K&N air filters, whats your opinion?

bazza91 · 25-09-2015, 05:34 PM

After Sprintman1's comments getting deleted in another thread and my general lack of knowledge about this brand of filter, I thought id start a new thread for everyone to voice their opinions, experiences, links to tests etc about K&N air filters.

Ready.... and GO!

sprintman1 · 25-09-2015, 05:42 PM

Marketing over performance. Standing joke on any lube forum eg BITOG.

jpblue1000 · 25-09-2015, 06:12 PM

Horses for corses really.
they flow better than OEM paper! Just! and as a result will allow greater power in a tuned/Tuning engine. maybe
They filter better than no filter too and plenty of race guys don't run filters chasing maximum power, but risk serious damage, but budget for engine builds yearly anyway!
They are used by guys who drive smaller FWD cars so maybe much of the hate is cultural rather then evidence based.
Ive seen studies/experiments which pitch paper, cotton and foam against one another with interesting results.
My daily hack uses OEM paper, not as sexy but filters better keeping the maintenance costs down. My fun road car runs an oiled foam filter, better breathing than paper given a much larger filter area but less filtration I am sure, and the race car uses a K&N style pod on the end of the turbo to prevent stones and large enough debris to do instant damage, but I'm chasing many many more HP here and rebuilds are expected.
In my opinion and what i've read/ seen either type has pros and cons and the differences are not polar apart.

JP

99AUXR · 25-09-2015, 07:20 PM

Above post is on point.

sprintman1 · 25-09-2015, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpblue1000

Horses for corses really.
they flow better than OEM paper! Just! and as a result will allow greater power in a tuned/Tuning engine. maybe
They filter better than no filter too and plenty of race guys don't run filters chasing maximum power, but risk serious damage, but budget for engine builds yearly anyway!
They are used by guys who drive smaller FWD cars so maybe much of the hate is cultural rather then evidence based.
Ive seen studies/experiments which pitch paper, cotton and foam against one another with interesting results.
My daily hack uses OEM paper, not as sexy but filters better keeping the maintenance costs down. My fun road car runs an oiled foam filter, better breathing than paper given a much larger filter area but less filtration I am sure, and the race car uses a K&N style pod on the end of the turbo to prevent stones and large enough debris to do instant damage, but I'm chasing many many more HP here and rebuilds are expected.
In my opinion and what i've read/ seen either type has pros and cons and the differences are not polar apart.

JP

Ever read a UOA from an engine using a Krap & Nasty?

99AUXR · 25-09-2015, 07:33 PM

Regardless of your opinion and experience isn't constant name bashing in this discussion a little immature since we all ready understand your viewpoint.

bazza91 · 25-09-2015, 07:41 PM

Can we get some photos or links to a used oil analysis? or some other form of test performed?

sprintman1 · 25-09-2015, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bazza91

Can we get some photos or links to a used oil analysis? or some other form of test performed?

Go to UOA section on BITOG plenty there. Dirt comes up as SI of course.

**SSD-85** · 25-09-2015, 08:41 PM

If you need to use a proprietary oil to clean a air filter, then they already have already hook, line & sinkered you...

I use Lukey or FRAM for my filtering needs. Washable & blowable.

Ford Falcon XR6 · 25-09-2015, 09:03 PM

In regards to lack of air filtration we ran a B2600 ute with no air cleaner at all for the last 2 years it has 200,000k's on it now and is still going strong. Not saying it's doing no damage but anyone worried about poor filtration out of a performance air cleaner I don't think it's a relevant issue. The car will usually reach the end of it's natural life before there is any damage done.

mtbkym01 · 25-09-2015, 09:04 PM

Are opinions/facts the same for a twin pod BMC for the Miami?

**Dave R** · 25-09-2015, 09:19 PM

You'll probably have better luck finding power/economy with Peter Brock's energy polariser than you will with a K&N filter in your standard airbox, assuming the existing filter isn't clogged. The people making magnificent claims about filters are generally the ones trying to sell them to you. Like the Herrod K&N vs KPM BMC for Miami cars, those were some entertaining threads.

sprintman1 · 25-09-2015, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 99AUXR

Regardless of your opinion and experience isn't constant name bashing in this discussion a little immature since we all ready understand your viewpoint.

Your not getting this are you? It isn't 'my viewpoint' it's anybody who has realised from UOA how poor the aforesaid is at its primary task.

**Raptor** · 25-09-2015, 10:04 PM

So why do dirt bikes all use oiled foam filters?

I'm with poster 2 and 10 on this. All fit for purpose with pro's and con's and the lower filtration rate isn't going to make a bit of difference for all practical purposes.

.

bazza91 · 25-09-2015, 10:05 PM

I personally wouldnt have thought that an air filter would show any gain on a dyno or in practical driving. surely the throttle body would be more restrictive than an air filter?

superyob · 25-09-2015, 10:06 PM

K&N filters were a popular mod for road bikes in the 80s. However, the removal of the original air box to fit them led to a drop in performance, not an increase. They did look good though...

99AUXR · 25-09-2015, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adrenaline

You'll probably have better luck finding power/economy with Peter Brock's energy polariser than you will with a K&N filter in your standard airbox, assuming the existing filter isn't clogged. The people making magnificent claims about filters are generally the ones trying to sell them to you. Like the Herrod K&N vs KPM BMC for Miami cars, those were some entertaining threads.

Yeap and the power increase seen by the K&N/BMC is within the margin of error for a dyno reading anyway

STINKY NINJA · 25-09-2015, 11:59 PM

I personally have always gotten better economy using a k and n as opposed to a paper ford filter for the simple fact that k and n flows more air than a stock paper filter and with the super rich factory tunes its not rocket science is it?
Especially in older falcons(e series etc) newer paper filters are better designed though.
That's not to say k and n filter as good as a paper filter,you get better flow at the expense of less filtering which I can live with in the city.
I have my theory resting on around 8-10 cars,good enough proof for me.
They work for me,who gives a **** what the rest of you think.
Better economy doesn't show up on a dyno either,how can it.

marty351 · 26-09-2015, 12:51 AM

What does formula 1 use? Bikes and cars?
They manage to squeeze every bit of available HP while being heavily restricted in other departments.

bazza91 · 26-09-2015, 01:10 AM

Ferrari f1 and red bull racing v8 both use bmc air filters.

Express · 26-09-2015, 01:12 AM

I use both paper and oiled.

My cars that have aftermarket cold air intakes are supplied with the K&N’s as part of the setup, my cars that retain their factory specs have paper.

Which brings me to the point that engines wear over time even when you are fussing all over them, so to save me searching the net and possibly not understanding, could someone from the anti-oiled filter brigade post up some layman statistics to show me how much quicker the deterioration of my engine will be if I use oiled over paper.

And will the use of an oiled filter be worse than say not using a high quality engine oil or using a cheap oil filter or even being a bit lacked with regular changes, maybe even hard driving techniques?

Regardless of which way you swing, I’ll accept there are good and bad points with different types of filters and the same can be said for the quality of different filters on the market.

But it seems to me that I’m not hearing much in the real world that my engine failed at dot when it should have reach such and such because I used an oiled filter, therefore in this case nit-picking is probably more to the point when there are just as many other everyday common factors that cause even more damage.

Express · 26-09-2015, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bazza91

Ferrari f1 and red bull racing v8 both use bmc air filters.

They are also the preferred aftermarket filter for a lot of AMG owners.

http://www.bmcairfilter.com.au/

bazza91 · 26-09-2015, 02:00 AM

I think for now I'll be sticking to the oem paper filter until I get into some more serious engine mods then I'll weigh up my options, though the Bmc filters seem to be a good choice.

sprintman1 · 26-09-2015, 05:50 AM

Replaced the Krap & Nasty CAI pod filter on a BMW I owned with an Amsoil EaA CAI filter. Actually filtered, better air flow, looked better, no filter oil etc. Harder to come by though

jpblue1000 · 26-09-2015, 07:56 AM

I've seen tests where the amsoil performed about as well as the K&N. I'm on my phone now so wont post up a link.
JP

sprintman1 · 26-09-2015, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpblue1000

I've seen tests where the amsoil performed about as well as the K&N. I'm on my phone now so wont post up a link.
JP

Air flow yes, cleaning no.

damo76 · 26-09-2015, 10:15 AM

Well K&N must make a difference in performance because if you put on a K&M air filter on a motorbike (even mine) it requires rejetting and is classes as a performance mod.

mike_nofx · 26-09-2015, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bazza91

Can we get some photos or links to a used oil analysis? or some other form of test performed?

http://www.nicoclub.com/archives/kn-vs-oem-filter.html

Heres one test I found when searching myself out of curiosity.
Not sure how relevant it is, but the K&N does pass more dirt. But as mentioned, you use the filter to suit the application, obviously a race vehicle which is kept off dirt wouldn't have an issue.

baboon · 26-09-2015, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bazza91

I think for now I'll be sticking to the oem paper filter until I get into some more serious engine mods then I'll weigh up my options, though the Bmc filters seem to be a good choice.

onya bazza, I went back to paper. But in saying that you should try it and tell us your results. Everyones expectations are different. You might be able to get one for free if you try....

GT450 · 26-09-2015, 10:41 AM

As some have said , it's really horses for courses. I use both and find the oiled filter more economical over time and unless you're into some really dirty environment then there's not going to be any difference over the life of an engine.I have yet to read where an oiled air filter caused damage when used correctly.Maybe there is a chart for that too at the UOA section on BITOG.
Same as i use fully synthetic oils in all my cars ,it may not in the end be any different but it gives me peace of mind and there is definitely no weeping seals or oil leaks that i have experienced with mineral oil.
All i can say is the air must be very dirty in the ACT if K&N won't do a good job of filtration.