Major Ford announcement....

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Paxton

Rumour is wrong.

Bloody hope so, wife has approved new XR8 purchase!!!

[madmelon]

Originally Posted by whynot

Interesting question; under the current Queensland traffic laws, a P-plater will be able to drive the I6 but restricted from driving the lower power I4T. Will Queensland transport review this anomaly?

This is exactly what crossed my mind when I read it. It'll be a disaster if P platers aren't allowed to drive it due to being turbo.

Hopefully they make the LPG I6 available on the territory too- they might as well while they're developing things. One of the sites hinted at this but the actual press release didn't mention an LPG Territory.

The DSG gearboxes are also a huge bit of news- they are truly fantastic!

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

Far from it actually,the Holden story didn't appear anywhere early on in the bulletins I watched and I have to say the Ford news has received the most positive feedback I have seen for a very long time, almost GP-esk (RIP), good work Ford Pres, and I've been told that there was a standing ovation (ok they were already standing) when the plant staff were briefed, plus it was great to see their very happy grabs at the end of the story, especially on Chan. 9.

I'm surprised how positively this has been received by the media. Marin maybe the 'master of spin' that FoA needed.

Both Ch 10 & 9's stores were quite positive.

If this is a $230 mil program, there will be a fair bit of other content I imagine, engine box changes, electronics, etc. Hopefully some sheet metal etc.

Although I think the total will include the reskin of the Territory when it is released. I wonder where that leaves the Falcon facelift, and what that'll be in the next 12 to 18 months.

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by HSE2

If supposedly the future is "smart is small" then all Ford Aust have now done is sink more dollars into the product that doesn't move volume the likes of the projected Focus.

The question must be said (And I don’t know the answer). Is the current trend from large cars to small cars a trend from "large" to "small" or "high fuel economy" to "low fuel economy"? If it is the later, then if you had a choice between a small Corolla, Mazda 3, I30, Focus or a large Falcon that gets the same fuel economy? What is your choice?

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by flappist

I wonder if in the not so distant future we are going to see flame wars between the turbo 4 zealots and the N/A 6 zealots?

What if the turbo 4 is quicker over the 0-400 than the N/A 6?

Ohh Nooooo...........

lol

Will turbo 4 Falcon owners be accepted as cousins by turbo 6 Falcon owners and will Coyote 8 owners care.

Biggest challenge for ecoboost Falcon won't be the technology, as an owner of a Mazda 6 MPS with direct injection and a turbo, I can vouch for that. My car is a rocket and not that much lighter then a current gen 6 cylinder XT Falcon. We are talking less then the weight of one passenger difference.

Biggest challege is making people realise a Falcon with an Ecoboost 4 is not any heavier or more compromised then a fully loaded Mazda 6, Subaru Liberty or Commodore. The marketing message will need to be blunt and to the point. No dancing around other brands or God forbid, those who remember the starfire Commodore.

Straight to the point advertising. Safety, comfort of a full size Australian car with the economy of a Toyota Corolla. That kind of thing.

Dan

[XD 351 Ute]

Originally Posted by Nikked

The new Eco-boost 4cyl is nothing like any old 4cyl, how can someone compare that with the underdeveloped starfire, that's just silly.

Silly or not, I can, and will continue to hold it with little regard, until proven otherwise.

The 4 cyl Commodore was a dead-set bucket and If they don't get this right they will pay for it.

Running costs are a big concern of buying a new big car, given the way fuel prices are heading, but there is no way I would have a 4 cyl Falcon if it turned out to be anywhere near like the old Commodore.

Funny that you talk about comparing old with new, my current 13 year old XG still gets just under or on 9.0 Litres per 100 km on a trip, not too far off what the neweys are getting.

Just don't ask about the 351 though..............

Ed

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

I'm surprised how positively this has been received by the media. Marin maybe the 'master of spin' that FoA needed.

Both Ch 10 & 9's stores were quite positive.

If this is a $230 mil program, there will be a fair bit of other content I imagine, engine box changes, electronics, etc. Hopefully some sheet metal etc.

Although I think the total will include the reskin of the Territory when it is released. I wonder where that leaves the Falcon facelift, and what that'll be in the next 12 to 18 months.

Great to see positive media coverage. Maybe the tide is beginning to turn? Maybe GM bankruptcy and the related GMH's woes have started to hurt them? Maybe the quality Ford products are beginning to take affect? Maybe they now know that Burela will want to talk to them if it's negative. He is outspoken and willing to challenge the media head on!

PS I wondered if the $230M might have been to produce the Ecoboost i4T in Australia.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by XD 351 Ute

Silly or not, I can, and will continue to hold it with little regard, until proven otherwise.

The 4 cyl Commodore was a dead-set bucket and If they don't get this right they will pay for it.

Running costs are a big concern of buying a new big car, given the way fuel prices are heading, but there is no way I would have a 4 cyl Falcon if it turned out to be anywhere near like the old Commodore.

It should be lighter, well geared (with the 6 speed) and DI turbo. So It should be a decent package. But we will not know until its released.

[tapeworm]

praise the gods if the i6 comes out with DI, it'll be a real gem, imho.

[Crazed]

Not to be negative, but wasnt all this engine news kind of expected. Ford US for ages have been saying that all cars in the Ford world wil get EcoBoost (and in the process this will kill off the I6, why have the I6 and the new Cyote V8? we only need one performance engine), and we already knew about the LPG and diesel.

what today is, is basically the announcement that Ford is ditching the plan to make 40,000 pa Focus cars in Oz.

I actually think this is all kind of sad news...

[Gobes32]

Would like to offer my two cents........

A four cylinder Falcon is not a bad thing. No-one will be forced to purchase one as the I6, I6T & V8 will all still be available. It would also be wise to not dismiss the ecoboost motor until you have test driven one. Apparently they really are that good.....

Focus is a bit of a worry, it would have been nice to grab a slice of that pie, but if the rumors are true, then Focus was a financial disaster just waiting to happen. Small cars are hard to build profitably unless you have sheer volume. (100,000+ units a year)

Diesel Territory is a great announcement, but as mentioned, 18 months is still a long way to go yet.......

Liquid injection is fantastic news, it's a shame they cannot apply it to Territory but I am sure it will bring new customers to the Falcon, and that is a good thing.

One question no one has asked, what will happen with wagon? How much longer does it have?

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by phillyc

PS I wondered if the $230M might have been to produce the Ecoboost i4T in Australia.

No chance.

LILPG I6 yes (this'll be a ripper).

I understand the i4T will be built at Dearborn engine (who are tooling up atm).

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by whynot

Interesting question; under the current Queensland traffic laws, a P-plater will be able to drive the I6 but restricted from driving the lower power I4T. Will Queensland transport review this anomaly?

FFS the car doesnt even exist yet!!!!

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

One question no one has asked, what will happen with wagon? How much longer does it have?

Wagon has been dying since 06 (prob earlier). But it has survived. so if they can justify a business case to put in a euro 4 motor and 5 speed into the car then it may live on as a fleet hack....I know Commo wagon wont be a choice after seeing a cage installed on one behind the front seats.

[Ratmac]

Everyone has to remember that this is a TURBO.
Not just a 2L NA.
Turbo tech on small motors has come a long way and looking at the specs it sounds like a decent mover, it wont set the world alight but its not meant to.
It will move the car and thats all it needs to do.

[xls3v]

260hp (i6) v 240hp(eco4t) isn't much difference anyway

i would have liked ford to invest more into lpg turbo i6

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by HSE2

I think this is disappointing and question where it will put us in 3 to 4 years time.

In 3 to 4 years ... because of this decision ... I can only see things with a more secure future .... I cannot see it any other way? 100's of million dollars of investment is not a small amount to throw at something that will be gone in 4years.

Not every one who buys cars care about KW's. 70% wouldn't know what a KW is! Thats why they still and will continue to build Camry's. Alot of decisions on what to buy from people come from perception.

I would not bag the Ecoboost 4 in a Falcon until its done, tried and tested. And for anyone to compare this to a C'dore 4 from nearly 30 years ago :

The choices now have seemed to have increased 4, 6, 8, Diesel, LPG and a few turbos thrown in for good measure. Sorry if thats disappointing for some. Makes it harder to decide



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[ZA-289]

Originally Posted by XD 351 Ute

Silly or not, I can, and will continue to hold it with little regard, until proven otherwise.

The 4 cyl Commodore was a dead-set bucket and If they don't get this right they will pay for it.

Running costs are a big concern of buying a new big car, given the way fuel prices are heading, but there is no way I would have a 4 cyl Falcon if it turned out to be anywhere near like the old Commodore.

Funny that you talk about comparing old with new, my current 13 year old XG still gets just under or on 9.0 Litres per 100 km on a trip, not too far off what the neweys are getting.

Just don't ask about the 351 though..............

Ed

A 2011 multi valve 4cyl turbo will be vastly different from a 1978 push rod carby 6cyl with 2 cyl lopped off!!!! :

It's good news! we can't have the I6 forever....

[sarrge2001]

Wow

First thoughts were "4 cylinder Falcon - oh crap" but 205kw is a very respectable number for a 4.

So they will have a 4 cylinder, a diesel and continue with the I6 which will be Euro compliant and (presumably) a decent V8

Pretty good path for the future of Ford I reckon

[Falc'man]

Paxton, you should changed your name to Briantoldme. This news is, what, 10 months old?

Originally Posted by ZA-289

A 2011 multi valve 4cyl turbo will be vastly different from a 1978 push rod carby 6cyl with 2 cyl lopped off!!!! :

It's good news! we can't have the I6 forever....

The I6/T has a big future. ;)

Originally Posted by aualright

Maybe Ford never intended to build the Focus here...perhaps it was just a sneaky tactic in the knowledge that Holden couldn't bear to be trumped. Holden took the bait and hastily announced the Cruze programme despite the relative small profits on building small cars, especially in Australia.

Should we expect Holden to now cancel the Cruze, or is it now too late for them?Interesting times indeed!

****

lol

Originally Posted by Cobra

Why is it dissapointing that they didn't drop an Australian built engine which is just as good as the Yank V6? At no point later than 2015 you'll prbably get your wish, as the I6 will surely be gone by then.

Good post. I would go a step further and say it's actually better.

Originally Posted by csv8

mmm 4 cylinder Falcon...isn't that the MONDEO ?? is Ford saying Falcons gone, nicely ?

You make no sense.

Originally Posted by ieatsports_cars

ok still nothing about the v8 !!!

Today's announcement has nothing to do with the V8. It was all about the I4T, I6LPG and Territory V6 diesel.


Can people stop comparing the I4T Falcon to the failure know as the Opel Rekord!!

Ecoboost's power delivery is likened to a diesel, NOT peaky, and very efficient. As mentioned by many, weighs alot less too.

Having it designed to fit north-south is the interesting bit. Too early to speculate, but I'm thinking this to be a very big shot in the arm for the Falcon.

[ehast13]

I regularly drive an e200k mercedes (4cyl supercharged). It is a similar size and weight to what a four cyl falcon will be. It is quite nice to drive. The 4cyl falc will have more power and torque than an e200k.

Anyone here drive an eb fairmont ghia (1600kg, 148kw, 340 ish nm)??

How would you like it with a stronger top end, a six speed auto, a smoother feel and much better fuel economy.

Let's not write this off too quickly. I reckon it'll be a good'un.

[whynot]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

FFS the car doesnt even exist yet!!!!

True ... but, you probably don't have two P-Plate daughters in your household.

It cramps the buying options, often in weird ways. The can drive a 190kW Territory but cannot drive a CX-9 (has an additional odd 12KW) or a CX-7 (175KW four cylinder turbo). Under the current regulations, they will be able to drive an I6 (assuming it remains under 200kW) but not an I4T (cause it is a turbo). Weird!

It is going to get weirder as manufacturers bring out more turbo/supercharged options for fuel efficiency.

[Paxton]

Gobes - as for the Wagon; what can I say, the bastard keeps selling. Damian and you are lucky that you are in the same boat in regards to legacy platforms. Ford will probably fluke a business case for the Wagon through, mainly because they are the only supplier for a vehicle of its versatility.

The thing I can't understand is, will the I4T sit behind a DSG box, or will it appear with the ZF and the TR6060?

[Chilliman]

Well this announcement really sorts out the 'glass-half-full' and the 'glass-half-empty' types. I for one count myself as one of the former.

Ecoboost I4 turbo Falcon - bring it on! :

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by whynot

True ... but, you probably don't have two P-Plate daughters in your household.

It cramps the buying options, often in weird ways. The can drive a 190kW Territory but cannot drive a CX-9 (has an additional odd 12KW) or a CX-7 (175KW four cylinder turbo). Under the current regulations, they will be able to drive an I6 (assuming it remains under 200kW) but not an I4T (cause it is a turbo). Weird!

It is going to get weirder as manufacturers bring out more turbo/supercharged options for fuel efficiency.

whynot, I understand what you mean. But the governments / RTA's have been handing out exemptions to Mercedes and Audi etc for the 4cyl turbo and supercharged family cars.

Those governing bodies will soon, one would hope, come to their senses and change the rules to power to weight just as they did for bikes (with weight allowance for rider) many years ago. Something like 125kW/Ton would mean a 1600kg family car, 75kg passenger, 25kg of fuel could have 212kW at the most.

But this is off topic, the car is 2 years away!

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by Paxton

The thing I can't understand is, will the I4T sit behind a DSG box, or will it appear with the ZF and the TR6060?

I am led to believe it will be behind the DSG, and the diesel territory will be ZF at launch until the I4T comes online and then it will share the DSG box with the I4T.

[Bucknaked]

So the Falcon is going 4 Cylinders. Will they do an XR version I wonder. There already was an XR4 fiesta, that is no more, so falcon can slot right in. How many XR Clubs in Australia will change their constitution to allow XR4 Turbo Falcons in. Or will they just become FPV clubs, no 4 potters allowed?

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

I am led to believe it will be behind the DSG, and the diesel territory will be ZF at launch until the I4T comes online and then it will share the DSG box with the I4T.

This is odd, because there isn't (to my knowledge) a DSG gearbox currently in use that will fit the North/South, Front Engine, Rear Drive setup that Falcon currently.

[z80]

My predictions:-

-Geelong engine plant will close or become token body stamping/parts manufacture.
-4 cylinder Falcon will be front wheel drive.....
-wagon/estate falcons will cease to exist, with Territory the wagon option.
-The LPG price is artificially low, the I6 is a dead duck, as is the Aussie engine plant.
-V8 Ford engines will be no more, in favour of boosted offerings
-4 cylinder falcon will struggle to compete with Jap Mivec/VVT offerings

The Aussie dollar is about 82 cents to the US.

We have no hope of competitively manufacturing anything when our dollar is high.

Holden,Ford,Mitsubishi ...same sheet different day.

Join the Asian third world pay and conditions or say goodbye to jobs.

Looks like the jobs gotta go then.... :

[Falc'man]

HEY! Paxton! Your avatar just aged 50 years!