Ecoboost whats the point

[Fiesta_Man69]

Originally Posted by Auslandau

The target market is those that buy for fleets based on govco standards and those who want a 4 cyl shopping trolley to go from A to B for a family of 5. Many here do not nessesarily fall into these categories being more enthusiasts rather than Camry drivers.

While some might be interested and have stated they are looking into it as a secondary mode of transport (or first), don't expect many to put hands in pockets. It isn't the intended market. Those you asked not to answer are the ones who could be tempted. Why would you exclude such a huge part of the intended market????

Camry drivers hey? A 4 cyl car, like the Accord and 6 and Mondeo. People who want to buy a 4 cyl car will look at all these long before the EB because, one, the stigma attached to the Falcon (big, thirsty etc) and secondly, outside enthusiasts, no one knows the EB exists! And enthusiasts won't buy it ahead of an I6 or turbo or 8. And fleets will buy the LPG: well a few at least because the Falcon in any engine form isn't doing the numbers: if the fed govt wasn't pumping hundreds of millions of taxpayers $$ into both Holden and Ford, the Falcon (and commodore) wouldn't still exist..

But the biggest problem non performance Falcons have, regardless of engine, is that the name plate has no aspirational value to it in 2012. Sales numbers prove this. People who would have bought a Falcon (and base model commodore) years ago are now buying VWs or Mondeos or Hyundais etc. And fleets aren't touching it.

Hence my point.

[Fiesta_Man69]

And in NSW the EB can't be driven by p platers because it is turbo (despite having less hp than the na six, congrats govt incompetence) so this is a further disincentive to "camry" whitegoods car buyers to buy the EB...

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by flappist

Well it will not take too many to exceed the number of LPGs sold would it?
What new falcon/terrri/mondeo did you buy?

EcoLPi is running at about 35 a day, Ecoboost 4 is about 8 or 9 a day.

So EcoLPi is being built in numbers 3 to 4 times greater than Ecoboost.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

EcoLPi is running at about 35 a day, Ecoboost 4 is about 8 or 9 a day.

So EcoLPi is being built in numbers 3 to 4 times greater than Ecoboost.

The question was asked on how many were being bought HERE, not fleet.

[naddis01]

Originally Posted by Windsor220

Was probably a base service. Often diesels require special oil, regular filter replacements and injector recalibration. Its good when the DPF ***** itself too.

So far after 50000km, give or take a few dollars here and there, it has been on par with my Falcon on servicing costs. I don't plan on keeping it past the warranty period.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

And in NSW the EB can't be driven by p platers because it is turbo (despite having less hp than the na six, congrats govt incompetence) so this is a further disincentive to "camry" whitegoods car buyers to buy the EB...

i think you'll find that will change soon.

[2011G6E]

If it's going to be aimed at fleet buyers, seems a bit odd they are pushing...and actually, *gasp*, advertising the G6E versions on TV and in magazines. They seem to be more aiming at the public and saying "Look...you can have your big car and big car comfort and space, but pay four cylinder running costs!", which is what they should be doing.

I'd pick one over a diesel after being bent over with the running costs of our last vehicle, a 4.2TD Landcruiser. I'd pick one over an LPG Falcon purely because I wouldn't have to worry about where the next LPG servo is.

Our "next car"...? Not sure...probably in another few years time, and who knows what will be "the next big thing" by then. In february last year, it was the toss of a coin between an XR6 and an SV6 series II Commodore, but we ended up with the G6E after a spectacular trade in offer, which we probably can't expect again with the G6E given it's kilometers. We also liked the Suzuki Kysashi AWD Sport, but it truly was sluggish. Maybe with a turbo?

Whatever we buy next will undoubtedly be a four cylinder...we don't tow anything apart from the odd trailer, but we do big distances regularly, where the lower running costs come into play for us.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

Camry drivers hey? A 4 cyl car, like the Accord and 6 and Mondeo. People who want to buy a 4 cyl car will look at all these long before the EB because, one, the stigma attached to the Falcon (big, thirsty etc) and secondly, outside enthusiasts, no one knows the EB exists! And enthusiasts won't buy it ahead of an I6 or turbo or 8. And fleets will buy the LPG: well a few at least because the Falcon in any engine form isn't doing the numbers: if the fed govt wasn't pumping hundreds of millions of taxpayers $$ into both Holden and Ford, the Falcon (and commodore) wouldn't still exist..

But the biggest problem non performance Falcons have, regardless of engine, is that the name plate has no aspirational value to it in 2012. Sales numbers prove this. People who would have bought a Falcon (and base model commodore) years ago are now buying VWs or Mondeos or Hyundais etc. And fleets aren't touching it.

Hence my point.

you look at it all the wrong way. this isn't for people looking for a 4cyl. this is for people looking for a large car with lower running costs. this means fleets or families can have a full size car with 4cyl like running costs.

lpg isn't as widely available as petrol, so ecolpi doesn't suit everyones needs either.

also, many fleets have a 4cyl only policy and a less than 200g/km co2 policy. many of these fleets used to purchase falcons and now they will be able to again.

if it doesn't make sense to you, then don't buy one. buy that mazda.

[Fiesta_Man69]

Originally Posted by prydey

i think you'll find that will change soon.

based on what?

[prydey]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

If it's going to be aimed at fleet buyers, seems a bit odd they are pushing...and actually, *gasp*, advertising the G6E versions on TV and in magazines. They seem to be more aiming at the public and saying "Look...you can have your big car and big car comfort and space, but pay four cylinder running costs!", which is what they should be doing.

i think ford have said as much. they want to attract more private buyers. the beauty is, it is also eligible to fleets now.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

based on what?

read here
http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11365949

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by flappist

The question was asked on how many were being bought HERE, not fleet.

No it wasn't, no one mentioned wether those numbers were fleet or private.

Well done twisting it to favour you side, but thats nothing new is it.

Simple fact is the EcoLPi is being built and sold in much higher numbers than EB.

But just like LPi the EB engine will mostly be sold to fleets, especially that private buyers mostly buy XR's which come with the LPi option and not the EB option.

[Fiesta_Man69]

Originally Posted by prydey

you look at it all the wrong way. this isn't for people looking for a 4cyl. this is for people looking for a large car with lower running costs.

Like as in a Camry? That's $10K cheaper, has $130 fixed price services (atm) and one of the best resale values in the country? Good luck. Again, people who want to buy a 4cyl will buy a mid sized 4cyl car: there's bugger all difference in size between the Camry and Falcon inside anyways (as the Aurion is a "large" car but is just a v6 camry...) and the Falcon nameplate has zero aspirational cred with ordinary buyers... Who hopefully will buy a Mondeo instead of a Camry/6/accord...

yes the eb is a great concept but years too late. And not one person on a Ford forum has said they're keen on one... Surely a concern. And fleets have abandoned the Falcon, sales figures prove this.

[Fiesta_Man69]

Originally Posted by prydey

read here
http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11365949

Will never happen with the o Farrell govt. Not in a million years. Political suicide next time a boofhead p plater in a Silvia drives into a pole and roads minister Duncan Gay gets held responsible by greiving parents blah blah...

Reviews happen all the time, btw. Means little to nothing.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

No it wasn't, no one mentioned wether those numbers were fleet or private.

Well done twisting it to favour you side, but thats nothing new is it.

Simple fact is the EcoLPi is being built and sold in much higher numbers than EB.

But just like LPi the EB engine will mostly be sold to fleets, especially that private buyers mostly buy XR's which come with the LPi option and not the EB option.

Really?

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

Ecoboost- what's the point?

Sales, obviously, so let's do a test.

On this Ford fan site, who can honestly say they will buy one as their next car (as opposed to the I6 or LPG)? And I mean buy with your own $$, not leased or choose as a company car...

So who is looking to trade their current Falcon I6, Territory, Mondeo etc and will step in to one and slap down $40K of their own cash? (and forego the cheaper to run but more powerful - and quicker LPG or silky I6 in an XR6...)

You'd want to hope their dozens and dozens on here, else Ford is in trouble..

Is the post to which my reply was made.

Would reading the thread and actually comprehending the context instead of going off half cocked whenever you think your "precious" has been slighted be something new?

[gtfpv]

i'll be honest i haven't read this thread , but who will buy an ecoboost falcon ?
i had a discussion with a sales rep after looking at one .
i asked this question , he replied : "we dont really know who'll buy them , we'll have to wait and see; but ford have done their research and made them , driving them they feel almost the same as the 6cyl petrol , and are as economic as the 6cyl LPI . THEY ARE THE SAME PRICE AS THE 6 CYL PETROL VARIANT , BUT CHEAPER THAN THE 6 CYL lpi VARIANT, he then went on to say that they are aimed at company fleets , as a lot of companies now are stipulating 4cyl vehicles only for their fleet cars , which will give people a choice of still being able to drive a big powerfull 4cly falcon , he also said that if you get 700km on a trip in the 6cyl , you will get 850km out of the 4 .
suddenly , it made a bit of logical sense why they make em . time will tell

[hawker]

If the performance isn't that far behind the IL6, I'll be considering one when I get a second car in a few years. Hopefully I still have my Turbo Territory, so performance will be covered.

I think it's too early to write it off, on any level...

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by olds

So I fork out 36k and Im worried about 10 cent /litre in fuel costs ?

THIS IS THE SAME USSUAL UN EDUCATED COMMENT THAT FIRES ME UP EVERY TIME. REALLY...DID YOU JUST SAY THAT 10CENTS PER LITRE OF FUEL FOR A 30K PLUS CAR ISNT WORTH IT...omg...WHAT IS EVERY OTHER CAR MAKER IN THE WORLD DOING THEN.
u do realize that ecoboost engines wernt thought and made for the falcon...they were just put in because we had them

if your asking this question you clearly havent read ANYTHING about an ecoboost falcon drive review yet..and i can garuntee you havent driven on

For your information it has stood up against some extremely staunch oposition amomong the known car reviews allready and has been taken with VERY HIGH REGARD. THATS the point of Ecoboost pal.....

[Murph-51]

personally I'd go the LPI one, but I'll never be able to afford one new, so if I wanted one I would have to use finance which charges interest, which kind of negates the whole fuel savings thing in the first place???
So for me, I'd have to wait a few years down the track until I could afford a good second hand one, hopefully by then it would have had all it's "NEW CAR" gremlins ironed out and will be at a price I can afford!
Seriously, who these days as an individual has the out right cash to be able to go in and buy any sort of motor car at any price without some sort of finance or loan???
Very few I'd suspect (correct me if I'm wrong)
So with the majority using credit of some description, my question is Whats the point in buying any new car of any description when
A: You loose about 5K they say as soon as you drive off of the show room floor
B: Its a depreciating asset
C: If on credit, you are paying way more than the car is ever worth?

Thats my 2 cents worth anyway, kind of on topic lol
Ill just stick to my 12 year old shitta's lol

[gtfpv]

the 4cyl version are still rated at 1600kg towing capacity also . the 6cyl petrol , 6 cyl LPI and 4cyl eb are all within 0.2sec 0-100kms /hr all in the 6 sec bracket.

remember ford used to promote the EL XR6 7.8 sec 0-100km/hr as being faster than the 5.0 litre V8.

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by Auslandau

If you were standing in front of the board at Ford putting a case for Deisel Falcon forward and the figures at present for sedans sold in Aust were ....

Less than 15% are deisel.
More than 30% are LPG.
More than 65% are 4 cyl

What would you be backing as a safer bet?

Deisel in a Falcon will not happen despite the overwhelming 20 that say here they would buy ....... NEW. More chance of the 2 door coupe coming back.

iread this thread from the start and i dont know how you kept your cool for 7pages before you had to shove blatant COMMONSENSE FACTS in peoples faces. I seriously cant believe their are clowns who think a diesel falcon would be worth it to FORD AUS. If ya know anything these days , its that dieselssell in utilities and suvs...NOT SEDANS.

[gtfpv]

Diesel engines are for ships !!!

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

Camry drivers hey? A 4 cyl car, like the Accord and 6 and Mondeo. People who want to buy a 4 cyl car will look at all these long before the EB because, one, the stigma attached to the Falcon (big, thirsty etc) and secondly, outside enthusiasts, no one knows the EB exists! And enthusiasts won't buy it ahead of an I6 or turbo or 8. And fleets will buy the LPG: well a few at least because the Falcon in any engine form isn't doing the numbers: if the fed govt wasn't pumping hundreds of millions of taxpayers $$ into both Holden and Ford, the Falcon (and commodore) wouldn't still exist..

But the biggest problem non performance Falcons have, regardless of engine, is that the name plate has no aspirational value to it in 2012. Sales numbers prove this. People who would have bought a Falcon (and base model commodore) years ago are now buying VWs or Mondeos or Hyundais etc. And fleets aren't touching it.

Hence my point.

dONT cross the facts...the aus gov gives money to holden and ford for AUS MANUFACTURING...not commie and falcon. Plus the fact that ecoboost isnt advertised as much as we would all like SHOULDNT OVERSHADOW thatits still the best sedan package in australia bar none. We on here espescially should know this.
And the market has shrunk for large cars...what do we expect ford to do with thier limited funding...spend it all for ecoboost.......your kidding right.

ECOBOOST FALCONS RULE.

[Rockape]

Originally Posted by Murph-51

personally I'd go the LPI one, but I'll never be able to afford one new, so if I wanted one I would have to use finance which charges interest, which kind of negates the whole fuel savings thing in the first place???
So for me, I'd have to wait a few years down the track until I could afford a good second hand one, hopefully by then it would have had all it's "NEW CAR" gremlins ironed out and will be at a price I can afford!
Seriously, who these days as an individual has the out right cash to be able to go in and buy any sort of motor car at any price without some sort of finance or loan???
Very few I'd suspect (correct me if I'm wrong)
So with the majority using credit of some description, my question is Whats the point in buying any new car of any description when
A: You loose about 5K they say as soon as you drive off of the show room floor
B: Its a depreciating asset
C: If on credit, you are paying way more than the car is ever worth?

Thats my 2 cents worth anyway, kind of on topic lol
Ill just stick to my 12 year old shitta's lol

Someone has to buy them new so you can have your second hand one.

[1TUFFUTE]

My bro and his mate are both looking at ecoboosts when he moves back to aus in 2mnths. Missis driving real drivers cars bigtime.,

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

Will never happen with the o Farrell govt. Not in a million years. Political suicide next time a boofhead p plater in a Silvia drives into a pole and roads minister Duncan Gay gets held responsible by greiving parents blah blah...

Reviews happen all the time, btw. Means little to nothing.

You clearly haven't read the other topic!! There us a weight to power ratio. The Silvia will not pass this weiht to power ratio, but the EB 4 will.. It is only a matter of time before it is changed.. Vic & Qld have already done so. NSW don't be far behind!!

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

Like as in a Camry? That's $10K cheaper, has $130 fixed price services (atm) and one of the best resale values in the country? Good luck. Again, people who want to buy a 4cyl will buy a mid sized 4cyl car: there's bugger all difference in size between the Camry and Falcon inside anyways (as the Aurion is a "large" car but is just a v6 camry...) and the Falcon nameplate has zero aspirational cred with ordinary buyers... Who hopefully will buy a Mondeo instead of a Camry/6/accord...

yes the eb is a great concept but years too late. And not one person on a Ford forum has said they're keen on one... Surely a concern. And fleets have abandoned the Falcon, sales figures prove this.

I love when people say this.. The Mondeo has been on sale for 2-3 years & doesn't even sell 500 units on average per month AND this is with a Wagon. Falcon has more hope then Mondeo!! So stop trying to put the falcon down at every turn for no reason!!

[SumoDog68]

With EB you get same performance and same similar economy as inline 6 at the same purchase price . Car is lighter and presumably handles better , but there is no dramatic improvement in any area except for the fact that small ,modern two liter boosted 4 can perform as well as old school big cube 6.
Something like Camry hybrid cuts fuel consumption in half and is main competition to Falcon EB.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by SumoDog68

With EB you get same performance and same similar economy as inline 6 at the same purchase price . Car is lighter and presumably handles better , but there is no dramatic improvement in any area except for the fact that small ,modern two liter boosted 4 can perform as well as old school big cube 6.
Something like Camry hybrid cuts fuel consumption in half and is main competition to Falcon EB.

everyones situation will be different. considering i can match or better the manufacturers figures in my FG, i see no reason why i couldn't do the same with ecoboost. for me, that would be a fair improvement. i'm sure many others would find the same. sure, there might be a handful that due to traffic conditions or driving style don't see much benefit, but i think most will.

[Fiesta_Man69]

Originally Posted by Joe5619

You clearly haven't read the other topic!! There us a weight to power ratio. The Silvia will not pass this weiht to power ratio, but the EB 4 will.. It is only a matter of time before it is changed.. Vic & Qld have already done so. NSW don't be far behind!!

Vic and Qld don't have the Daily Telegraph: Sydney's and NSW's most widely read newspaper, and one that sells copies by sensationalising stories. They got a lot of milage from the p plater ban on turbo cars after a spate of crashes. They don't care about details, such as power to weight, they justare about headlines. The tele was also instrumental for smashing labor, day after day, for months before the last election that saw the libs win in a landslide.

Of recent, there has been an absense of p plater crashes in NSW.

Roads Minister Duncan Gay would be committing political suicide to touch the laws at the moment. If they were changed, with the power to weight rules etc. and then a p plater died - whether it was directly relevant to the change in laws or not - then there would be hell to pay. The NSW govt. has more important things on its plate right now, such as crippling rolling strikes from teachers.

The wait for such a change will be a long one, though I hope I am wrong.