![]() |
|
Welcome to the Australian Ford Forums forum. You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and inserts advertising. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features without post based advertising banners. Registration is simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today! If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us. Please Note: All new registrations go through a manual approval queue to keep spammers out. This is checked twice each day so there will be a delay before your registration is activated. |
|
The Pub For General Automotive Related Talk |
![]() |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
![]() |
#1 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 627
|
Hi all
As the headline reads I am curious about such sights. I regularly see Falcons (An Commodores) towing similar weighted vehicles on car trailers. Some of these tow cars are only fitted with 1600kg tow bars. Even if they were fitted with the 2300kg tow bars surely they still are overloaded. Surely this is illegal and quite dangerous. So what are peoples thoughts on this here? I ask as I was considering buying an AU Falcon/Fairmont for such use but don't want to break the law. Any input must appreciated :-)
__________________
2005 BAII Falcon XR6T - Velocity Blue Factory Options; Sunroof, Premium Sound, Plexus Blue Cloth Trim. Genuine Accessories; XR Scuff Plates, XR Blue Carpet Mats, Boot Liner, Cargo Net, Aux Audio Input (Boosted Type), Front & Rear Mudflaps, Headlamp Protectors, Bluetooth and Mobile Phone Holder. [B]2000 AU2 Fairmont Wagon - Congo Green Factory Smart Bullbar, Hayman Reese Heavy Duty 2300kg Towpack and Front and Rear Mudflaps. |
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#2 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Serpentine W.A.
Posts: 1,639
|
Not sure in other states but in WA its illegal to tow a falcon/ commodore model from about 2000 on wards EG ; Au falcon to present due to vehicle weight as I tried to hire one about a month back and was told that I will need to hire a tilt tray.
__________________
XC GS OLD SCHOOL MUSCLE ![]() Audi A4 S-line quttro Xc falcon Previous fords- xc falcon 500 ,250 x flow 3 speed xc gs worked 250 x flow 4 speed xa Fairmont 302 auto wagon xb falcon 250 log auto 4 door xb falcon 200 log auto ute xc gs project - had to sell :-( xc gs 302 4 speed 4 door xc gs 351 auto 4 door zf fairlane 302 auto zk fairlane 250 x flow carb auto zl fairlane 250 x flow EFI auto xg ute , BA falcon dedicated gas xd, xf x 3 ,ea,eb,ef,au x 3,telstar tx5 |
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#3 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Ballarat
Posts: 2,123
|
I looked into all this to tow a race car around. Basically you need 3+ tonne towing. The cheapest cars that have that are old range rovers and landrovers, otherwise new fourbies are mostly 3t or more towing. Even most 80 series cruisers (before 96 I think) only do 2500kg. Of course though if you have 3t towing on, say, a new ranger, I dont see how the GVM would manage to come in under 4.5t with a loaded car, needing a truck license.
So yeah, I bought an F350. |
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#4 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Ballarat
Posts: 2,123
|
Your other option is a gypsy trailer, but they look a bit shonky and if its for a race car etc, if you crash at the track, youre boned.
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#5 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,882
|
i have towed a bf wagon behind my ba sedan 200km trip, no issues, 500kg tare trailer 1700kg car, so just legal on a 2300kg towbar, trailer has electric brakes so still towed and stopped fine, in saying this on a regular basis i wouldn't recommend it
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
This user likes this post: |
![]() |
#6 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 571
|
I have towed 2 tonnes braked, behind my FG F6 Ute for 400 km and never had a problem.
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#7 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 456
|
Quote:
Warren
__________________
Never argue with an idiot, they will bring you down to their level and beat with experience every time. |
|||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#8 | ||
Rob
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Woodcroft S.A.
Posts: 21,508
|
not quite. The GVM is the rating for the max weight of the tow vehicle, not the total combined weight. a car licence is fine, using a Ranger towing 3t.
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#9 | |||
Rob
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Woodcroft S.A.
Posts: 21,508
|
Quote:
its unlikely, but just thought i'd mention it as many people think as long as its within the rated tow capacity, all is dandy. when towing you have to keep in mind the weight of the trailer on the ball (tow ball mass) becomes part of the car's payload and that you don't exceed the GVM rating or axle weights. you also have to make sure the tow ball mass is below the max rating of the tow bar, the towed mass is below the max rating of the tow vehicle and the trailer weight is within the trailers max load rating (ATM). |
|||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#10 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: NSW
Posts: 4,324
|
Falcon towing Falcon? That's nothing. Although it made me think of this picture.
I'd always make sure the tow car can handle the job. It's not worth the risk ![]() ![]() ![]() |
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
12 users like this post: |
![]() |
#12 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Perth
Posts: 826
|
Quote:
The 4.5t GVM (gross vehicle mass) only refers to the max weight of a vehicle you can drive on a standard drivers licence. Over 4.5t requires a truck licence. GCM (gross combination mass) refers to the max weight of car and trailer. Ranger has a 6t GCM so if the Ranger weighs 3t (including fuel, passengers, Bull bar etc) it can legally tow 3t. |
|||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#13 | ||
Rob
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Woodcroft S.A.
Posts: 21,508
|
given the lack of 'sag' in the tow car rear end, they either have very little tow ball mass, which is a recipe for disaster when towing something that heavy, or they are using a weight distribution hitch with way too much tension, which is also a recipe for disaster. never mind the fact that its comprehensively overweight.
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#14 | ||
Rob
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Woodcroft S.A.
Posts: 21,508
|
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
This user likes this post: |
![]() |
#15 | ||
BA/F6 BF/F6 SSV/R TTG
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Perth
Posts: 7,251
|
I would tow that landcruiser with my territory , but not with that old falcon with crap brakes and skinny tyres.. I have scales for setting up ball weight.
Its all good until you need to STOP...
__________________
BA BF FPV starter button repairs. PM me. Nizpro equipped and Tuned by the BEST in the west Xtreme Ford Tuning 479RwKw Fuel limited, more pumps and power too come. F6#0507 & #0639 Pro racer and Tech expert NIZPRO modifying falcons like Premcar can only dream of , see VIDEO below. https://youtu.be/oa4IfguGQ-A |
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
This user likes this post: |
![]() |
#16 | ||
Rob
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Woodcroft S.A.
Posts: 21,508
|
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#17 | ||
BA/F6 BF/F6 SSV/R TTG
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Perth
Posts: 7,251
|
Yep, definitely need to tow with 4wd or AWD..
__________________
BA BF FPV starter button repairs. PM me. Nizpro equipped and Tuned by the BEST in the west Xtreme Ford Tuning 479RwKw Fuel limited, more pumps and power too come. F6#0507 & #0639 Pro racer and Tech expert NIZPRO modifying falcons like Premcar can only dream of , see VIDEO below. https://youtu.be/oa4IfguGQ-A |
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#18 | |||
RIP...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 15,524
|
Quote:
It can be done without too much problem, but it needs to be setup well. I generally tow with an RTV'd AU ute. It has the 2300kg hitch, with a 4500kg tongue, and a WDH. I also use an AU XR8 wagon now and again also with the 2300 hitch and WDH. The ute is more stable than the wagon, but the wagon is still fine. ![]() ![]()
__________________
. Oval Everywhere... |
|||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
3 users like this post: |
![]() |
#19 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,878
|
Yeah,if the Landcruiser in photo 1 had been loaded 30-40 cms further forward on the trailer,to give a bit of ball weight,photo,s 2&3 would not have been taken
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#20 | ||
Starter Motor
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 10
|
I do a lot of towing using 2000 v6 ford explorer with a home built heavy duty braked trailer. No crap the exploder is the ugliest thing i own but the best tow vehicle ever.
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#21 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 458
|
It's a good question on towing capability of the falcon. I have been comparing FG Falcon Ute to a diesel 4x4 Hilux 7th generation for a friend. Falcons seem quite capable. The Hilux does 2500 braked where as Falcon does 2300kg.
The car will need to tow a trailer up to 5 day a week for many country kilometres. The Falcon is been considered as it can potentially provide the same towing capability for ball park half the cost. There are factors to consider such as reliability. The preference is for 4x4. |
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#22 | |||
Cabover nut
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Onsite Eastcoast
Posts: 10,827
|
Quote:
Was it from another post/forum, were you involved in the towing or was it a passing vehicle which you later came upon the wreckage. I don't know the story.
__________________
heritagestonemason.com/Fordlouisvillerestoration In order that the labour of centuries past may not be in vain during the centuries to come...... D. Diderot 1752
|
|||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#23 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 456
|
Quote:
Warren
__________________
Never argue with an idiot, they will bring you down to their level and beat with experience every time. |
|||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#24 | ||
BA/F6 BF/F6 SSV/R TTG
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Perth
Posts: 7,251
|
Yes , you are correct in what you are saying, but with good setup, well maintained equipment and safe driving , 99% of the time its fine.
__________________
BA BF FPV starter button repairs. PM me. Nizpro equipped and Tuned by the BEST in the west Xtreme Ford Tuning 479RwKw Fuel limited, more pumps and power too come. F6#0507 & #0639 Pro racer and Tech expert NIZPRO modifying falcons like Premcar can only dream of , see VIDEO below. https://youtu.be/oa4IfguGQ-A |
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
This user likes this post: |
![]() |
#25 | |||
RIP...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 15,524
|
Quote:
My trailers ATM is 2700kg. The wheels are indeed Falcon rims, 1 ton Falcon rims, I can't remember the exact rating but it's somewhere around 900kg each. Tyres are also an extra load 215/60/16, from memory 775kg each. It's the most stable trailer I've ever used, if I blow my own trumpet...
__________________
. Oval Everywhere... |
|||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#27 | ||
Donating Member
![]() Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,507
|
Check your local state regulations...they are all different.
Also check your insurance policy. I have found that unless you own a complying heavy duty braked trailer and use it often it is cheaper to use a tilt tray. Nobody in my town hires a trailer to legally hold a 1800kg Falcon. They do hire "car trailers" but. |
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
#28 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,882
|
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
2 users like this post: |
![]() |
#29 | ||
FAWD - No Boundaries
![]() Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Adelaide
Posts: 8,129
|
Ford say to enable the Falcon's tow capacity to be lifted to 2300kg... you need the combination of the heavy duty towbar AND a weight distributing hitch. (a suitably braked trailer is also required)
A Falcon fitted with only a heavy duty towbar (no WDH), is only rated at a 1600kg tow capacity. So even if your State authority may not mention the need for a WDH... technically, if you tow between 1600 & 2300kg without a WDH (& suitable trailer), you are exceeding the manufacturer's stated ratings... and could fall foul of the law (if noticed) and/or your insurance cover (if called upon). A WDH (correctly fitted) helps to ensure that the total ball weight is not exceeded. I personally don't use a WDH, but have large air bags fitted on the rear leaves of my wagon (as part of a self levelling rear suspension set-up), which performs the same task (& my insurance co is happy with that) Either way... you also need to make sure that the weight on the trailer is distributed correctly (too far forward = too much weight on the ball... too far back = not enough) I've towed plenty of cars behind many Falcons, safely and legally, over many years... but to do it, there's a bit more to it than just throwing a car trailer on your towbar, and a car up on the trailer. D
__________________
View My Build thread 22 DJR Shell V-Power Mustang Eskymobile (my first EV) 07 BF2 AWD Falcon Wagon (Daily driver) 04 BA Falcon 1Tonner Ute (New Project) 03 BA Falcon Wagon (Spare) 98 NL Fairlane Ghia V8 (Weekend cruiser) 70 VG paddock racer (Cain it til it breaks.. fix it.. Cain it all over again !)
|
||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
This user likes this post: |
![]() |
#30 | |||
Rob
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Woodcroft S.A.
Posts: 21,508
|
Quote:
it is also critical to only restore a MAX of 100% of the lost front axle load, with many manufacturers now recommending 50%. |
|||
![]() |
![]() ![]() |
This user likes this post: |