Police bash hoon drivers

[Windsor342ci]

Ive already posted in here earlier with my thoughts...

Reading through a few posts here Im kind of surprised people defending these officers in question though.

Clearly they where out of line, this can not be denied....

Im a very facts and numbers man.. For me, the facts is the evidence. The evidence is the video. I didnt not see a lead up, nor did I see a burnout. To call these guys houseo's or whatever is wrong. Sure it may be true. But it also may not be true. I can only go off the evidence I see at hand, and at hand all I see is 3 officers standing over 2 males on the ground with 2 officers pounding away. Nothing else... This being said, officers are guilty as charged.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by CRYHSV

Im a very facts and numbers man.. For me, the facts is the evidence. The evidence is the video. I didnt not see a lead up,.

But the boled part is critical to understanding...I agree it was OTT, beating anyone when they are cuffed (I think they were) in that way is not right.

The issue is no one here really knows what happened before. Im really surprised they did it at that spot, surely you would have done it on the the side of the car.

Perhaps not alot of IQ all around..but still, we do not know the facts.

[ratter]

We have no idea of what went on before hand or possibly what was being said by the guy on the ground.
Was he making threats?, was he taunting them? was he bragging about how the courts will give him a slap on the wrist and he'll be doing it again? who knows.

For him to be doing burn outs in front of the cop shop shows his level of respect for the law, if he has no respect for the law maybe he should fear it!

Did the cops do the wrong thing? by the letter of the law there is a good chance they did, but I think good on them, some people will not learn until they are hurt, seen it first hand, it's a shame these types of things have to happen but if the courts carried out correct sentencing then maybe there would be more respect and things like this may not occur

[Rodp]

Originally Posted by CRYHSV

Reading through a few posts here Im kind of surprised people defending these officers in question though.

Clearly they where out of line, this can not be denied....

Im a very facts and numbers man.. For me, the facts is the evidence. The evidence is the video. I didnt not see a lead up, nor did I see a burnout.

I defend them because I've personally seen the cause and effect of the 'phone book' method and I've witnessed the decline in force given to the 'Police Force'.

They're committing the crime so clearly the potential punishment isn't a deterrent.

Were they clearly out of line? For a couple of guys just doing a burnout, I would wholeheartedly agree. There's more to it than that from what I can tell.. so it's not 'clearly' out of line and you don't have all of the evidence. How can you make such a clear cut call?

Will they re-offend? I doubt it. One of them has apparently apologised. If he was the innocent victim in all this, why is he the one giving the apology?!

[Bossxr8]

At the end of the day all they did was a burnout, its not like they are rapists and pedos, but it seems like hoons are being held in the same regard today for some reason I can't understand.

If it was a pedo being bashed I really don't think anyone would care.

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

At the end of the day all they did was a burnout, its not like they are rapists and pedos, but it seems like hoons are being held in the same regard today for some reason I can't understand.

it isn't what they did, it is how they potentially did it

[JG65TE]

it would have been interesting to see a poll on this. my vote lays with the "hoons". That behaviour is apalling from the police, but sadly I have come to expect it of our blue boys. they really need to settle down and take a look at their image.

[Franco Cozzo]

I've had one dealing with police, when I totalled my new Focus, the copper was arrogant and condesending, when he told me the other guy was going to get charged for careless driving and i'll have to front up to court, I told him I didn't want to bother with pressing charges and just to let him go, as it was an unintentional accident and I was happy that we're both alive.

He went spastic, saying how because of him we're all standing in the middle of the freeway instead of being at home, and that I have no say in the matter because I'm the "victim".

That guy needed to remove the stick that is jammed up his clacker, if he doesn't like standing in the middle of the road attending accident scenes, why did he become a highway patrol copper?

The other policeman was much nicer.

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

I've had one dealing with police, when I totalled my new Focus, the copper was arrogant and condesending, when he told me the other guy was going to get charged for careless driving and i'll have to front up to court, I told him I didn't want to bother with pressing charges and just to let him go, as it was an unintentional accident and I was happy that we're both alive.

He went spastic, saying how because of him we're all standing in the middle of the freeway instead of being at home, and that I have no say in the matter because I'm the "victim".

That guy needed to remove the stick that is jammed up his clacker.

have you had to knock on someone's door and tell them their child is never coming home again
maybe he has and that is why he had no sympathy for the other driver. and no, you don't have a right to press charges in a standard traffic accident. you have a right to report it, but once reported, it is out of your hands

[ratter]

off topic slightly, but anytime the police are called to an accident in Vic, somebody has to be charged, best of advice in an accident that no body has been hurt is not to call the police, handle yourself if possible

[Tobey]

Unless its a civil matter, you dont have a choice - common misconception brought about by movies and TV shows...

[ZDI-970]

yes they are stupid for doing burnouts out the front of the cop shop, but i dont see why people are defending these police who used a weapon and intentionally beat the **** out of these two defenceless guys, who were cuffed and on the ground not fighting back? thats a dog act, and if a normal person did that they would get jail time, no questions asked... but the police get off with nothing, so i hope they get what they deserve... they give the rest of the police force a bad name, and not punnishing them for their actions is just plain ******...

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by gtxb67

have you had to knock on someone's door and tell them their child is never coming home again
maybe he has and that is why he had no sympathy for the other driver. and no, you don't have a right to press charges in a standard traffic accident. you have a right to report it, but once reported, it is out of your hands

Well if you don't like knocking on peoples door and telling them their child is never coming home again, don't sign up to be a police officer?

They knew what they where in for when they signed the contract, they made their bed so now they can lie in it.

Originally Posted by ratter

off topic slightly, but anytime the police are called to an accident in Vic, somebody has to be charged, best of advice in an accident that no body has been hurt is not to call the police, handle yourself if possible

I didn't have a choice because it happened right in front of the police, who where in the middle of pulling someone else over for speeding.

[Ben73]

Good to see these cops out of the job.
Sure these hoons were *********, but there is no need to beat them up while they are on the ground.

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Well if you don't like knocking on peoples door and telling them their child is never coming home again, don't sign up to be a police officer?

They knew what they where in for when they signed the contract, they made their bed so now they can lie in it.

you don't like parts of your job, why do you do it

you chose to move into another bed - lie in it





and you didn't have a choice with the cops showing up to your accident, because yours was towed, wasn't it

[PimpMyHubcap]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

I've had one dealing with police, when I totalled my new Focus, the copper was arrogant and condesending, when he told me the other guy was going to get charged for careless driving and i'll have to front up to court, I told him I didn't want to bother with pressing charges and just to let him go, as it was an unintentional accident and I was happy that we're both alive.

He went spastic, saying how because of him we're all standing in the middle of the freeway instead of being at home, and that I have no say in the matter because I'm the "victim".

That guy needed to remove the stick that is jammed up his clacker, if he doesn't like standing in the middle of the road attending accident scenes, why did he become a highway patrol copper?

The other policeman was much nicer.

In my opinion, this is one of the more offensive posts in this whole thread. Your accident was the fault of the guy moving the steering wheel in the wrong direction while driving the wrong way on a freeway right? What happens when he isnt charged or reprimanded and thinks to himself that he can do anything and get away with it? You are letting him do this. Please be a bit more responsible about letting police do their job and enforce the law.

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Well if you don't like knocking on peoples door and telling them their child is never coming home again, don't sign up to be a police officer?

They knew what they where in for when they signed the contract, they made their bed so now they can lie in it.

And if that guy that you wanted let off went and hurt someone else in an accident, would you feel bad about letting him off the first time? T & C`s stop me commenting any further about how much of a stupid comment that is. Go play in the little car area`s.

Originally Posted by Big Damo

I didn't have a choice because it happened right in front of the police, who where in the middle of pulling someone else over for speeding.

Thank god

Edit to include quote

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by ratter

off topic slightly, but anytime the police are called to an accident in Vic, somebody has to be charged, best of advice in an accident that no body has been hurt is not to call the police, handle yourself if possible

Thats absolute crap.

I was hit from the side and run off the road into a parked car, the other driver left the scene and the police didn't even bother writing a police report, despite the other driver crashing into me, leaving the scene without providing details etc, I even gave them the rego number and they didn't even bother to follow it up. Unless someone is hurt they don't bother anymore, the insurance company said it happens all the time.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by gtxb67

you don't like parts of your job, why do you do it

you chose to move into another bed - lie in it





and you didn't have a choice with the cops showing up to your accident, because yours was towed, wasn't it

I do my job because I walked into it, if it wasn't offered to me without having to do anything, I wouldn't be doing it. I'm there for the certificate at the end to say I can play with wires, thats it.

I didn't have a choice because the police saw the accident and yes both cars where towed away.

http://g.co/maps/7t5n2

Thats where it happened, so if you can explain how I t-boned the passenger side of another car, please be my guest.

[flappist]

Keep it civil and not personal guys.

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

I do my job because I walked into it, if it wasn't offered to me without having to do anything, I wouldn't be doing it. I'm there for the certificate at the end to say I can play with wires, thats it.

I didn't have a choice because the police saw the accident and yes both cars where towed away.

http://g.co/maps/7t5n2

Thats where it happened, so if you can explain how I t-boned the passenger side of another car, please be my guest.

you have missed the point entirely and i doubt yourself or others will ever get it


regarding your accident, why do i need to explain anything more about it. the fact is, once the call went out to the tow trucks, the cops knew about it. once the cops knew about it, they decide whether they charge anyone or not. i personally do not even care about those 2 points, so the rest of it holds no interest to me at all . . . sorry

[superyob]

There are some very valid points made on both sides of this argument. I think however, that no matter how 'civilised' or 'tolerant' society becomes, there are always deeply entrenched primeval instincts deep within our souls that cannot be repressed.

[SumoDog68]

With regards of what might of happened before the incident - that is irrelevant - "hoons" were arrested and police dont administer the punishment in our justice system.
Police , teachers , medical profession , firemen all have written And unwritten duty of care and trust of public vested in them.
Is it a valid excuse for a teacher to have relationship with their student even if it is voluntary and student initiated it ? NO
Do police bash you while handcuffed and defencless for traffic offence or other?
They should NOT.
People who believe bashing is good as some people dont get it otherwise are wrong. You dont gain respect by bashing people .

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by SumoDog68

With regards of what might of happened before the incident - that is irrelevant - "hoons" were arrested and police dont administer the punishment in our justice system

if i went to your house and deliberately antagonised you. if i did not care about the warnings you gave and kept doing it, would you just gently hold me until the police came around to arrest me - just so i would be let off by a court that is "supposed" to administer justice . . . . probably not

police are human too. whether they should or should not do certain stuff is irrelevant. more often than not, they meet up with idiots whose only purpose in life is to antagonise them to some point. sometimes even they get sick of it, and go beyond what is considered right. and that is the idiot's fault in my opinion. they know what will happen, they receive warnings beforehand and yet they still keep going. i do not know what happened in this situation, but depending on what happened before hand, i do not have a problem with it. i have never had the cops even touch me, so i don't understand why so many people minding their own business receive unprovoked attacks from police officers

[Lotte]

Originally Posted by gtxb67

if i went to your house and deliberately antagonised you. if i did not care about the warnings you gave and kept doing it, would you just gently hold me until the police came around to arrest me - just so i would be let off by a court that is "supposed" to administer justice . . . . probably not

I'm pretty sure that in victoria being antagonised is not grounds to belt the crap outta somebody, let alone somebody who is in cuffs, and no longer poses a threat to you, anymore. The whole "he provoked me" thing was getting used to much, and the courts started throwing that excuse out the window long ago.
IF however in your eaxmple, person had been asked to leave, and refused, you are allowed to use reasonable force to remove them. how do I know? sadly I've had to check with the local cops a few times, to make sure my **** is covered when removing people from my house....

BUT. The point here is not, we are all human blah blah blah. When in uniform the police are there to uphold the law, not deliver justice and most certainly nto break the law. If they were in physical danger, yes, batons and beatings would be necessary, the point here is not that the guys were/weren't antagonising them, and "deserved it", the point is, they were cuffed and on the ground = No longer a threat. chuck em in the van, throw them in lock up (if necessary), and impound their vehicle. It's what the Police are lawfully MEANT to do.

Sadly, as I've stated before in this thread, in small country towns, cops are often overstretched, moreso than what cops in the cities are, because there aren't enough people (****, I know one small town that has all of two cops, and need to borrow officers from the next biggest town to cover holidays). Also, in small country towns, like Mansfield, everyone knows everyone, who their friends are, who their parents are, when they eat, where they live, when their regular bowel movement is, you get the picture. It's a sad state of affairs, but there's no point in denying it, there will be cops who already despise certain members of the community for whatever reason, and even if it is a case of "you got off that charge I know you were guilty of, here's a beating when you're doing something less severe for good measure", it's not acceptable.


Yes, Police know what they're in for when they sign up for the job.
No, that doesn't mean that dealing with the crap they deal with is easy.
Yes, often they're chucked back in the work force due to shortages way to early after suffering PTSD.
No, that doesn't mean they get to take it out on the rest of us if they're having a **** day.

[SEZ213]

Originally Posted by gtxb67

if i went to your house and deliberately antagonised you. if i did not care about the warnings you gave and kept doing it, would you just gently hold me until the police came around to arrest me - just so i would be let off by a court that is "supposed" to administer justice . . . . probably not

I would shut the door...and if that fails...then I can use reasonable force to remove you (I've checked this one with my BIL).

Irregardless of what happened in those prior moments, the evidence which has been shown indicates 'excessive force' on two people who are on the ground...

At the end of the day, the assumption that they would be 'let off by the court' is not for the police men in question to decide.

I'm in full agreeance with lotski on this one...

[au2000]

with this, i'd highly suggest that the 2 individuals who copped the hiding are probably well know to the local constabulary, i'd even suggest that their actions initally were a dig at the local boys over some other matter & that although does not justify the outcome, probably indicates that there would have been some provocation....
do i agree with the hiding, no, do i understand it, yes...
after all how many of us have done burnouts etc in the past? any of us think it's a great idea to do it out the front of a police station?

[ratter]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Thats absolute crap.

I was hit from the side and run off the road into a parked car, the other driver left the scene and the police didn't even bother writing a police report, despite the other driver crashing into me, leaving the scene without providing details etc, I even gave them the rego number and they didn't even bother to follow it up. Unless someone is hurt they don't bother anymore, the insurance company said it happens all the time.

Ok, so the cops that have told me that were telling me lies, see we can't trust them at all can we

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by lotski

I'm pretty sure that in victoria being antagonised is not grounds to belt the crap outta somebody, let alone somebody who is in cuffs, and no longer poses a threat to you, anymore.

but it happens - i am not suggesting what was done was right, but if i provoked someone and they warned me and then i kept going and they beat me to a pulp, then it would be my fault - they may not be correct, but i was the one who started it

Originally Posted by Sezzy

I would shut the door...and if that fails...then I can use reasonable force to remove you (I've checked this one with my BIL)..

without trying to sound sexist, you are female - many males would not do that. they would use what many would consider unreasonable force long before shutting the door failed

Originally Posted by HEMI POWER

Both parties in the wrong but the guys who are suppose to uphold the law should of known better they should be sacked.

agree entirely, but if one wrong did not happen, there is a very good chance the 2nd wrong would not have. for some reason that seems to be lost on many people



for some reason police are considered total mongrels, but are supposed to act like angels. they cannot win can they

and yet again, i have never had a problem with a copper, from hooning around a car park, to dragging in the fog - got let off both times. but then i show respect to them and it is always shown back. 2 wrongs don't make a right, but if the first wrong never happened, then more often than not the 2nd would not either

[HEMI POWER]

Both parties in the wrong but the guys who are suppose to uphold the law should of known better they should be sacked.

[Lotte]

Originally Posted by gtxb67

but it happens - i am not suggesting what was done was right, but if i provoked someone and they warned me and then i kept going and they beat me to a pulp, then it would be my fault - they may not be correct, but i was the one who started it

for some reason police are considered total mongrels, but are supposed to act like angels. they cannot win can they

Except, as I stated, in the eyes of the law, that is no longer the case. It's not a case of deserving it, morally right or wrong. It's about the law, how it applies to everyone, and noone restrained should ever be beaten by anyone, let alone a cop. It's about personal restraint, of which, as an officer, you need to prove you have more of than joe blow

I don't consider all police to be total mongrels, nor do I expect them to act like angels (I don't think anyone really does, except the scumbags they put in prison). But I do expect them to uphold the law, show restraint, and be responsible citizens. Just like I expect anyone else to.

Originally Posted by gtxb67

and yet again, i have never had a problem with a copper, from hooning around a car park, to dragging in the fog - got let off both times. but then i show respect to them and it is always shown back. 2 wrongs don't make a right, but if the first wrong never happened, then more often than not the 2nd would not either

Well done, you've dealt with the good side of cops. As I have I (personally), but I've seen firsthand the ******** side of some of them, and personally believe they should be held responsible for their actions just like the rest of us. Is it ok for me to go 'Oh hey, you're mates got you in a headlock to stop you from being a dick, here, I'll smash your head in anyway with a brick"? No. It isn't. It's the same principle. It can be painted as "antagonising", "deserved", "unpaid justice" as much as you want, doesn't change the fact that the Police know when they walk into the job, they are role models. And that's essentially what it comes down to.