Covid 19 -

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by russellw

I'm not sure why you picked Denmark as 'different'. Denmark has largely followed a similar model to us and was one of the first to initiate lockdowns and legal sanctions for non-compliance and as such their case rate is better than other European countries at 155 per 100k compared to some similarly sized countries like Belgium (413) and Ireland (410) but not as well as Finland (88.5) or Australia (26.45).

Apologies. I meant Sweden. They're using the herd immunity approach in combination with social distancing where appropriate. While they do accept they have higher infection rate and death rate, should their herd immunity approach continue they will likely have the lowest rate of reinfection. The World Health Agency advises against this approach, and points to the cases in South Korea where 222 previous patients have tested positive to CV19.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/...072044548.html

https://www.foxnews.com/world/who-sw...-for-the-world

[Cav]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

Cav, is it true that the young women pay you to be their sugar daddy?

I can't answer that on the grounds that it may well be true.

All I can say is that I am filthy rich.

[FPV8U]

Originally Posted by russellw

As I've already stated, we have no means of determining with any degree of statistical accuracy what the volume of asymptomatic cases actually is and the figures quoted earlier are based on a very small sample size and as such they are of no real use.

Likewise your figure of 95% not requiring intervention is plucked from where exactly? Just because you keep repeating it, doesn't make it correct and the Australian data I provided above shows that 9% of detected cases do require intervention here.

It's actually irrelevant what percentage of the population is running round asymptomatic given that (1) we already know that having had it once doesn't create immunity; (2) we've still only tested 3% of the population and (3) we have solid evidence that even a single person (asymptomatic or not) is capable of creating a cluster of new cases.

On that basis it would be reasonable to extrapolate that we are identifying a reasonable percentage of the actual cases or there would be more cluster outbreaks from infected people.

I'm not sure why you picked Denmark as 'different'. Denmark has largely followed a similar model to us and was one of the first to initiate lockdowns and legal sanctions for non-compliance and as such their case rate is better than other European countries at 155 per 100k compared to some similarly sized countries like Belgium (413) and Ireland (410) but not as well as Finland (88.5) or Australia (26.45).

They have an excellent (and free) health system which is no doubt helping keep their mortality rate well below other countries in Europe at 7.65 / 100k - Belgium is 64.7, Spain 51.9, Italy 45.7 and the Netherlands 27.5 but it's still way ahead of Australia at 0.35.

As they are about to start easing restrictions it will be a good case study to see if they get a spike in new cases above the current level of ~120-150 / day.

Is it official that having antibodies creates no immunity?

[.:4:.]

Heard an interesting one yeaterday about the social distancing thing. An av guy was having a spit because his brother in law and 2 of his collegues got slapped $1000 each. So as landscapers they were working away, giving each other a hand etc, and 2 police officers were parked over the road having a coffee. The moment the 3 blokes sat on the retaining wall, yes a bit too close, but thats when they got pinged. Apparently its ok to be too close when working, but smoko, you have to adhear to the rules. Sorta makes sense, but already having been clearly in close quaters with people it seems a little rough. Maybe had the officers been driving past not seeing the close working it would make more sense.

[Citroënbender]

What postcode? Just curious, not playing games.

[.:4:.]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

What postcode? Just curious, not playing games.

I didnt ask. I should be working with that bloke some time next week. Ill ask then. Still seems a bit extreme.

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by .:4:.

I didnt ask. I should be working with that bloke some time next week. Ill ask then. Still seems a bit extreme.

Yeah - lacking in common sense and unnecessary action IMHO- if what you reported is true.

[DJR-351]

When i left for work on the 11th Feb little did i know i would not be getting back until the 2nd of May.....

I will be getting off the ship (not a Cruise ship ) tomorrow morning in Darwin Harbour via launch to Stokes Hill Wharf then on to the Airport, first flight is to Alice Springs then on to Sydney then Brisbane, overnight at the Ibis Hotel at Brissy Airport then Tilt Train to Bundy....round about way of getting home but it'll do me just fine.....

Roll on 7.30am tomorrow

[MITCHAY]

Originally Posted by DJR-351

When i left for work on the 11th Feb little did i know i would not be getting back until the 2nd of May.....

I will be getting off the ship (not a Cruise ship ) tomorrow morning in Darwin Harbour via launch to Stokes Hill Wharf then on to the Airport, first flight is to Alice Springs then on to Sydney then Brisbane, overnight at the Ibis Hotel at Brissy Airport then Tilt Train to Bundy....round about way of getting home but it'll do me just fine.....

Roll on 7.30am tomorrow

Welcome home! I'm curious though because I know there are exemptions but why don't you have to do 14 days mandatory in a hotel or is that exempted because you're returning from work and/or been isolated on a ship already?

[.:4:.]

Originally Posted by asagaai

Yeah - lacking in common sense and unnecessary action IMHO- if what you reported is true.

I'll definately have to ask, but this bloke was proper blowing up, so i tend to think he may be telling it truthfully. But yes, common sense may have lacked, whenever im not 'working' per say, i constantly tell the sausage (apprentice) to step back. He is a close talker, so its a good excuse to stop that. Yes the fines are a bit much in my opinion, but it does get the message across. And dont shoot me down on this one, but i think as a country its been managed reasonably well. Most people attempt to do the right thing. It was a proactive effort not a reactive effort.

[DJR-351]

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

Welcome home! I'm curious though because I know there are exemptions but why don't you have to do 14 days mandatory in a hotel or is that exempted because you're returning from work and/or been isolated on a ship already?

Thanks! We are working out of Darwin in Australian waters only so no overseas calls. We have the the same exemptions as the guys working on the Australian Border Force boats so have a bunch of papers & passes to carry with us, plus we never left the Port area when we came in for cargo etc so no, no 14 days required.

[MITCHAY]

Ah ok. That's fortunate even if the trip home will be a pain in the **** but still plenty left stranded overseas. At least you will be able to crack some cold tins at the end.

[nuthin' fancy]

Originally Posted by Cav

I can't answer that on the grounds that it may well be true.

All I can say is that I am filthy rich.

Filthy and rich does not equal filthy rich.

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by FPV8U

Is it official that having antibodies creates no immunity?

It's the opposite, apparently.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vac-gen/immunity-types.htm

[Citroënbender]

One detail I learned from my mate in our convo today, is that regular (ie, non-pauper) funerals in New York state are backed right up - even for cremations. So his late father is in the freezer for probably a month.

[PhilT2]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

One detail I learned from my mate in our convo today, is that regular (ie, non-pauper) funerals in New York state are backed right up - even for cremations. So his late father is in the freezer for probably a month.

At least they've got a freezer. This funeral home used a U Haul and some ice; but the ice melted. After a few days....
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...ice-u-n1195901

[Citroënbender]

I read about that; doubly sad for the families.

Wondering about the fallout in days to come, of the Rabbinical send-off also in NY. Apparently people were instructed by their neighbourhood coordinators to wear masks and keep six feet from each other but chose to disregard these urgings.

[EgoFG]

[QUOTE=Fordman1;6433738]

Originally Posted by Falcon SXR8

16 months this year.

Sorry Typo - 16 weeks

[burnz]

FUNERAL DIRECTORS IN COVID-19 EPICENTER DOUBT LEGITIMACY OF DEATHS ATTRIBUTED TO PANDEMI..

https://www.********.com/video/g5f_6ltv7oI/

[PhilT2]

Originally Posted by burnz

FUNERAL DIRECTORS IN COVID-19 EPICENTER DOUBT LEGITIMACY OF DEATHS ATTRIBUTED TO PANDEMI..

https://www.********.com/video/g5f_6ltv7oI/

Was it this funeral home?
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/bodies-...home-covid-19/

[russellw]

Originally Posted by FPV8U

Is it official that having antibodies creates no immunity?

Originally Posted by Romulus

It's the opposite, apparently.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vac-gen/immunity-types.htm

The WHO stated a few days ago:

"There is currently no evidence that people who have recovered from Covid-19 and have antibodies are protected from a second infection,"

The current consensus view is that more research is going to be required before a definitive answer is available and that may not even apply to everyone when it is established or may not be 'permanent'.

Most of these viruses do provide a measure of immunity once you've had it but Influenza is an example of one that has both sufficient variations and a relatively short term to the immunity provided by antibodies.

It's one of the reasons why the triple antigen flu shot is provided annually.

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by russellw

The WHO stated a few days ago:

"There is currently no evidence that people who have recovered from Covid-19 and have antibodies are protected from a second infection,"

The current consensus view is that more research is going to be required before a definitive answer is available and that may not even apply to everyone when it is established or may not be 'permanent'.

Most of these viruses do provide a measure of immunity once you've had it but Influenza is an example of one that has both sufficient variations and a relatively short term to the immunity provided by antibodies.

It's one of the reasons why the triple antigen flu shot is provided annually.

One of the reasons a triple antigen flu shot is provided is because the flu shot has one of the lowest efficacy rates of all vaccines. the 'scientists' are basically guessing which flu strain may be prevalent in the upcoming season. Efficacy rates are below 50%.

As per the information from CDC's website https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vac-gen/immunity-types.htm

Immunity to a disease is achieved through the presence of antibodies to that disease in a person’s system. Antibodies are proteins produced by the body to neutralize or destroy toxins or disease-carrying organisms. Antibodies are disease-specific. For example, measles antibody will protect a person who is exposed to measles disease, but will have no effect if he or she is exposed to mumps.

There are two types of immunity: active and passive.

Active Immunity

Active immunity results when exposure to a disease organism triggers the immune system to produce antibodies to that disease. Exposure to the disease organism can occur through infection with the actual disease (resulting in natural immunity), or introduction of a killed or weakened form of the disease organism through vaccination (vaccine-induced immunity). Either way, if an immune person comes into contact with that disease in the future, their immune system will recognize it and immediately produce the antibodies needed to fight it.

Active immunity is long-lasting, and sometimes life-long.

Passive Immunity

Passive immunity is provided when a person is given antibodies to a disease rather than producing them through his or her own immune system.

A newborn baby acquires passive immunity from its mother through the placenta. A person can also get passive immunity through antibody-containing blood products such as immune globulin, which may be given when immediate protection from a specific disease is needed. This is the major advantage to passive immunity; protection is immediate, whereas active immunity takes time (usually several weeks) to develop.

However, passive immunity lasts only for a few weeks or months. Only active immunity is long-lasting.


Is the World Health Organisation arguing a position contrary to that of the Centres for Disease Control and Prevention?

[PhilT2]

Originally Posted by Romulus

Is the World Health Organisation arguing a position contrary to that of the Centres for Disease Control and Prevention?

No...

[russellw]

7 new cases in Australia yesterday but 2 deaths raised the CMR to 1.348% while the active case percentage drops to 14.0%.

2 new cases in New Zealand and 0 deaths so the CMR drops to 1.287% and the active percentage drops to 15.3%.

Despite more than 6,000 new cases in the UK and more than 600 deaths, the CMR dropped to 15.608% although their total number of active case numbers is still climbing and even the percentage hasn't really reached the downward trend seen elsewhere.



More than 28,000 new cases in the USA and 2,389 deaths so the CMR rises to 5.794%. We aren't tracking active cases yet as the numbers are too high.

[Work Horse]

Information straight from CDC website.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/faq.html


"The immune response, including duration of immunity, to SARS-CoV-2 infection is not yet understood. Patients with MERS-CoV are unlikely to be re-infected shortly after they recover, but it is not yet known whether similar immune protection will be observed for patients with COVID-19."

[cs123]

Originally Posted by russellw

7 new cases in Australia yesterday but 2 deaths raised the CMR to 1.348% while the active case percentage drops to 14.0%.

2 new cases in New Zealand and 0 deaths so the CMR drops to 1.287% and the active percentage drops to 15.3%.

Despite more than 6,000 new cases in the UK and more than 600 deaths, the CMR dropped to 15.608% although their total number of active case numbers is still climbing and even the percentage hasn't really reached the downward trend seen elsewhere.

image

More than 28,000 new cases in the USA and 2,389 deaths so the CMR rises to 5.794%. We aren't tracking active cases yet as the numbers are too high.

Is the number of active cases just because they are not testing for recovered patients?

[T3rminator]

Is anyone else more scared of what is to come post pandemic than the pandemic event itself? This is no disrespect to those who have lost their lives or are ill.

I came across this article this morning. Politico.com is not some chinese or russian propaganda website.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...navirus-207244

It frightens me because it brings back memories of the Iraq war. US had one objective, and it was able to to fool the entire world to go to war based on a lie. If you read and listen to major headlines at the moment, it is pretty obvious this is happening again (except we do not know if it is lies or fact yet), and what is more frightening is that our leaders are somewhat lubing us up, making accusations based on flimsy or no evidence, and its often from anonymous official sources based on classified documents that our own politicians aren't allowed to access.

Every time I read one of these headlines it gives me anxiety issues. Obvious thing to do is to "not look", but its bloody hard not to get bombarded every time you turn on the tv or the PC.

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

The best analogy I've heard for the Coronavirus pandemic and the potential lifting of any restrictions is that it is similar to using a parachute; just because you are controlling your decent under the parachute nicely, you don't then cut the lines and allow free fall again.

[superyob]

Originally Posted by T3rminator

Is anyone else more scared of what is to come post pandemic than the pandemic event itself? This is no disrespect to those who have lost their lives or are ill.

I came across this article this morning. Politico.com is not some chinese or russian propaganda website.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...navirus-207244

It frightens me because it brings back memories of the Iraq war. US had one objective, and it was able to to fool the entire world to go to war based on a lie. If you read and listen to major headlines at the moment, it is pretty obvious this is happening again (except we do not know if it is lies or fact yet), and what is more frightening is that our leaders are somewhat lubing us up, making accusations based on flimsy or no evidence, and its often from anonymous official sources based on classified documents that our own politicians aren't allowed to access.

Every time I read one of these headlines it gives me anxiety issues. Obvious thing to do is to "not look", but its bloody hard not to get bombarded every time you turn on the tv or the PC.

Careful, those who think the world revolves around notions of 'equality' and bottled unicorn farts may suggest you wear a tin foil accoutrement...

Personally, I agree that all is not as it seems. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck...

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

Originally Posted by superyob

Careful, those who think the world revolves around notions of 'equality' and bottled unicorn farts may suggest you wear a tin foil accoutrement...

Personally, I agree that all is not as it seems. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck...

Problem is your 'duck' looks like a dinosaur to us. And vice versa.