means 50% of the risk, but if one couple stops paying or splits up, the bank is still going to want 100% of the weekly payment from the remaining party, they can’t repossess half a house.

This is true, and the arrangement is not without risks for sure.

But, in a way, the risk is no different to the many thousands of "Mums & Dads" who have gone guarantor on the mortgages of their kids, so they could get into the housing market.

If young Johnny loses his job and stops paying, the bank is going to go after mum and dad 100%.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Last weekend I was going to attend this auction:



Agent told me that expectation was 'around $1.4 million'. I toyed with the idea of buying and eventually adding a second story.

Glad I didn't go to the auction.

Then this gem below:



Was very tempted... It needed a garage and I questioned the agent as to why the previous owners removed the fireplace from the living room (the flue was still poking up through the roof).

I think this sort of practice is very misleading... they know full well what sort of interest and offers a property is going to get before the auction and they purposely bait buyers to attend with BS like 'come and get a bargain' then it sells for near $200k above expectations.

A buyer with $800k thinks they are in with a fighting chance and miss out on other places they may have got.

Another agent messaged me at around 5:20pm to tell me he has stalled the online auction for another place I inspected 10 days ago and asked me if I wanted to buy for $xyz K and was happy to sell to me at that price.

I'm sure he sent that same message to 30 other people...

I would have replied 'sure, no worries'.. only to then get another messages 10 minutes later saying I have been trumped by $5k...

But, here is the problem. After my inspection I told the agent I was not at all interested in this place, and that opinion was confirmed again a few days ago when I got another 'courtesy call' reminding me of the online auction.

I get that the nature of the game at this point in time but I'm a buyer that has money to spend but will now hold off from looking because I feel I'm wasting my time with the above sort of BS.

And the digital manipulation of images is getting beyond the joke, as well as the misleading 'attributes' of properties for sale.

One 3br unit townhouse style unit I looked at included the large grassed common area of the complex as the private yard of the property for sale.

Yet hit the 'report listing' button and nothing changes...

I do have my eye on another place coming up at the end of the month. See what happens.

[Mulva]

Glad you clarified/gave context by adding "of images" at the end of "digital manipulation" lol. That ****s me too - so many pics are so obviously 'stretched' horizontally.

Sydney prices still shock me as I am conditioned to what you get for your dollar in Radelaide...but then I guess that is the same as someone being shocked by Adelaide prices compared to what their dollar gets in regional SA.

But even then your dollar is getting less and less in Adelaide's burbs with each passing month...

In June this year this 4-bed 2-bath joint in Greenwith, large block but half of it (in my opinion) wasted went for $920k: https://www.realestate.com.au/sold/p...with-136642618

6 months earlier, same suburb but bigger block, 5-bed 3-bath, better/more usable grounds (in my opinion), better views and more importantly a shed I would die for, only $5k more than the one above: https://www.realestate.com.au/sold/p...with-134757494

Only 6 months and $5k difference between the 2

Originally Posted by FairmontGS

I know. Got a bit difficult for you didn’t it.

Got a bit difficult to stick within the rules when you move the goalposts. Compulsory superannuation is not middle class welfare and there was nothing stopping hayseed from making voluntary superannuation contributions instead of an investment property portfolio.

[hayseed]

Originally Posted by leesa

there was nothing stopping hayseed from making voluntary superannuation contributions .

That's exactly what I've been Doing, Straight into our SMSF...

[Mulva]

Originally Posted by leesa

Got a bit difficult to stick within the rules when you move the goalposts. Compulsory superannuation is not middle class welfare and there was nothing stopping hayseed from making voluntary superannuation contributions instead of an investment property portfolio.

And nothing stopped him creating an investment property portfolio, which likely outperformed most super funds while giving him access to capital/equity he can access before old age.

But that will all change soon - your posts here are so close to changing the system, changing policy, and changing the minds of property investors.

[Citroënbender]

I think FOMO will be a strong contender for the Macquarie Dictionary’s “Word of the Year” next.

[PG2]

What's happening here? Everyone sick of the COVID thread so they thought they would come over here and start?

Once again, I find members having pot shots at other members. leesa is not having pot shots any anyone else personally so it would be appreciated if others don't keep having personal pot shots at her.

FWIW, leesa has not reported any posts in here but it seems as soon as she says something even remotely out of line my inbox fills up.

Russ deleted 32 posts the other day, and this being on top of Raptor and myself deleting a few, however, this does not seem to be working. Come on everyone, don't back us into a corner where we start handing out warnings.

[Citroënbender]

YF, curious as to the value now of the house you sold a while back - has it gone up much?

[Mulva]

Hope he doesn't mind me saying but YF shared that house with me a while back and OMG it was freakin' awesome...the design, it's size, balance of form and function, decor and fittings, where it was, etc...only time I've ever looked at NSW real estate and thought it was worth that price and then some - seriously impressive.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

YF, curious as to the value now of the house you sold a while back - has it gone up much?

Probably worth more but it was always a hard one to gauge. Never built it to sell and had attributes that made it hard to value.

No regrets selling it and wouldn't change anything.

I'm in a far far better place financially and mentally, that's worth far more to me than having one of the biggest houses in the area.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Mulva

Hope he doesn't mind me saying but YF shared that house with me a while back and OMG it was freakin' awesome...the design, it's size, balance of form and function, decor and fittings, where it was, etc...only time I've ever looked at NSW real estate and thought it was worth that price and then some - seriously impressive.

Thanks.

Is this ontopic for this thread? What's with all the photoshopping going on? This one has had the grass completely replaced. At what point does it become misrepresentation?

https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...eham-137797322

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by leesa

Is this ontopic for this thread? What's with all the photoshopping going on? This one has had the grass completely replaced. At what point does it become misrepresentation?

https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...eham-137797322

image

image

Send them a message thanking them for leaving the original photos there so you can compare them to the (badly) photoshopped ones

[Citroënbender]

A tidy return likely for someone:

“Sold February 1998 $130 000”


https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...leham-vic-3064

[Giant Cranium]

Originally Posted by leesa

Is this ontopic for this thread? What's with all the photoshopping going on? This one has had the grass completely replaced. At what point does it become misrepresentation?

https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...eham-137797322

image

image

the place we bought was like that, in the photos was perfect grass. reality was no grass and piles of bricks.

i actually told the real-estate that it was the biggest pile of house I've ever seen.

[PG2]

Originally Posted by leesa

Is this ontopic for this thread? What's with all the photoshopping going on? This one has had the grass completely replaced. At what point does it become misrepresentation?

https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...eham-137797322

image

image

I believe (ie I am not 100% sure) that they put a disclaimer in somewhere in the ad, "Pictures are for illustration purposes only"

[Citroënbender]

Originally Posted by PG2

I believe (ie I am not 100% sure) that they put a disclaimer in somewhere in the ad, "Pictures are for illustration purposes only"

That’s like food packets displaying “Serving Suggestion” or “Garnish not included”.

French real estate ads are often much grittier and realistic, at least in smaller sized towns. They don’t dwell on grunge, but it’s much more WYSIWYG.

https://www.leboncoin.fr/ventes_immo...2055293276.htm

[hayseed]

Originally Posted by leesa

Is this ontopic for this thread? What's with all the photoshopping going on? This one has had the grass completely replaced. At what point does it become misrepresentation?

https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...eham-137797322

image

image

The perpetual Digital Furniture does My Head in...

[Citroënbender]

Wondering how much it would cost to truck this from Byron Shire to Ganmain.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-11-...head/100611248

What a great platform for conversion to residential.