KIA outsells Ford in May

[XR Martin]

And if a Toyota part is not in the country they do offer express shipping.
Other brands are too bad so sad, it gets here however long it takes.

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Inventory costs are higher which is the bane of all corporate accountants but it keeps customers happy, not giving them a reason to look elsewhere is half of the battle.

And this is where an accountant with no understanding of sales doesn't get it...bad customer experience because the company has saved a few million in stock levels is lost many, many times over if the customer dumps you and bad mouths at every chance...the perfect example is Jeep, look where GC sales were and where they are now...and the public perception whether true or exaggerated has stuck....although their interior efforts on the all new model seem very impressive.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

And this is where an accountant with no understanding of sales doesn't get it...bad customer experience because the company has saved a few million in stock levels is lost many, many times over if the customer dumps you and bad mouths at every chance...the perfect example is Jeep, look where GC sales were and where they are now...and the public perception whether true or exaggerated has stuck....although their interior efforts on the all new model seem very impressive.

I would say to Ford,
By all means, look to good profits but please, remember the emotional buy in that generates those sales, some people will clearly pay overs to get the kind of vehicles they want. Why is it so hard for Ford and it’s accountants to understand this, we are a very different market to the UK, yet their choices determine what vehicles we get. Crazy…..

[Wretched]

Just in Time (JIT) process was developed by Toyota and has been adopted by all and sundry since. Unfortunately the pandemic has exposed one big chink in the armour of JIT, it only works well if manufacturing and freight are not inhibited.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Wretched

Just in Time (JIT) process was developed by Toyota and has been adopted by all and sundry since. Unfortunately the pandemic has exposed one big chink in the armour of JIT, it only works well if manufacturing and freight are not inhibited.

Toyota discovered JIT has its problems too and adapted years ago, despite following Toyota's lead with JIT, other manufacturers didnt recognise the problems Toyota did and are now paying the price for ignorance.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by jpd80

I would say to Ford,
By all means, look to good profits but please, remember the emotional buy in that generates those sales, some people will clearly pay overs to get the kind of vehicles they want. Why is it so hard for Ford and it’s accountants to understand this, we are a very different market to the UK, yet their choices determine what vehicles we get. Crazy…..

Maverick, Bronco, Bronco Sport and Explorer would all have been ideal for the Australian market. So sad Ford headquarters can't see the potential these products would have had outside the USA.

[CyberWasp]

I have been watching Bronco videos and I want one.
A factory 4x4 with 35" Tyres from factory.
With all the electronic trickery it is unstoppable.
They would sell more of these than they would Everest easily, so it does not make sense.
If North America can't be bothered to supply other markets then expand their factory in Thailand.
I do not know how their share holders aren't peeved off. They do not get the most out of the platforms they develop.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Maverick, Bronco, Bronco Sport and Explorer would all have been ideal for the Australian market. So sad Ford headquarters can't see the potential these products would have had outside the USA.

I feel australia has always been treated as a backwater when it comes to Fords coming into the country (be it when the falcon was around and still now).

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Toyota discovered JIT has its problems too and adapted years ago, despite following Toyota's lead with JIT, other manufacturers didnt recognise the problems Toyota did and are now paying the price for ignorance.

Yes however what led to the change of not always following JIT principles and what other manufactures suffered the same disasters to their supply chain and then still did nothing about it...?

When has there ever been a situation where as a car manufacturer you tell your supplier I don't need as much item X for the next 3 month and then when you come back to order item X you find other unrelated industries have had massive jumps in demand and the global supply of said Item X is chopped by 30% due to a Japanese factory fire.
Toyota is good but it's not a crystal baller...

[prydey]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Maverick, Bronco, Bronco Sport and Explorer would all have been ideal for the Australian market. So sad Ford headquarters can't see the potential these products would have had outside the USA.

How many of those are built on a platform capable of rhd?

The cost of developing rhd for a tiny market is the reason we don't get the options that are available in lhd.

And Ford certainly aren't going to go by comments on a forum to determine possible demand... I. E. If they brought that here I would definitely buy one.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

Yes however what led to the change of not always following JIT principles and what other manufactures suffered the same disasters to their supply chain and then still did nothing about it...?

When has there ever been a situation where as a car manufacturer you tell your supplier I don't need as much item X for the next 3 month and then when you come back to order item X you find other unrelated industries have had massive jumps in demand and the global supply of said Item X is chopped by 30% due to a Japanese factory fire.
Toyota is good but it's not a crystal baller...

Im glad you ask

So what you're suggesting is that one manufacturer cant learn from another's experience, despite all those manufacturers learning from the Toyota model of JIT in the first place?

Lets think about how that plays out..
Hey Henry, look, Toyota are decreasing their parts on hand and saving money, lets do that..
Nek Minnit.
Hey Henry, look, Toyota have sacrificed profits to insulate against production supply problems, how much more can we ask for Ranger..

Toyota haven't been exposed to subsequent issues of that nature so why not accept it as an isolated event and continue on as they were?
They obviously discovered that it has its limitations

Do you need to fall from a cliff to believe its possible to fall from a cliff?

If, as car manufacturer, i had pre ordered x amount of those components and then cancelled my order on the spot leaving my supplier hanging, only to find out months later that my supplier is busy supplying customers that didnt bail on them, id be reaping what i had sewn.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Im glad you ask

So what you're suggesting is that one manufacturer cant learn from another's experience, despite all those manufacturers learning from the Toyota model of JIT in the first place?

Lets think about how that plays out..
Hey Henry, look, Toyota are decreasing their parts on hand and saving money, lets do that..
Nek Minnit.
Hey Henry, look, Toyota have sacrificed profits to insulate against production supply problems, how much more can we ask for Ranger..

Toyota haven't been exposed to subsequent issues of that nature so why not accept it as an isolated event and continue on as they were?
They obviously discovered that it has its limitations

Do you need to fall from a cliff to believe its possible to fall from a cliff?

If, as car manufacturer, i had pre ordered x amount of those components and then cancelled my order on the spot leaving my supplier hanging, only to find out months later that my supplier is busy supplying customers that didnt bail on them, id be reaping what i had sewn.

OEMs are super demanding and real flakey with how they order and then leave you holding the ball at their will.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by prydey

How many of those are built on a platform capable of rhd?

The cost of developing rhd for a tiny market is the reason we don't get the options that are available in lhd.

And Ford certainly aren't going to go by comments on a forum to determine possible demand... I. E. If they brought that here I would definitely buy one.

Bronco Sport and Maverick are on the C2 platform that is used on the Focus and Escape, both of which are made in LHD and RHD. Bronco Sport and Maverick being smaller would have been a good fit for European/UK markets, Australia and NZ could have piggybacked off this.

Bronco is built on the Ranger and Everest T6 platform. The unique design of this would have had appeal in many markets over the world and T6 platform vehicles are built in several plants across the world.

Ford are just lazy and not willing to take the risk. Ford can argue the numbers don't stack up but that doesn't explain why a multitude of other car companies that can supply to both LHD and RHD.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by prydey

How many of those are built on a platform capable of rhd?

The cost of developing rhd for a tiny market is the reason we don't get the options that are available in lhd.

And Ford certainly aren't going to go by comments on a forum to determine possible demand... I. E. If they brought that here I would definitely buy one.

From what I see, Maverick & Bronco Sport are on C2 shared with Escape and
rumour has it that FNA originally wanted to return Escape to the boxy Gen 1
style while keeping Kuga as a Focus replacement but then Farley and Hackett
wanted to double down on Bronco as a sub brand and so came Bronco Sport.


While no one expects Ford’s decisions to be swayed by random experts on a forum,
It wouldn’t hurt them to remember how we achieved a RHD Mustang throughout
the commonwealth and certain Asian countries. That wasn’t done on a whim,
it was done by stepping back and seeing the big picture…..

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Im glad you ask

So what you're suggesting is that one manufacturer cant learn from another's experience, despite all those manufacturers learning from the Toyota model of JIT in the first place?

Lets think about how that plays out..
Hey Henry, look, Toyota are decreasing their parts on hand and saving money, lets do that..
Nek Minnit.
Hey Henry, look, Toyota have sacrificed profits to insulate against production supply problems, how much more can we ask for Ranger..

Toyota haven't been exposed to subsequent issues of that nature so why not accept it as an isolated event and continue on as they were?
They obviously discovered that it has its limitations

Do you need to fall from a cliff to believe its possible to fall from a cliff?

If, as car manufacturer, i had pre ordered x amount of those components and then cancelled my order on the spot leaving my supplier hanging, only to find out months later that my supplier is busy supplying customers that didnt bail on them, id be reaping what i had sewn.

I think you missed my most salient point, take out 30% of global supply and everyone scrambles around to chase parts...how did Toyota know a fire was coming on top of Covid-19?

[prydey]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Bronco Sport and Maverick are on the C2 platform that is used on the Focus and Escape, both of which are made in LHD and RHD. Bronco Sport and Maverick being smaller would have been a good fit for European/UK markets, Australia and NZ could have piggybacked off this.

Bronco is built on the Ranger and Everest T6 platform. The unique design of this would have had appeal in many markets over the world and T6 platform vehicles are built in several plants across the world.

Ford are just lazy and not willing to take the risk. Ford can argue the numbers don't stack up but that doesn't explain why a multitude of other car companies that can supply to both LHD and RHD.

Originally Posted by jpd80

From what I see, Maverick & Bronco Sport are on C2 shared with Escape and
rumour has it that FNA originally wanted to return Escape to the boxy Gen 1
style while keeping Kuga as a Focus replacement but then Farley and Hackett
wanted to double down on Bronco as a sub brand and so came Bronco Sport.


While no one expects Ford’s decisions to be swayed by random experts on a forum,
It wouldn’t hurt them to remember how we achieved a RHD Mustang throughout
the commonwealth and certain Asian countries. That wasn’t done on a whim,
it was done by stepping back and seeing the big picture…..

Fair enough.

I guess the next question is would these models add revenue or just cannibalise existing sales?

Not asking for an answer. Just looking at the big picture.

[naddis01]

You can't cannibalise the non existent sales of the current line up.

[Dr Terry]

Originally Posted by XR Martin

Only thing is the two Carnival examples were pre-covid...

I didn't mention Covid. The parts shortage issue has been going downhill since the GFC (2008-09).

Dr Terry

[Hemihunter]

FORD CEO have never had the balls to go all in and prove that these imports are viable in Australian market. Until a Ford CEO has the balls it will always be "We are doing ok in Australia"

By the way i have an order on Ford USA for the New 150 2021 , it may end up being the New 2022 at this current rate of supply.

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Bronco Sport and Maverick are on the C2 platform that is used on the Focus and Escape, both of which are made in LHD and RHD. Bronco Sport and Maverick being smaller would have been a good fit for European/UK markets, Australia and NZ could have piggybacked off this.


Ford are just lazy and not willing to take the risk. Ford can argue the numbers don't stack up but that doesn't explain why a multitude of other car companies that can supply to both LHD and RHD.

correct unless they release Bronco Sport and Maverick for the European/UK markets in LHD its a pipe dream here.

[FTE217]

Originally Posted by jpd80

From what I see, Maverick & Bronco Sport are on C2 shared with Escape and
rumour has it that FNA originally wanted to return Escape to the boxy Gen 1
style while keeping Kuga as a Focus replacement but then Farley and Hackett
wanted to double down on Bronco as a sub brand and so came Bronco Sport.


While no one expects Ford’s decisions to be swayed by random experts on a forum,
It wouldn’t hurt them to remember how we achieved a RHD Mustang throughout
the commonwealth and certain Asian countries. That wasn’t done on a whim,
it was done by stepping back and seeing the big picture…..

The Big Picture was only to keep Mustang going period, its saving grace was adding supply to RHD markets and sharing the platform.
Its their biggest feather in their cap towards GM Dodge and their other Nth American competitors that Mustang has never stopped production........

The big picture also is american companies have their heads in the sand, nth america nth america whereas the asians/euros think smarter and open their eyes.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

I think you missed my most salient point, take out 30% of global supply and everyone scrambles around to chase parts...how did Toyota know a fire was coming on top of Covid-19?

They didnt, they didnt need to as they'd already learnt that a stockpile of essential outsourced componants was important inventory.

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by Hemihunter

By the way i have an order on Ford USA for the New 150 2021 , it may end up being the New 2022 at this current rate of supply.

If I may, what's the Landed cost after conversion?

[Poetic Justice]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Bronco is built on the Ranger and Everest T6 platform. The unique design of this would have had appeal in many markets over the world and T6 platform vehicles are built in several plants across the world.

Ford are just lazy and not willing to take the risk. Ford can argue the numbers don't stack up but that doesn't explain why a multitude of other car companies that can supply to both LHD and RHD.

I mean - the Wrangler has continually sold in Australia... what is different between it/Bronco/Ford/FCA that means Wrangler keeps coming RHD and Bronco wont?

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Poetic Justice

I mean - the Wrangler has continually sold in Australia... what is different between it/Bronco/Ford/FCA that means Wrangler keeps coming RHD and Bronco wont?

That is an interesting thought. Wranglers don't really sell. Actually the whole Jeep brand doesn't sell anymore. They sold like 5000 cars a year recently, after falling from about 30,000. Just been in absolute free fall.

Tried to find numbers of Wranglers sold per month, but had no luck. Can't be any more than about 100 a month. Which is bugger all. Makes me wonder why they even bother. But then you have to factor in how many RHD versions they sell globally. Those numbers are hard to find.

[Vesper Martini]

Good point Jeep has really failed here, dealerships have closed or downsized everywhere. they brought out that Gladiator ute which looked like it had promise but ive never seen one on the road..
seeing this wouldn't fill Ford with Encouragement

[jphanna]

Late last year I decided I would hand the FG XR6 to my son and suss out the mini SUV market. My only minimum requirement was it had to be able to tow a jet ski. I did the rounds at all the dealers. A lot of these vehicles were 1.6 or less. Not good enough for hills. The Seltos was 2.0. It was one of the better looking SUV (my opinion) and they threw in a factory tow bar in the price. It wasn’t that cheap compared to its rivals, within $1000.00, but the looks were the main driving factor.
The 3 or 4 visits I was there while test driving, negotiating and signing contracts, paying deposits etc, they were INUNDATED with customers and the sales guy told me they had no stock left in Australia and mine will be on the next boat out of Korea.
Over 4 visits the sales people were run off their feet. When I rolled up to pick mine up in January, 3 other cars were lined up to be picked up as well that morning. The Car is outstanding in
Comfort
Power (for a small SUV)
Features
Handling
No rattles, blemishes, squeaks or stupid small problems to chase the dealer with as I hear so many others do when purchased a new car.
Sure…….i am now driving an ‘invisible’ SUV along with the masses, but the FG XR6, is not too far away, if I feel the need to drive an Aussie made Legend.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by FTE217

The Big Picture was only to keep Mustang going period, its saving grace was adding supply to RHD markets and sharing the platform.
Its their biggest feather in their cap towards GM Dodge and their other Nth American competitors that Mustang has never stopped production........

The big picture also is american companies have their heads in the sand, nth america nth america whereas the asians/euros think smarter and open their eyes.

Seriously, one in every ten built is a RHD Mustang, so in overall terms it’s rather
small production in comparison to the domestic and international LHDs, that almost
every one of them are Premium GTs that go for top dollar really helps the bottom line.

The misperception Ford has is trying to just sell high series versions of main stream
vehicles sold by every other manufacturer. What Ford should be doing is offering
vehicles that Euros and Asians can’t match, those boxy SUVs and compact pickup.

[naddis01]

Originally Posted by Vesper Martini

Good point Jeep has really failed here, dealerships have closed or downsized everywhere. they brought out that Gladiator ute which looked like it had promise but ive never seen one on the road..
seeing this wouldn't fill Ford with Encouragement

The problem(s) with the Gladiator is the $70k starting price, torque less motor, cramped cabin, low towing capacity and pathetic payload. Plus the Jeep name is on the nose here.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by jphanna

Late last year I decided I would hand the FG XR6 to my son and suss out the mini SUV market. My only minimum requirement was it had to be able to tow a jet ski. I did the rounds at all the dealers. A lot of these vehicles were 1.6 or less. Not good enough for hills. The Seltos was 2.0. It was one of the better looking SUV (my opinion) and they threw in a factory tow bar in the price. It wasn’t that cheap compared to its rivals, within $1000.00, but the looks were the main driving factor.
The 3 or 4 visits I was there while test driving, negotiating and signing contracts, paying deposits etc, they were INUNDATED with customers and the sales guy told me they had no stock left in Australia and mine will be on the next boat out of Korea.
Over 4 visits the sales people were run off their feet. When I rolled up to pick mine up in January, 3 other cars were lined up to be picked up as well that morning. The Car is outstanding in
Comfort
Power (for a small SUV)
Features
Handling
No rattles, blemishes, squeaks or stupid small problems to chase the dealer with as I hear so many others do when purchased a new car.
Sure…….i am now driving an ‘invisible’ SUV along with the masses, but the FG XR6, is not too far away, if I feel the need to drive an Aussie made Legend.

The good thing about the market here is plenty of choice.

Hope your jet ski plus trailer don't weigh more than 1.1t

Also 110kw and 180Nm isn't exactly built for towing.

A Ford Escape would run rings around it in every department, alas there is no stock. I also acknowledge looks are a personal thing.