Vfacts March 2011 - Page 8

**Fordman1** · 15-04-2011, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

.... just come out and admit your sales and marketing people are fricking useless and clean out all the dead wood ffs.

Tip of the iceberg ...

How do these fools come up with their decisions made puclic yesterday, and their future volumes with the new LPi option coming up.

There Idiots are dealing with good peoples livelihoods !!

phillyc · 15-04-2011, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dimka100

The thing I find ridicules with Ford and Holden is their RRP prices. They are so over inflated over what 99% of the people actually pay for these vehicles.

I think this is definitely turning many private buyers away. People simply think the car is way overpriced since they know fleets are paying a lot less for them, the resale value is shocking – but that is solely because it’s based on RRP and not the actual price 99% of the people pay, the dealers themselves do not negotiate in an easy form such that any Joe who walks into a dealership can get the real price of a Falcon rather than the overinflated RRP …

I got my Euro 4 XR6 in 2010, it was brand new stock from a dealer in Victoria. I have paid 31K and I have no fleet or business discounts or anything like that. Basically the dealer wanted them sold and that’s the price he advertised on carsales, the choice of colour was limited but I got what I wanted anyways.

Seriously Ford why advertise the car for 42K RRP when Fleets get them for 30K ??? why not advertise them at 35K from launch, this will leave enough room for dealers to negotiate while pricing your product far more realistically to what its worth. The resale value would also be seen as more reasonable as per this example:

My XR6 would be worth about 25K on the second hand market now, so after one year of ownership the depreciation was about 20% from the actual purchase price, rather than the shocking depreciation of 40% if we calculated based on the RRP price …

I TOTALLY AGREE. Before the FG was launched, there were rumours about names and how much they were going to cost. I actually sent an email to Ford to say, exactly what you have said. That is, sharpen your pencils on the retail prices. In my email i put the approx values. $33k for an XT, $36k for an XR6/G6, $43k for an XR6T/XR8/G6E, $50k for G6ET/G8E.

stevz · 15-04-2011, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

How do these fools come up with their decisions made puclic yesterday, and their future volumes with the new LPi option coming up.

That's what I'm struggling to work out. The LPi Falcon and diesel Territory are supposed to lead to an increase in volumes, yet they are doing the exact opposite and cutting them.

Road_Warrior · 15-04-2011, 08:39 PM

Yes not exactly a savvy business move is it...

**Fordman1** · 15-04-2011, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Yes not exactly a savvy business move is it...

Where is the 'vision' and the 'aggression' ?

stevz · 15-04-2011, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Where is the 'vision' and the 'aggression' ?

Its as though they are predicting their future products are going to be failures.

phillyc · 15-04-2011, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Where is the 'vision' and the 'aggression' ?

Bring the heat baby! Bring the heat!

The competitors play rough, why don't Ford stop being so meek and kick them in the balls. 'Casey Heynes' the competition.

Driving like a VE is like being in a prison cell. you sit too low and your vision is obstructed. Cue to the FG, which during the release they mentioned how they focussed on making sure vision was minimally interrupted. Show that in an advert.

Show the fold down rear seats!
It's RWD so it's fun to drive, but in the carpark show the tightest turning circle in its class! Smaller than some small cars!
Show the excellent headlights / high beams!
Talk about the fuel economy improvement!
Talk about the ZF gearbox how it has been used in Jags, BMW, Range Rover etc.
Space, power, economy, versatility, looks, refinement.

Buntz · 15-04-2011, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phillyc

Bring the heat baby! Bring the heat!

The competitors play rough, why don't Ford stop being so meek and kick them in the balls. 'Casey Heynes' the competition.

Driving like a VE is like being in a prison cell. you sit too low and your vision is obstructed. Cue to the FG, which during the release they mentioned how they focussed on making sure vision was minimally interrupted. Show that in an advert.

Show the fold down rear seats!
It's RWD so it's fun to drive, but in the carpark show the tightest turning circle in its class! Smaller than some small cars!
Show the excellent headlights / high beams!
Talk about the fuel economy improvement!
Talk about the ZF gearbox how it has been used in Jags, BMW, Range Rover etc.
Space, power, economy, versatility, looks, refinement.

I agree to everything you have said. Copy it into an email... and send it to Ford. And tell them they can have these great idea's for free.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

The Territory is fords wagon. It originally was supposed to replace the Falcon wagon in 2004, but it didn't cop the big sales drop off that Ford were expecting.

But anyway i'm sick of Ford using the same excuse time after time that no one wants large cars. Holden manage to sell more than double what Ford does so just come out and admit your sales and marketing people are fricking useless and clean out all the dead wood ffs.

Exactly. Falcon isn't in a dwindling market. Just one that has been reduced by the introduction of new categories. But now they've lost perspective and don't know how to resolve the problem.

If the large car market was dying as quickly as Ford say it is... why are Renault about to launch one here?

Road_Warrior · 15-04-2011, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Where is the 'vision' and the 'aggression' ?

It got cancelled with the Fairlane.

Quote:

Originally Posted by phillyc

Bring the heat baby! Bring the heat!

The competitors play rough, why don't Ford stop being so meek and kick them in the balls. 'Casey Heynes' the competition.

Driving like a VE is like being in a prison cell. you sit too low and your vision is obstructed. Cue to the FG, which during the release they mentioned how they focussed on making sure vision was minimally interrupted. Show that in an advert.

Show the fold down rear seats!
It's RWD so it's fun to drive, but in the carpark show the tightest turning circle in its class! Smaller than some small cars!
Show the excellent headlights / high beams!
Talk about the fuel economy improvement!
Talk about the ZF gearbox how it has been used in Jags, BMW, Range Rover etc.
Space, power, economy, versatility, looks, refinement.

You know what I think? I think they need to look to the past to look for an ad with a catchy jingle, a message that tugs the heart-strings and showcases the tech and features that should show the cars to be world beaters. Just with the current range of vehicles and new actors of course.

Do you know the one I mean?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4T_IhTviZo

**Fordman1** · 15-04-2011, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Do you know the one I mean?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4T_IhTviZo

Where's the thumbs up Icon ? I want four here !!

phillyc · 15-04-2011, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

I agree to everything you have said. Copy it into an email... and send it to Ford.

Just did. Sent another in regards to cutting production prior to launch of crucial products and the 'signal' that sends to the whole of Australia.

Buntz · 15-04-2011, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Where's the thumbs up Icon ? I want four here !!

You can thumb this one if you like. These are the ads Ford should be making.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zy-vc...eature=related

Quote:

Originally Posted by phillyc

Just did. Sent another in regards to cutting production prior to launch of crucial products and the 'signal' that sends to the whole of Australia.

Good stuff. Tell 'em to bring back uncle Marin whilst they're at it.

**Fordman1** · 15-04-2011, 09:55 PM

This says it all (2005)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMfRWKDEZsI

Awesome product at the time !!

Where was the followup ?

Buntz · 15-04-2011, 10:01 PM

One of my favourite Ford ads.

The Fairlane G220, with a a whole bunch of black car chauffer's out of a job.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKZG9...eature=related

Whatever happened to the great Ford ad? This one awesome... because it's funny and it has Dean Martin singing one of his hits.... this told people it was a classy car.

**Fordman1** · 15-04-2011, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

This says it all (2005)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMfRWKDEZsI

Awesome product at the time !!

Where was the followup ?

There was a longer version of this commercial, I loved to watch it too.

This was the time when FoA had Vision and a great bloke lead from the front Geoff Polites RIP.

Road_Warrior · 15-04-2011, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

You can thumb this one if you like. These are the ads Ford should be making.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zy-vc...eature=related

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD NO

stevz · 15-04-2011, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Do you know the one I mean?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4T_IhTviZo

Does anyone else see the irony here? A great ad for one on the worst cars they have ever made, now they have great cars but the worst ads.

Buntz · 15-04-2011, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD NO

Forget the music. Forget the AU. Look at the points about the car they were flashing up?

Why don't Ford brag about how good the car is now? It's the best one yet.

**Fordman1** · 15-04-2011, 10:33 PM

Forget the commercial for the Dud AU...

How about the beautiful Original Territory Ad :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMfRWKDEZsI

Lets get one of these out there for SZ Territory !!!

Buntz · 15-04-2011, 10:39 PM

I see your territory ad. And raise you a BF II Fairmont Ghia

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBg9_iUFRHw

stevz · 15-04-2011, 10:50 PM

Come on guys, we all know this is the best Ford ad ever made!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDFHZZpzM9U

NOT!!!

Road_Warrior · 15-04-2011, 11:04 PM

STFU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eScJN...yer_detailpage

**Fordman1** · 15-04-2011, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

STFU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eScJN...yer_detailpage

Mmmmm...

Two position Tailgate, why doesn't FG have that ?

GS608 · 15-04-2011, 11:17 PM

best Ford ad to date is the original BA one..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeKFX...eature=related

Bossxr8 · 15-04-2011, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Tip of the iceberg ...

How do these fools come up with their decisions made puclic yesterday, and their future volumes with the new LPi option coming up.

There Idiots are dealing with good peoples livelihoods !!

I don't understand that either, if they were downbalancing right now I could understand, but it won't be for 2 months, right at the same time as they are adding the LPi.

But they probably have so many unsold petrol Falcons they could probably get through the next few months without building any more and still not run out of stock.

I think they have decided to save money on payroll and just run overtime if they need more than what they are making, or hire more on contract so they can ditch them whenever they need too while paying them less.

jpd80 · 16-04-2011, 06:35 AM

Down balancing the line tells me that FoA have absolutely no confidence in new produts
like Territory or EcoLPI to lift overall sales and this is only the start of all the bad news,
it's going to get very ugly very fast for Ford and they don't seem to be able to manage it.

A viscous circle is beginning between buyers believing negative reports on Falcon and lower sales,
Ford needs to pull itself out of this flat spin fast and I'm sorry but $34,990 drive away XR6 won't do it.

What does all of this tell you about decisions on a Future locally designed Falcon.....

Buntz · 16-04-2011, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

Down balancing the line tells me that FoA have absolutely no confidence in new produts
like Territory or EcoLPI to lift overall sales and this is only the start of all the bad news,
it's going to get very ugly very fast for Ford and they don't seem to be able to manage it.

A viscous circle is beginning between buyers believing negative reports on Falcon and lower sales,
Ford needs to pull itself out of this flat spin fast and I'm sorry but $34,990 drive away XR6 won't do it.

What does all of this tell you about decisions on a Future locally designed Falcon.....

We're ******.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5.0

best Ford ad to date is the original BA one..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeKFX...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kd2m...feature=fvwrel

GS608 · 16-04-2011, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

We're ******.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kd2m...feature=fvwrel

I raise you
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUbgf...eature=related

whales · 16-04-2011, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Hmm. VFacts data is generated from new vehicle registrations, not sales isn't it??

I'm politically corrected but not the answered

**russellw** · 17-04-2011, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by winovin

Russ,

Thanks for posting the summary. Is there an FAQ on this, or forum? I have a few questions around why some vehicles of the same platform and size have different classifications:

e.g.
1. VW Polo - Light / Audi A1 - Small
2. Mitsubishi Outlander - Compact / Peugeot 4007 - Medium
3. Mini Cooper - Small, yet much smaller physically than cars in Light category - e.g. VW Polo, Ford Fiesta

Thanks again for a great analysis.

According to their own criteria:

Passenger vehicles are classified dependent on size, specification and average retail pricing. Vehicle size is based on wheelbase x track but it is not an exclusive criteria for determining segmentation. Price banding of entrants is determined by the FCAI based on price relativity.

Basically, they can put anything wherever they want and a lot of it has made very little sense - my poor old 300C SRT8 was lumped in with Statesman and Fairlane thanks to the wheelbase despite the two models being direct competition for the FPV and HSV equivalents. None-the-less, this is what we have and we can't do much but report them as they are given.

Cheers
Russ