Tax the rich?

[comagutsa]

Originally Posted by mcnews

And when the holes in the ground are empty and half of WA defaults on their house/boat loans then the situation will reverse :-)
Personally, the states are all an absolute crock and a complete waste of time. All this state gets this that state gets that is all a load of crap. It's one country for pity sake.

oh i agree with you on all the states
not in our or our kids life time will the ground be empty ..**** load of iron ore still in ground . but the rest of the world will be in the same boat then fun time ahead haha

[BHDOGS]

disability pension twice as much as newstart? haha your taking the **** arnt you heres the facts. There ya go now pay your rent food and bills out of that and your car and rego maybe sprinkle a little around for that top shelf wine at that fancy restaurant. Seriously real disabled people get ******* shafted hard.

Maximum payment rates of the Disability Support Pension if you are over 21, or under 21 with children Maximum rate per fortnight
Single $766.00
A member of a couple $577.40 each or
$1,154.80 combined
Couple separated due to ill health $766.00 each

and if you happy to be a disabled person under 21 the princely sum for u of.

If you are under 21 with no children Maximum rate per fortnight
single, under 18, at home $345.00
single, under 18, independent $532.60
single, 18–20 years, at home $391.00
single, 18–20 years, independent $532.60
A member of a couple, up to age 20 $532.60

[Pub247]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

So after 5 pages the idea is to close Centrelink and condemn the religious institutions that support the needy.
Why not, Centrelink are incompetent fools who only hand out tax payers money to welfare cheats and single mothers with multiple dependants.
And I don't need a soup kitchen.

Quick, someone give Tony and Joe a call and inform them that all is well, Australian Ford Forums has the answer.

Has anyone bothered to ask why its so easy to get a DSP or Carers pension these days.
Has anyone wondered why the Baby Bonus was introduced.

I'll give you a hint, the ease at which you can become disabled or a carer of the disabled allows the powers that be to hide the true state of our unemployment situation.
If everyone who wasn't entitled to a DSP or carer pension went onto Newstart our unemployment figures would rise considerably.

So don't give them Newstart you say, easy.
No, there are something like 800,000 people seeking work in Australia at present, there are only 600,000 positions to fill and that's before the entire auto manufacturing industry closes and takes with it 10's of thousands of jobs.

We already have a shortfall without all those DSP and Carer cheats joining the queue.

Now lets look at the baby Bonus, why would a Government pay people to reproduce.
Could it be because our population is ageing and an influx was needed to square up the ledger.
Could it be to help support the housing market when the negative gearing baby boomers decide to sell.

In the very near future this country will need a lot of people to wipe a lot of ***** in nursing homes.
It will also need someone to buy that self funded retirement portfolio.

I never said (and im the only on to mention centrelink) to close centrelink i just said they're useless and as a very important part of the welfare system they need to be able to do their job properly and they can't.


If the carer payment for disability carer is so easy to get how come my mother can't get one?

My mum can only work part time due to my sister going to school and yes its a special school that she had to move into catchment area so she could attend. Anyway what happens when my sister no longer attends school my mum is going to have to quit her job to look after her.

There is no day care for disabled people sure there's respite care but the cost is astronomical so much so that it unaffordable on a daily basis. Pretty soon my mum will be in a situation where she can no longer work and wil be not entitled to any carers pension. The goverment says my sister does not need a carer because she is not disabled enough. Seriously would you leave a disabled persion with the mentality of a 3 year old to fend for themselves?

My mum has spent almost 30 years of her life working for the QLD goverment as a social worker, running foster care for hundreds of children, being a youth worker and working with disabled people.

Yet she about to get ****** over by the same people.

Clearly the welfare system as stated many times in this thread is broken. It's clearly favour people who do not wish to work and rather make babies who will have no better prospect than their parents. And screws the people who really need the systems and who in some way deserve more than others

[BHDOGS]

i feel your pain mate i was a carer for my dad for 5 years its a hell of a job and one that doesnt get enough credit unfortunate a few **********s fake it and get on it and then everybody jumps up and down how its a rort and as usual its always the real people who dont rort the system that pay the price never the dodgy ****s.

[mcnews]

Originally Posted by BHDOGS

disability pension twice as much as newstart? haha your taking the **** arnt you heres the facts. There ya go now pay your rent food and bills out of that and your car and rego maybe sprinkle a little around for that top shelf wine at that fancy restaurant. Seriously real disabled people get ******* shafted hard.

Maximum payment rates of the Disability Support Pension if you are over 21, or under 21 with children Maximum rate per fortnight
Single $766.00
A member of a couple $577.40 each or
$1,154.80 combined
Couple separated due to ill health $766.00 each

and if you happy to be a disabled person under 21 the princely sum for u of.

If you are under 21 with no children Maximum rate per fortnight
single, under 18, at home $345.00
single, under 18, independent $532.60
single, 18–20 years, at home $391.00
single, 18–20 years, independent $532.60
A member of a couple, up to age 20 $532.60

Genuine question though. Is that not a lot more than newstart?

[BHDOGS]

Newstart is 550 a fortnight

[XBROO]

No it's 470 a fortnight I'm on it now.

[mcnews]

I think it changes a lot with age and things too perhaps, a bit like the DSP. I know it sounds totally impossible to live on unless you were under a parents roof or something.

[BHDOGS]

Its not living its surviving people like to bang on about lazy ppl rorting the system but the 800 dollar tax hike a year the government wants to impose that they cry about having to pay is what real disabled people live on fortnightly puts things into perspective pretty easily really. On newstart i couldn't even afford to pay the rent i pay for my house a fortnight. Yet people seem to think these people are living some sort of charmed life being able to sit at home all day with there buckets of money smoking drugs. Realistically its actually hell a debt trap to lock you in and keep you down. As for the rates

If you are: Your maximum fortnightly payment is:
single, no children $510.50
single, with a dependent child or children $552.40
single, aged 60 or over, after nine continuous months on payment $552.40
partnered (each) $460.90

I had a two kids when i was on it hence they gave me an extra 40 bucks a fortnight very helpful.

[XBROO]

Well I'm 41 and a wife with 2 kids, she grosses 700 a fortnight. I'm not complaining I'm glad to get some of my taxes back after 23 years in the work force.

[2011G6E]

I'll pay the extra tax happily...on one condition.

When it's all over, when the "temporary period" () is over and the budget is somehow saved, I don't want to hear or read one more fricking word in the media or hear from whinging social engineers whining about people making big wages. Those 4% to 5% of us wage earners who have to pay will have, apparently, "saved the country", so from that point on deserve nothing but thanks from a grateful nation by that reasoning.

In fact I should be able to walk into a Centerlink and have them bow at my feet in abject thanks.

[BHDOGS]

I should be a politician ive done a better job then all of them put together haha

[mechanic]

Lively Q&A tonight on this subject.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by mechanic

Lively Q&A tonight on this subject.

Very ...... couldn't understand what the uni students were chanting. "We want things for free!!! Give me free things!" ....... or something along those lines

[gtfpv]

well after reading all the rewplies in this thread , i've come to the conclusion that mostr people want the same thing , and most people dont realise that the rich are paying tax too .
What we all seem to want is a fairer tax system , where big corperations pay more tax , richer people who have succeeded through negative gearing to unload and pay thier tax , /and or not receive tax incentives anymore .
welfare to be be MEANS TESTED MUCH MORE BROADLY , MUCH LESS BUREAUCRATIC SPENDING ,
I'LL GO ONE STEP FURTHER AND SAY GET RID OF STAMP DUTIES ON THE HOME AND LOANS !!!!! that would create more turnover .

sounds very socialist to me , and i'm not being smart , it also has right wing priciples where you work you earn , and labor broad based welfare , with the right to earn a decent living .

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by BHDOGS

Its not living its surviving people like to bang on about lazy ppl rorting the system but the 800 dollar tax hike a year the government wants to impose that they cry about having to pay is what real disabled people live on fortnightly puts things into perspective pretty easily really. On newstart i couldn't even afford to pay the rent i pay for my house a fortnight. Yet people seem to think these people are living some sort of charmed life being able to sit at home all day with there buckets of money smoking drugs. Realistically its actually hell a debt trap to lock you in and keep you down. As for the rates

If you are: Your maximum fortnightly payment is:
single, no children $510.50
single, with a dependent child or children $552.40
single, aged 60 or over, after nine continuous months on payment $552.40
partnered (each) $460.90

I had a two kids when i was on it hence they gave me an extra 40 bucks a fortnight very helpful.

Spot on, gee its not too often we agree.

We are a single income family, my wife works full time and takes home $1300 per fortnight.
Her hours are 6am to 2pm.
I stay home with our 2 yr old as well as get our older 3 off to school.
I personally get the grand total of $119 per fortnight from Centrelink.

Not much hey.
But that doesn't stop people looking down on me or implying that I am a dole bludger.

[mcnews]

My partner has been out of work for nine months but we never considered going to centrelink. Looks as though they might have a bank job before end of month though now so all good.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

I stay home with our 2 yr old as well as get our older 3 off to school.
I personally get the grand total of $119 per fortnight from Centrelink.

Not much hey.
But that doesn't stop people looking down on me or implying that I am a dole bludger.

You know what REALLY ***** me, and this is probably going to hurt some people here on the forum but here goes:

People who have kids, but then both parents work full time and the kids get dumped on the child care center, then the people complain about child care costs.

Is it your kid or the child care center's kid? Because you aren't raising them, the child care center is.

Then once they reach school age they spend the majority of their time at school so again parents having nothing to do with their kids because they're both at work, they only wake them up, feed them, send them to school, feed them again at dinner time then make them go to bed.

There should be one parent who stays home and looks after the kid, I don't care if its the mother or father, call me old fashioned but thats how my parents did it raising me and my sister, I didn't get dumped in some child care center for them to raise me.

Makes me feel like people just have children to complete an image of a successfull family with a house in the suburbs, 2 cars and 2 kids, but the kids spend more time at the day care center than at home.

[Ford_The_Win]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

You know what REALLY ***** me, and this is probably going to hurt some people here on the forum but here goes:

People who have kids, but then both parents work full time and the kids get dumped on the child care center, then the people complain about child care costs.

Is it your kid or the child care center's kid? Because you aren't raising them, the child care center is.

Then once they reach school age they spend the majority of their time at school so again parents having nothing to do with their kids because they're both at work, they only wake them up, feed them, send them to school, feed them again at dinner time then make them go to bed.

There should be one parent who stays home and looks after the kid, I don't care if its the mother or father, call me old fashioned but thats how my parents did it raising me and my sister, I didn't get dumped in some child care center for them to raise me.

Makes me feel like people just have children to complete an image of a successfull family with a house in the suburbs, 2 cars and 2 kids, but the kids spend more time at the day care center than at home.

Yes I agree with you Damo. It seems pointless to have kids and then pay someone else to look after them. If both parents need to work maybe they should hold off on buying the new 3D TV or downsize their house. Look at all these new houses going up, they've all got 7 bedrooms, a rumpus room and a parent's retreat (what the hell is a rumpus room??). I like having money and a comfortable lifestyle and would not be prepared to give that up for children which is probably why I've never had them nor will (that and the fact that I hate kids)

[mechanic]

Originally Posted by Auslandau

Very ...... couldn't understand what the uni students were chanting. "We want things for free!!! Give me free things!" ....... or something along those lines

From the ABC site this morning, this is what was chanted:-

More brains- Not warplanes- Fund education
Also
No cuts- No Fees- No corporate universities
And
Chris Pyne, get out. We know what you're all about. Cuts. Job losses. Money for the bosses.

[Trump]

Unless govco scraps the HECS/HELP system and has the universities invoicing the students directly, the protestors don't have much to whinge about (unless their whinging is about the pre-HECS days when university was free for everyone).

Was the free uni sustainable back then?

[cheap]

Originally Posted by mechanic

From the ABC site this morning, this is what was chanted:-

More brains- Not warplanes- Fund education
Also
No cuts- No Fees- No corporate universities
And
Chris Pyne, get out. We know what you're all about. Cuts. Job losses. Money for the bosses.

What's the bet they're associated with Getup which for some reason is a 'not for profit' entity and pays no tax! A consequence of the age entitlement on national TV, beware of these left wing people who basically will stop at nothing to get their grubby hands on whatever they want. They are not warm fuzzy loving people. They will be tomorrows academics spreading their vile message to your kids.

[mechanic]

The entire HECS system and how students are funded is a very controversial subject and as much as people may not like Pyne he made some very salient points last night.
Seems like a lot of uni students didn't realise [ or didn't bother to research the subject ] that taxpayers still cover most of their uni expenses.

If we can believe Pyne [ does anybody believe politicians anymore? ] the average HECS debt is $16,000, to be paid off when, and only when the graduate earns $50,000 of more per annum.

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

There should be one parent who stays home and looks after the kid, I don't care if its the mother or father, call me old fashioned but thats how my parents did it raising me and my sister, I didn't get dumped in some child care center for them to raise me.

Makes me feel like people just have children to complete an image of a successfull family with a house in the suburbs, 2 cars and 2 kids, but the kids spend more time at the day care center than at home.

My wife used to have endless fun with government agencies when our kids were little and we got family benefits from social security (I wasn't making a lot of money at the time), and they would ask what her "profession" was. She would say "Housewife". They would hum and hah and say "I'll write "domestic duties" (or some such thing)", and she would firmly say "No, I'm a housewife...is there something wrong with that?", and the (usually female) counter staff in the office would visibly squirm. Because obviously for them from a feminist viewpoint there is no lower job on earth than "housewife"....

Anyone else remember "married mans tax rates"? Back before there were so many family payments, if you were married (or defacto) and only one partner worked (didn't matter if it was the man or woman), you paid a lot less tax than a couple where both man and woman worked. It was great...if you, like us, only had one income coming into the house and your wife was at home with the kids, you paid maybe 2/3rds the tax of someone whose wife was out at work as well.
Then they said it was "unfair", and that it discriminated against double income families (somehow...), so they made everyone pay the same tax rate, and brought in family benefits to be paid to the stay-at-home mother based on how many kids you had.
Of course, once your kids were grown up, you didn't go back to getting more money back in your tax...the benefits just stopped. Presumably to go on to other worthy individuals in society...

This was...briefly...spoken of lately, but it was soon squashed.


I'd still like to know why ordinary tax payers can't have access to things like income splitting, where if your wife doesn't work, you can divide your wage between the two of you (because that's essentially what happens now anyway with your wage) and you pay tax on the two lower amounts instead of one large amount. This would benefit people who only have one income.

[XBROO]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

You know what REALLY ***** me, and this is probably going to hurt some people here on the forum but here goes:

People who have kids, but then both parents work full time and the kids get dumped on the child care center, then the people complain about child care costs.

Is it your kid or the child care center's kid? Because you aren't raising them, the child care center is.

Then once they reach school age they spend the majority of their time at school so again parents having nothing to do with their kids because they're both at work, they only wake them up, feed them, send them to school, feed them again at dinner time then make them go to bed.

There should be one parent who stays home and looks after the kid, I don't care if its the mother or father, call me old fashioned but thats how my parents did it raising me and my sister, I didn't get dumped in some child care center for them to raise me.

Makes me feel like people just have children to complete an image of a successfull family with a house in the suburbs, 2 cars and 2 kids, but the kids spend more time at the day care center than at home.

You know how I solved that problem Damo? My missus works at the child care centre. And now she's looking at a teachers aid program at the school they started this year.

I muck around with my mates about being a dole bludger, but when I have gone to centrelink and seen what they really are. I didn't joke so much, you can see a lot of these people aren't ever planning on getting a job. Then you hear them complaining about their payments and their money. FFS it's not their money they haven't worked for it. They should have a bit more appreciation for the handout the government gives them.

I know I'm on the dole at the moment but it was unplanned, as I quit a job I hated and it was causing me stress which I was bring home with me. My kids used asked my wife 'why is daddy angry all the time'. So I knew it was time to quit. So I waited for christmas break and handed my notice in. Then over the break I got my HR license and started looking for work. I ended up getting a start as a garbo and the weekend before I was meant to start I come off my bike. I broke my Scaphoid bone in my wrist, now I've been in plaster for the last 8 weeks and I still got 3 to go.

Anyway I had no other option but to turn to the dole, as I have a mortgage and car payment to meet. One good thing is that the new job said to give them a call when I'm better and they still might have a job for me. So finger crossed until then.

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

Unless govco scraps the HECS/HELP system and has the universities invoicing the students directly, the protestors don't have much to whinge about (unless their whinging is about the pre-HECS days when university was free for everyone).

Was the free uni sustainable back then?

Yes it was most definately . And furthermore it was merit based . Plenty could not get in , you couldnt pay your way in like you can today.

[cheap]

Free Health Care, Free University, Free love. Heck two out of three ain't bad, we can thank Gough for sewing the seeds of entitlement - he was warned that it would send the country broke... The answer always seems to tax the rich (exactly who this represents is never clear), IMO the answer should be to unwind these flawed social experiments.

Interesting the UK's NHK is under the same stress and strains as Medicare and Obamacare is on a trajectory to add further misery to the US budget.

[mcnews]

Originally Posted by XBROO

You know how I solved that problem Damo? My missus works at the child care centre. And now she's looking at a teachers aid program at the school they started this year.

I muck around with my mates about being a dole bludger, but when I have gone to centrelink and seen what they really are. I didn't joke so much, you can see a lot of these people aren't ever planning on getting a job. Then you hear them complaining about their payments and their money. FFS it's not their money they haven't worked for it. They should have a bit more appreciation for the handout the government gives them.

I know I'm on the dole at the moment but it was unplanned, as I quit a job I hated and it was causing me stress which I was bring home with me. My kids used asked my wife 'why is daddy angry all the time'. So I knew it was time to quit. So I waited for christmas break and handed my notice in. Then over the break I got my HR license and started looking for work. I ended up getting a start as a garbo and the weekend before I was meant to start I come off my bike. I broke my Scaphoid bone in my wrist, now I've been in plaster for the last 8 weeks and I still got 3 to go.

Anyway I had no other option but to turn to the dole, as I have a mortgage and car payment to meet. One good thing is that the new job said to give them a call when I'm better and they still might have a job for me. So finger crossed until then.

HTFU princess motorbike racers go racing days after breaking scaphoids :-)

Seriously though, that is a bugger of a bone to break and takes ages to come really right.

[XBROO]

Originally Posted by mcnews

HTFU princess motorbike racers go racing days after breaking scaphoids :-)

Seriously though, that is a bugger of a bone to break and takes ages to come really right.

Haha thanks Trev, I still rode the bike and didn't cut the ride short as I was hoping it was just sprained. Then that night it just wasn't getting better so I went to the the hospital. Yes I heard they take a while, they put a pin in it about 4 weeks after I did it. Which I wish they just did it straight away.

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by gtfpv

Yes it was most definately . And furthermore it was merit based . Plenty could not get in , you couldnt pay your way in like you can today.

And there is the answer right there. My brother went through uni in the late sixties when it was "free", but he won a scholarship, going on to become a teacher. If you wanted to do useless courses or couldn't get in on your academic score, you had to pay.
That's how it should be today. Taxpayers wouldn't mind funding courses that are productive and end up with valuable educated contributing members of society like engineers, teachers, doctors, and scientists...but crap like philosophy, women's studies, and modern dance? Please...pay your own damn way completely...it's a hobby, not a career path...