Hockey says industry grants a waste of taxpayers' money

[Resurrection]

The next federal goverment to stop supporting the Australian automotive industry?

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news...-1226554360571

[TC200six]

This is no surprise. It's been known for a while now that Joe Hockey and other Liberal members like Sue Boyce have been against subsidies to the car manufacturers.

[eb2fairmont]

Ignoring the usual rhetoric about how things are better under Howard and national debt, do these guys really have an answer? Do they have policy? Do they have an idea?

Dont like the current govt at all, but don't really have a choice unless these clowns get their act together and start saying how they'd do things rather than empty negative rhetoric.

[SSD-85]

"When they increase taxes they increase the cost of production in Australia,'' Mr Hockey said.

"That is why we are seeing manufacturing jobs, retail jobs and others go overseas.''
The government lacked an economic strategy and was unable to live within its means,

And your solution Mr. Hockey...?

[flappist]

Well how about all government vehicles are to be Australian made where possible and kept for 100,000km or 3 years to support manufacturing and raising resale by not flooding the market with low km 12 month old auction cars.

I would even go so far as to make all govt cars, in the case of Falcon, EcoLPi or Ecoboost XTs with steel rims in one colour with a completely different bodykit that is not available privately.

Manufacturing would be up so costs per car would drop and people who bought XR6s or whatever privately would not lose so much when trading up.

P.S. Keep this positive and not party politic focused or it will be deleted and there will be tears......

[zilo]

Some car makers think they are too big to fail, like some banks think ....

Nothing wrong with letting them know they will be allowed to fail if they don't listen.

[SSD-85]

Originally Posted by flappist

I would even go so far as to make all govt cars, in the case of Falcon, EcoLPi or Ecoboost XTs with steel rims in one colour with a completely different bodykit that is not available privately.

Manufacturing would be up so costs per car would drop and people who bought XR6s or whatever privately would not lose so much when trading up.

Trouble is though, propping up resale values only has an effect if people buy the car new in the first place. And lets face it, that is where the Falcons problem lies.

[Joe5619]

What I'm not sure from his comments is, is he saying
1) Spending money on car industry is a waste, full stop or
2) The way in which Labor has spent the money is a waste, & they’d change the way it is done.

Clearly the end out come of the above 2 is very different. If it is one, then I'm concern. If it is two, speak up & share your thoughts if you want me vote!!

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Eagleheart

Trouble is though, propping up resale values only has an effect if people buy the car new in the first place. And lets face it, that is where the Falcons problem lies.

Well maybe more will if they get better resale.

And really it is not propping it up rather it is stopping artificially lowering it.

[MethodX]

Originally Posted by Eagleheart

And your solution Mr. Hockey...?

Aus becomes a dumping ground for second had jap cars like nz?

[BroncosXR8]

Pretty sure that all government vehicles leased to the ADF are no longer on short term leases. I know at my work we are keeping ours longer then envisaged... although they are Toyota Taragos.

We do have a Ford Sprinter though! and a bit of a bastard to learn to drive too.

But I don't think the rationing of vehicles is a government directive, rather the current government raped our budget.

2 budget cuts in a year and the second was a 65% cut!!!

[BroadyFord]

Originally Posted by Joe5619

What I'm not sure from his comments is, is he saying
1) Spending money on car industry is a waste, full stop or
2) The way in which Labor has spent the money is a waste, & they’d change the way it is done.

Clearly the end out come of the above 2 is very different. If it is one, then I'm concern. If it is two, speak up & share your thoughts if you want me vote!!

I agree with this.

Even though Hockey is an ideologue who despises money for the car industry, I think he is contending that the way the Gillard Government has been going about handouts has been misguided.

[jpblue1000]

gee I wish the government would support my industry, 60000 dollar HECS debt, 60 hour weeks to keep head above water and it will take 60 years to pay it back.
And its considered important what I do hence the high debt.
JP

[FalconXV]

Originally Posted by flappist

Well how about all government vehicles are to be Australian made where possible and kept for 100,000km or 3 years to support manufacturing and raising resale by not flooding the market with low km 12 month old auction cars.
.

This is such a great idea, we should get behind it somehow . Imagine if enough people wrote to the government before the 2014 Falcon came out to take the resale sting out of it. The auto advocate thing is a joke, not nearly adequate.

[Luke Plaizier]

Originally Posted by Resurrection

Hockey says industry grants a waste of taxpayers' money

Lukeyson says that Politician Wages are a waste of Taxpayer Money.

We should outsource our government to India, since that, and China, are where they wish to send all our manufacturing jobs. Why stop there? There's no reason why Political expertise can't be derived from a foreign country either. They can manufacture ******** and lies at the same quality with much lower cost.

There. Fixed.



Lukeyson

[Agile]

Lukeyson says that Politician Wages are a waste of Taxpayer Money.

Quote of the year so far. Well Done
Got me thinking what have they done to improve the life of Australians that would not have happened anyway?

[pursuit2359]

I sense that Tony Abbott will be invisible for the next few days so that he doesn't have to comment on this...

[pursuit2359]

Also, the Australian Financial Review is reporting that General Motors and Toyota have confirmed that they may seek a fresh round of financial assistance from the federal government for their Australian manufacturing operations

[2011G6E]

The trick being that if the car makers know they will just get bailed out no matter what because they whinge about "Aussie jobs" and "Aussie dinki di cars", then why would they ever change the way they do things?

We see the argument used with plenty of other industries that don't get government support and fold up and close shop...why are car makers a special case? So what if we can make cars here...is that a valid reason to keep pouring taxpayers dollars into them to keep them afloat?

If they can't stand on their own two feet and read the market properly, that's their problem. They've always lagged behind the market with what the public actually wants.

[turbodewd]

The auto industry is our 2nd largest area of imports by value behind oil/petroleum. It makes sense to snare a fraction of this market rather than us be wholly dependent on foreign cars.

On top of this currently when the Fed govt buys cars (and probably States too) they only have to hold them for 2 yrs or 40,000km. I would prefer they save money and keep them for 4 yrs or 80,000km. Taxpayers should not be buying new corollas every 2 yrs!!! WAste of taxpayer dollars! And they should buy only Australian OR the Ranger (Australian-developed).

I actually wrote to my local member a few days ago along these very lines. Ive also written to the ACT Chief Minister and await her reply.

[Hulsty]

Originally Posted by jpblue1000

gee I wish the government would support my industry, 60000 dollar HECS debt, 60 hour weeks to keep head above water and it will take 60 years to pay it back.
And its considered important what I do hence the high debt.
JP

They may not support your industry directly, but the Government supports Universities so that you debt is only $60,000, they also support private schools, hospitals etc. Maybe they should pull all that investment to and let you pay the full price?

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

The trick being that if the car makers know they will just get bailed out no matter what because they whinge about "Aussie jobs" and "Aussie dinki di cars", then why would they ever change the way they do things?

We see the argument used with plenty of other industries that don't get government support and fold up and close shop...why are car makers a special case? So what if we can make cars here...is that a valid reason to keep pouring taxpayers dollars into them to keep them afloat?

If they can't stand on their own two feet and read the market properly, that's their problem. They've always lagged behind the market with what the public actually wants.

Personally I dont mind properly appointed and distributed tax payer funds being invested in the Automotive industry. What a lot of people seem to forget is that many (not all) are co-investments with the auto maker.

The flow on effects of investment in automotive (or any large industry, ie universities) is that many people have jobs and there are many people directly and indirectly employed by these industries. What does many people employed mean? Income tax revenue to to government. The government is not completely stupid, they will be earning good money back on their investment and balancing their books. Even if they invest 100 million over say 3 years, the tax dollars will be earned!!

But if you really think they should pull investment maybe they should pull their investment from all private industry? Schools, hospitals, roads, public transport etc, how much do you think you will be paying for these without Government support to get them off the ground and keep costs etc reasonable?

People need to realise that it is a balancing act to maintain the economy and affordability of everyone, of course there are winners and losers and not all industry will be a winner.

[monzie]

It's not the large car companys that are in the most danger of going under, it's all the local engineering and parts suppliers that go to make up that car. The big boys would still be here as vehicle importers.

Pete

[dmat2391]

I really can't understand why we don't actually see this issue as a security issue. WTF do we expect to use if we're ever threaten by a foreign power. or more importantly what about the refineries we used to have.....the skills we use to have the manufacturing we use to have......
anyone seen the movie wallie from pixa. a nation that only consumes is a fat pig that will eventually be slaughtered for the ***** that are feeding it.
The U.S. is the power that is, but lets face facts. sometimes our "big brother" is busy

[eb2fairmont]

You know there's two things in Hockey's statement. First is that its a waste of money. Second is that we will honor that waste of money.

If it is a waste, then why not say that you'll reconsider the commitment in the interests of taxpayers. That makes a stand and a decision. What we got was a fence sitting excuse to leave the status quo in place.

BTW I support coinvestment decisions, where seed money is used to get a multiplier for investment.

[ivorya]

Don't WE elect these Jerks to spend our money??

We don't elect them to put money in the bank and gloat.

With the dollar so high, these people should be doing everything in their power to help 'The Australian Worker'. If they don't, there will be more people in the Doll lines after handouts.
Lets face it, the Relatively small amount of money they give the Automotive sector is received back under taxes. Not just automotive workers income tax, but the domino effect of every other business (and their workers) that contributes to the vehicles being made here in Aus.

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by dmat2391

I really can't understand why we don't actually see this issue as a security issue. WTF do we expect to use if we're ever threaten by a foreign power. or more importantly what about the refineries we used to have.....the skills we use to have the manufacturing we use to have......
anyone seen the movie wallie from pixa. a nation that only consumes is a fat pig that will eventually be slaughtered for the ***** that are feeding it.
The U.S. is the power that is, but lets face facts. sometimes our "big brother" is busy

Because its not a seurity issue. The only advantage of having a factory that makes large cars may lie in the chance that the invading army was limited to driving medium cars or smaller (and in todays world that only leaves new zealand). Holdens or Fords plant is no more suited to making modern weapons of war than the local ikea store, nor are the skills of the employees.

[Road_Warrior]

Road Warrior says Joe Hockey is a waste of oxygen

[monte.b]

I guess its ok for hockey to say that when he isnt in gove ,however if and when he gets to be in gove he will find it will be hard to not support the local car companies ,think about 50,000 or more people put on the dole ,that wouldnt go down very well i dont think.Maybe malcom turnbul would make a good treasurer , even if i cant stand the bloke

[DJR-351]

I didn't know there where any local car companies in Gove....

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by monte.b

I guess its ok for hockey to say that when he isnt in gove ,however if and when he gets to be in gove he will find it will be hard to not support the local car companies ,think about 50,000 or more people put on the dole ,that wouldnt go down very well i dont think.Maybe malcom turnbul would make a good treasurer , even if i cant stand the bloke

I am sure Joe Hockey (and myself), would love to know where those 50,000 job losses would come from. Only the three manufacturers and their suppliers are able to get government assisstance in which he speaks of. Those three manufacturers only made roughly 230,000 cars last year. At an average selling price of less than $25,000 per car (yes i know territories sell for well over $40,000 but a large number of the cars made last year were export camrys (they leave our shore for less than $20,000) and cruzes (which base models wholesale for less than $16,000)). So at 230,000 (cars) divided by 50,000 (workers) = 4.6 (cars) per worker x $25,000 = $115,000 of productivity per worker. But lets also subtract the generally accepted belief that 30% of the cars made in Australia come from imported parts. Thus $115,000 minus 30% = $80,500 of productivity per worker.

You've either made a huge mistake with the employment levels these monies support, or you have made a great case that these workers are the least productive workers the world has ever bred.