Poll: Gay/Lesbian marriage.

[sprintman1]

Originally Posted by Big_Daz

I am firmly in the "Couldn't Give A Toss" Camp... Whether Gay/Lesbians can marry doesn't bother me, nor does it affect me...

Originally Posted by Sabantien

I wonder if you consider telling gay people that they are not normal, tainted, unnatural, wrong, mentally ill, aberrations, paedophiles, perverted, damaging to children, twisted AIDS carriers is also bashing and vilifying them?

Or is that just having an opinion?

They're just some of the things people in this forum have called gay people in this thread.

Yep, the ones it does worry have something to hide. Lots of bluster and obfuscation to cover it up

[Charliewool]

[QUOTE=Elks;5584644]Just on that...

So assuming there is a omnipotent deity in the sky and as the story goes he created Adam and Eve. /QUOTE]

Just on that....
How come in all religious depictions both Adam and Eve have belly buttons??

[SYZ]

Originally Posted by tempted

Just about everything that pro gay groups, lobbies and activists put out is flawed, biased propaganda too [...]

I personally haven't seen any evidence of this with regard to the gay marriage debate; in fact most of the material I've read from those groups about this tend to be defensive, rather than confrontational. I've also not seen them make any claims that can't be supported by empirical evidence—with a bit of searching.

Could you please give us some examples that support what you're claiming, along with a few links?

[SYZ]

Originally Posted by Charliewool

Just on that....
How come in all religious depictions both Adam and Eve have belly buttons??

Easy... when god had finished making all the humans out of clay, he lined 'em up, walked along the line, and poked them in the tummy, saying "you're done, you're done, you're done.....".

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by sprintman1

Yep, the ones it does worry have something to hide. Lots of bluster and obfuscation to cover it up

To misquote the Shakespeare line from Hamlet "Methinks they doth protest too much" ?

[supershifty]

Originally Posted by theBlake

The poll is poorly worded, 1,3,4 are practically the same.
No 2 is dead against it, but there isn't an equally opposite option. The same occurs with most polls on the topic.

How many of the Yes voters are prepared to fight for same-sex marriage? How much will you sacrifice, would you pay money to get it done? There is a huge difference between being a keyboard warrior and actually doing something about it. I suspect many are just in the arguement because they have something against the demographic that objects to SSM rather than the issue itself. This is easily seen in this thread already.

Same sex marriage is not a basic right, its a manufactured right
The law is not discrimatory, gay people are allowed to get married.
Plenty of people can't marry the persons they love for other reasons than being the Same sex. So "love" is not a Good enough reason.
The whole issue is not even about getting married, it's about forcing legal acceptance of the gay lifestyle and silencing any critics and objections.(free speech) Society as a whole is been conned and this has been clearly demonstrated wherever SSM been legalised.

Refer to my answer to Stefan's post. Yes, the poll is perhaps poorly worded - I maybe should have thought it out more and dropped the 4th option, too late now.

http://www.fordforums.com.au/showpos...9&postcount=30

Thank you to all of those who have contributed for or against this controversial subject in a civil manner - a healthy debate is a good debate. Very pleased indeed, I thought this thread would be locked before it got wheels on.

Cheers! David.

[STEALTHY]

Originally Posted by sprintman1

Yep, the ones it does worry have something to hide. Lots of bluster and obfuscation to cover it up

Its common knowledge (am i using that phrase right?) that most homophobes are actually gay themselves, and repressing their feelings! Ironic haha

[STEALTHY]

Originally Posted by tempted

Hardly.

The thought of any sort of sexual contact with a male abhorres me.

The term homophobe is also flawed as it implies that one is scared of homosexuals.

Scared? No.

Disgusted would be a better description.

And theres a long line of people with that same viewpoint before you, who turned out to be gay. You better walk with your back to the wall ;)

[Road Games]

It's so hard to have a gay time on your own...

https://youtu.be/Cv-2Z1qrrHs

[Road Games]

Ahhhhhhhhh the memories...

https://youtu.be/9Pq8TFptKR4

[deesun]

Must be one of the fastest to 6 pages.

[jpblue1000]

Originally Posted by tempted

Your link is from 1999/2000, hardly up to date information.

I tried to post several links earlier to back up my claim, however they would not work, apparently because the forum sees the word h.i.v in the title and blocks it due to being a banned word.

Originally Posted by Charliewool

That UN link is 16 years old!! (2000)
Something a little more current....
http://www.cdc.gov/***/group/msm/index.html

YEAH SORRY OLD DATA.
New stuff here and oh look! still same results

http://www.unaids.org/sites/default/..._report_en.pdf

as mentioned above

"Women represent 50% of all adults living with *** globally. However in the

most affected region, sub-Saharan Africa, 59% of adults living with *** are

women. Almost 1000 young women are newly infected with *** every day.

Infection rates among young women are twice as high as among young

men in sub-Saharan Africa"
Hardly a gay issue then really, and pretty much nothing to do with marriage rights in our country.
JP

[jpblue1000]

Perverted abhorrent and unnatural are also personal attacks.
I think they are words you use. And as they are used to incite hatred that's true vilification.
Or doesn't it count cause its you!
JP

[SYZ]

Originally Posted by tempted

Hardly.

The thought of any sort of sexual contact with a male abhors me.

The term homophobe is also flawed as it implies that one is scared of homosexuals.

Scared? No.

Disgusted would be a better description.

My dictionary defines a homophobe as: a person who fears or hates homosexuals and homosexuality. (phobia from the Greek, meaning "dread of, aversion toward)

I can understand that many heterosexuals—particularly those involved with an opposite-gender partner—can/could feel threatened by the obvious evidence of a happily married homosexual couple.

Can I ask you if you hug your father, or any brothers, or are you not part of a touchy-feely family? Did your dad hug you as a little kid? If you were—say at a birthday party for an adult male relative—what would your first reaction be were he to give you a thankyou hug for a present? Would you return his hug, or would you rebound and not return the hug?

—I'm asking this sincerely, as I'm interested in the male/male relationship as my own father or brother never hugged me, and I've inadvertently become a "non-toucher" for decades now. I have to admit that I find the sight of two males hugging and kissing somewhat discomforting because of this. However, I respect their right to love each other, and to be married, and to father children.

[DBourne]

Quick stat count, not that it really matters, but those who said that the general public would be against it, so far only 61/204 are against..

[supershifty]

Keep it on topic folks, personal attacks are a breach of the forum rules.

I won't moderate my own thread, that could well be considered as bias.

Keep it clean or the thread will be closed.

Thank you in advance.

[nuthin' fancy]

Originally Posted by tempted

In a nutshell.. It is against all my morals and beliefs.

They believe they have the right to marry.... Well I believe I have the right to live my life without being exposed to their crap and having their views and ideologies shoved in my face on a daily basis.

All the gays in the world should just move to a remote island where they can all **** each other and marry and do whatever they like, far far away from the view of normal society.

I respect your point of view, but I don't agree with it. I don't understand why you need to continually return to this thread to say again what you have made plain earlier.

My gut reaction is that I don't agree with gay marriage.

But that is just my initial response. Further scrutiny of that response makes me realise the following:

My sister married twice, to idiots both times. These men failed her and she now lives in a same-sex relationship. Her partner is committed and loving, supportive and the best 'husband' my sister has ever had.

Look at the success rate of hetero marriages, large % fail. What exactly is the prevention of gay marriage protecting?

It is hard to see how allowing 'gay' marriage does anything to damage the institution more than modern life choices do.

At least if we grant it to the gay community, this conversation will stop.

Can we get back to cars now?

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by sprintman1

Can't think of any forum that has as many poorly educated, blinkered folk as this one.

I can give you one, but be ready for it when you go there, the Trash or Be Trashed section is totally un-moderated and don't the red-necks come out in force

Oh, it is American, it leaves this place for dead, this is mild my friend, very very mild

PM me if you are brave, there are quite a few Aussies who post there

[nuthin' fancy]

Originally Posted by supershifty

Keep it on topic folks, personal attacks are a breach of the forum rules.

I won't moderate my own thread, that could well be considered as bias.

Keep it clean or the thread will be closed.

Thank you in advance.

I will moderate. I have deleted the three personal attacks. (four now)

Only for the fact that this thread was started by another mod have I let it run.

It is fair for someone to say "I disagree with you".

It is not acceptable to say "you are an idiot for saying that".

If the thread degenerates into the latter, the thread will close.

I really enjoy the spread of views and wish there was sufficient maturity among us all to allow these things to run.

The thread about ice has run for a long time about a difficult topic, let's exercise some restraint so this thread can play out too.

[Trevor 57]

Not really responding to any post in particular, but nearly all of the homo-sexual relationships that I have known about have broken up at a greater rate than hetero-sexual relationships that I know of - just sayin'

[Big_Daz]

Originally Posted by sprintman1

Yep, the ones it does worry have something to hide. Lots of bluster and obfuscation to cover it up

I just think, you don't HAVE to like it, you don't HAVE to agree with Gay/Lesbian as a lifestyle but for Christ sake, allow them the same privileges straight people have...

Whether 2 Men or 2 Women marry will have absolutely zero effect on people Like tempted, etc who find gay people "revolting"...

Lets all just put it to a bloody vote, respect the outcome and MOVE THE HELL ON!!!

I can continue not really caring and the air time given to this issue can be used for something that really is a big deal...

[STEALTHY]

Originally Posted by Trevor 57

Not really responding to any post in particular, but nearly all of the homo-sexual relationships that I have known about have broken up at a greater rate than hetero-sexual relationships that I know of - just sayin'

However, staight couples make up 100% of the divorce rate in Australia ;)

You dont strike me as a person who would know many gay people, let alone be privvy to their relationships, so even if one broke up, and none of the straight couples did, that'd be 100% ;)

[olfella]

Originally Posted by jpblue1000

YEAH SORRY OLD DATA.
New stuff here and oh look! still same results

http://www.unaids.org/sites/default/..._report_en.pdf

as mentioned above

"Women represent 50% of all adults living with *** globally. However in the

most affected region, sub-Saharan Africa, 59% of adults living with *** are

women. Almost 1000 young women are newly infected with *** every day.

Infection rates among young women are twice as high as among young

men in sub-Saharan Africa"
Hardly a gay issue then really, and pretty much nothing to do with marriage rights in our country.
JP

I think that argument was first raised because back then, the majority of AIDS was caused by sexual relations. That was the fear and IMHO, was responsible for a lot of objection and prejudice to same sex relations and multiple partners. Times have changed as have the education surrounding causes. Just because those people now move freely in our society without the stigma that was around back when, tells me I have nothing to fear anymore and they are really no different from me except for their sexual preferences. Gee, I do things that may not be acceptable to others but does not mean I have to be ostracised for it. That is why my stance from back then to now has changed and why I now have no problem to what goes on in someone else bedroom. I have even met some great people who it turns out, do have different preferences to me. So what?

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by STEALTHY

You dont strike me as a person who would know many gay people, let alone be privvy to their relationships, so even if one broke up, and none of the straight couples did, that'd be 100% ;)

so you know me well based on an internet persona - interesting

Obviously you would be surprised who I know

[STEALTHY]

Originally Posted by Trevor 57

so you know me well based on an internet persona - interesting

Obviously you would be surprised who I know

Indeed, the vibe your posts relays is that you wouldn't associate with gay people. Of course, i dont know anything about you other than what you've posted in this thread, so you potentially could be the queen of mardi gra's

[SYZ]

Originally Posted by Trevor 57

Not really responding to any post in particular, but nearly all of the homo-sexual relationships that I have known about have broken up at a greater rate than hetero-sexual relationships that I know of - just sayin'

Can I ask you how many homosexual relationships (marriages presumably) you've personally known of that have broken up? And also the number of opposite-sex marriages that've broken up? According to 2014 US statistics (I couldn't find any Aussie ones—anybody?) the annual breakup of homosexual relationships is 1.1% versus 2% of opposite-sex relationships. Nearly twice as many for the heteros. Ouch.

And could you please define exactly what you mean by "nearly all" as it's a bit of a rubbery figure in itself.

[Rodp]

Originally Posted by tempted

The term homophobe is also flawed as it implies that one is scared of homosexuals.

Scared? No.

Disgusted would be a better description.

The act can be against your morals, yada yada yada, but the overwhelming negativity toward gay people I just don't understand. Very few people would choose to be attracted to the same sex. Especially with people in society that share your views about them.

When gay marriage is eventually legalised in Australia (it's only a matter of time..) do you know what you can do to fight the power? Don't get gay married.

[LoudPipes]

I must say I’m surprised at the poll results so far.

Not because close to a third of the members who have taken the time to vote don’t care about the issue as I think that is probably very true of the general population.

It's the high number who have polled that they agree with marriage equality as car enthusiasts are often stereotyped as high testosterone fuelled masculine males where any tolerance of gays would be low on their agenda.

It just shows what a good cross section of the community is represented on this forum and possibly in the car scene in general.

[Sabantien]

I believe there's already been a response from the gay community to the suggestion that they CAN get married.

They'll marry our girlfriends.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-YCdcnf_P8

[sprintman1]

Originally Posted by Trevor 57

I can give you one, but be ready for it when you go there, the Trash or Be Trashed section is totally un-moderated and don't the red-necks come out in force

Oh, it is American, it leaves this place for dead, this is mild my friend, very very mild

PM me if you are brave, there are quite a few Aussies who post there

As a member of quite a number of Seppo forums I know what they're like. The most brainwashed society on the planet.