Cylinder Scoring

Cheech · 06-04-2018, 09:27 AM

Good Morning All,

A lot of you will be aware of the Focus RS MKIII head gasket issue.

Our car was inspected a month ago, failed the coolant pressure test and coolant found to be entering a cylinder/s. Dealer has ordered a new head, head gasket and assorted consumables. These have arrived and the car is booked in mid April.

I had first reported intermittent abnormal white smoke in April 2017 (complete with a few videos). However, as it was intermittent the dealer couldn't do anything about it. I was aware that eventually a recall/fix would be coming, so held off. Have lost approx 1/4 of the coolant in the reservoir.

So being wary of cylinder damage, I've told the dealer that I will be coming down to inspect once the head comes off. I've consulted Dr.Google to check images of cylinder scoring.

So at what point would cylinder scoring be considered bad enough to warrant a replacement engine ?

Note that engines have been found overseas to be scored badly enough to require a replacement under warranty.

**solarite_guy** · 06-04-2018, 10:07 AM

To be honest, at this age of the engine, unless you've driven around the world a few times, there should be 0 (ZERO) scoring. Any scoring should result in a replacement. Actually, is a well cared for engine, 2 laps around the planet should also show 0 (ZERO) scoring.

Also:

I would tend to want compression and leak down tests performed on all cylinders before it coming apart. Before doing it, ask them what is normal for this engine. Depending on the results, that could give you a better reading on the cylinder walls and rings health than a visual.

For the leak down, good chance at TDC is not where you want it tested, though that is where it is usually tested. A test at TDC and again at 70 - 75* ATDC might be more meaningful in this situation. They just need to make sure to keep rotating the crank in the direction of normal operation. Reversing the crank can screw up consistency in the results.

An independent authorized mechanic (if there is such a thing for warranty purposes) might be the best place to start.

Cheech · 06-04-2018, 11:14 AM

Thanks Solarite.

Only 17k on the engine ( delivered to us June 2016).

I don't really want to pay an Indie to check the engine out considering it was Fords Spanish engine factory FU.
(Manuel put the wrong head gasket in).

Just hoping that there's no scoring and they get the timing right when they bolt it back together.

**solarite_guy** · 06-04-2018, 11:17 AM

Yes, hope it all turns out well.

bangm001 · 06-04-2018, 12:31 PM

Keep us in the loop on here. Good luck with it.

au350hp · 06-04-2018, 01:16 PM

In the nicest way, make sure whoever your dealing with understands that you chose Ford for what is a major purchase and you were delivered a defective product. Solarite_guy is spot on I reckon. Being such a young engine & the fact it hasn't blown up or cooked, it makes sense they're shouldn't be any issues. When you get your car back, put the hard word on Ford for free servicing or something. In my book, they owe you big time. Good luck.

Cheech · 06-04-2018, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roostercam

In the nicest way, make sure whoever your dealing with understands that you chose Ford for what is a major purchase and you were delivered a defective product. Solarite_guy is spot on I reckon. Being such a young engine & the fact it hasn't blown up or cooked, it makes sense they're shouldn't be any issues. When you get your car back, put the hard word on Ford for free servicing or something. In my book, they owe you big time. Good luck.

They're lucky I'm a Ford tragic !

Ordered this sight unseen and based on overseas rumours.

8 months wait, but I got the first one in NSW AFAIK.

But damn, its a fun car when you get out of the city on the right road.
Nothing like a blast up the Putty road

Maka · 06-04-2018, 01:34 PM

All you should be seeing when the cylinder head is lifted Cheech is beautiful cylinder hone marks, but my real reason to comment is your comment about the Putty Rd

, gods own road for good handling cars lol!!

Good luck with getting your awesome Focus RS

sorted asap, Ford should & will look after you mate!

cheers, Maka

Cheech · 06-04-2018, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maka

All you should be seeing when the cylinder head is lifted Cheech is beautiful cylinder hone marks, but my real reason to comment is your comment about the Putty Rd

, gods own road for good handling cars lol!!

Yep. Those speed limits in the twisty sections are just "recommendations" aren't they ?

Maka · 06-04-2018, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheech

Yep. Those speed limits in the twisty sections are just "recommendations" aren't they ?

Apparantly so, but we are good boys, arent we Cheech lol!!

cheers, Maka

au350hp · 06-04-2018, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheech

They're lucky I'm a Ford tragic !

Ordered this sight unseen and based on overseas rumours.

8 months wait, but I got the first one in NSW AFAIK.

But damn, its a fun car when you get out of the city on the right road.
Nothing like a blast up the Putty road

Cheech, if I have had the money at the time, I would have happily ordered one at the same time but in green(my favourite colour in any shade). I reckon they are AWESOME cars. Walking the dogs each morning, I often see a blue one, the exhaust popping as its still warming.That engine is a brillant motor, it is a shame there is any negative associated with it. But when you see what Tickford are doing with the eco boost Mustang, that engine appears capable of some impressive power and looks to be a mainstay for Ford's future. If this RS is a taste of Ford's future performance cars, things are looking good. Who knows, they may return to small displacement V8's one day....

Bossxr8 · 06-04-2018, 03:43 PM

After 17,000 km and only losing 1/4 of the coolant in the overflow (that's my assumption of what you said) I would not be worried at all. Should be no issue. Just not using enough coolant for it to cause any bore wear problems I would have thought.

Cheech · 06-04-2018, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roostercam

Cheech, if I have had the money at the time, I would have happily ordered one at the same time but in green(my favourite colour in any shade). I reckon they are AWESOME cars. Walking the dogs each morning, I often see a blue one, the exhaust popping as its still warming.That engine is a brillant motor, it is a shame there is any negative associated with it. But when you see what Tickford are doing with the eco boost Mustang, that engine appears capable of some impressive power and looks to be a mainstay for Ford's future. If this RS is a taste of Ford's future performance cars, things are looking good. Who knows, they may return to small displacement V8's one day....

Overseas tuners have been getting some impressive numbers.
Autotech here was also experimenting with their RS.
I just see it as a bit risky to tune, being an unsupported open deck design that's already pushing 26psi on overboost.
Its fast enough as it is and that's coming from someone who owned a mildly worked 315rwkw FG XR6T.

au350hp · 06-04-2018, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheech

Overseas tuners have been getting some impressive numbers.
Autotech here was also experimenting with their RS.
I just see it as a bit risky to tune, being an unsupported open deck design that's already pushing 26psi on overboost.
Its fast enough as it is and that's coming from someone who owned a mildly worked 315rwkw FG XR6T.

Agreed. I was really referring to the fact that the same motor happily propels the extra weight of the Mustang with apparent ease. I never really understood the amount of WRX owners who in my opinion, ruined a great factory car with all sorts of beefed up this & that. Carsales is littered with cheap thrashed WRX's whilst a stock standard version has reasonable investment potential. I would think the RS will be a collectable car in time. If only I could convince my wife that one of those would be better than a Subaru XV which she has her eyes on.

Cheech · 06-04-2018, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

After 17,000 km and only losing 1/4 of the coolant in the overflow (that's my assumption of what you said) I would not be worried at all. Should be no issue. Just not using enough coolant for it to cause any bore wear problems I would have thought.

Yes. You assumed correctly.

Cheech · 06-04-2018, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roostercam

Agreed. I was really referring to the fact that the same motor happily propels the extra weight of the Mustang with apparent ease. I never really understood the amount of WRX owners who in my opinion, ruined a great factory car with all sorts of beefed up this & that. Carsales is littered with cheap thrashed WRX's whilst a stock standard version has reasonable investment potential. I would think the RS will be a collectable car in time. If only I could convince my wife that one of those would be better than a Subaru XV which she has her eyes on.

When the RS was undergoing its pressure test, mrs cheech was given an EB mustang for the day. Her comment - "this thing is nice but its got no balls".
Love the hoon wife !

Cheech · 17-05-2018, 02:30 PM

Had it back for a few weeks now.

There was no cylinder scoring.

Had a good chat with the tech doing the work and he seemed to know what he was doing, which was a big relief.

Scored a Mustang GT as the loaner for a few days.
Sounds good and nice to drive, but nowhere near as sharp or enjoyable as the RS.

The RS still goes like a scalded cat.

So I was happy with the outcome and a thanks & recommendation to Sinclair Ford service.