Ban on new petrol and diesel cars in UK from 2030

[Yellow_Festiva]

Ban on new petrol and diesel cars in UK from 2030 under PM's green plan.

New cars and vans powered wholly by petrol and diesel will not be sold in the UK from 2030, Prime Minister Boris Johnson has said.

But some hybrids would still be allowed, he confirmed.

It is part of what Mr Johnson calls a "green industrial revolution" to tackle climate change and create jobs in industries such as nuclear energy.

Critics of the plan say the £4bn allocated is far too small for the scale of the challenge.

The total amount of new money announced in the package is a 25th of the projected £100bn cost of high-speed rail, HS2.

Business Secretary Alok Sharma told BBC Breakfast the £4bn was part of a broader £12bn package of public investment, which "will help to bring in three times as much in terms of private sector money".

Mr Sharma, who is president of the COP26 international climate summit that the UK will host next year, said the money would also support the creation of 250,000 jobs in parts of the UK "where we want to see levelling up".

The government hopes that many of those jobs will be in northern England and in Wales, and that 60,000 will be in offshore wind.

The plan includes provision for a large nuclear plant - likely to be at Sizewell in Suffolk - and for advanced small nuclear reactors, which it is hoped, will create an estimated 10,000 jobs at Rolls-Royce and other firms.

Quite a long article.......

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-54981425

[Crazy Dazz]

It's not April 1st?

[xxx000]

Yet we still have deniers who claim that electric cars are a "scam" and that renewables don't and can't work.

[Franco Cozzo]

Misleading headline - 'Ban on new petrol and diesel cars in UK from 2030 under PM's green plan.'

Then the first paragraph

New cars and vans powered wholly by petrol and diesel will not be sold in the UK from 2030, Prime Minister Boris Johnson has said.

So really petrol and diesel vehicles will still be sold they'll just need to have hybrid technology.

[jpd80]

Picture this,
In the next few years, sales of popular diesel powered vehicles are replaced by hybrids and PHEVs
That will do more in the immediate than trying to force everyone into BEVs straight up. A big part
of this is evolving the herd attitude towards electrification, older drivers exit the market replaced
by young drivers in their first vehicles. It takes time but change is coming.

[xxx000]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Misleading headline - 'Ban on new petrol and diesel cars in UK from 2030 under PM's green plan.'

Then the first paragraph

New cars and vans powered wholly by petrol and diesel will not be sold in the UK from 2030, Prime Minister Boris Johnson has said.

So really petrol and diesel vehicles will still be sold they'll just need to have hybrid technology.

Hardly misleading since it's stated clearly in the 1st paragraph.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Misleading headline - 'Ban on new petrol and diesel cars in UK from 2030 under PM's green plan.'



Then the first paragraph



New cars and vans powered wholly by petrol and diesel will not be sold in the UK from 2030, Prime Minister Boris Johnson has said.



So really petrol and diesel vehicles will still be sold they'll just need to have hybrid technology.

I heard on the radio full electric by 2050.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

[whynot]

Even though I am a big proponent of EV (being a sparkie and all that), I personally think that legislating their use is a mistake. It is the same order of magnitude of a mistake as the EU push for diesel vehicles in the 1990 with similar environmental justification and similar poor environmental outcomes.

Part of the problem, in my view, is that lower social-economic groups will bear a disproportionate cost. In other words, there is presently no market for the $2K clunker EV. Yes, in time, perhaps there will be (like in 2050), but not in 2030.

This will appeal to middle class, inner city, greenies, who are quite capable of dropping $60K on a low end EV. I am sure they will happily look outside the window of their EV, with a warm fuzzy feeling, while the lower class catch the bus.

My view is that the best way to go green (if that is the agreed goal) is to keep pouring money into basic research that will reduce the cost of storage and increase storage capacity. Then, let market forces dictate the transition across to EV.

PS. Hybrids are banned from 2035.

PPS. Hang onto that 2025 Camry. It will be worth big bucks down the track.

[T3rminator]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Misleading headline - 'Ban on new petrol and diesel cars in UK from 2030 under PM's green plan.'

Then the first paragraph

New cars and vans powered wholly by petrol and diesel will not be sold in the UK from 2030, Prime Minister Boris Johnson has said.

So really petrol and diesel vehicles will still be sold they'll just need to have hybrid technology.

Someone who reads the details

My UK mate said to me a few days ago he wants to get a Jaguar XK before a "ban" comes in. I said he was crazy if he thought petrol cars would be "banned" but this is probably what he was referring to. They will be grandfathered out.

I think they are jumping the gun a bit. Lithium Ion batteries used in EVs are very dirty to make. Graphite being a main material, is very eco unfriendly to dig out and process. Most of this happens in a part of the world where we are supposed to want to be less reliant on They really need to start investing into battery technology before making such a move, IMHO.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by xxx000

Yet we still have deniers who claim that electric cars are a "scam" and that renewables don't and can't work.

Forcing people into them doesn't prove anything. They are denying people the choice by removing ice's from the market. They aren't letting the people decide if they are good enough.

And renewables work. Sometimes. But what is base load power.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by xxx000

Hardly misleading since it's stated clearly in the 1st paragraph.

What does the headline say?

Sounds pretty misleading to me, if you wanted to be more factual and less fake news it should read:

'UK shift towards hybrid vehicles from 2030'

They're not banning petrol and diesel vehicles at all, they're just making hybrid powertrain mandatory.

Should change your forum username to 'ccp000'.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

And renewables work. Sometimes. But what is base load power.

Don't forget ol Blighty has some lovely safe nuclear power stations. yikes, going green would be the least of your worries.

[Yellow_Festiva]

This is talking about new car sales.

I guess existing cars will allowed to continue being driven.

I wonder if other countries will follow? Or if future Governments will retract it?

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by roKWiz

Don't forget ol Blighty has some lovely safe nuclear power stations. yikes, going green would be the least of your worries.

Nuclear is much better for climate change though.

But these braindead greenies want to have it both ways. Because of the spent nuclear fuel, which is apparently only a miniscule amount these days.

They just want to whinge about anything, and would rather we shut everything down and lived in caves again.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Nuclear is much better for climate change though.

But these braindead greenies want to have it both ways. Because of the spent nuclear fuel, which is apparently only a miniscule amount these days.

They just want to whinge about anything, and would rather we shut everything down and lived in caves again.

I watched a docco on the Nuclear subs the US runs.

30 years of fuel on board!

I always thought nuclear was the best option for us, especially with our large open spaces of next to nothing.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Nuclear is much better for climate change though.

But these braindead greenies want to have it both ways. Because of the spent nuclear fuel, which is apparently only a miniscule amount these days.

They just want to whinge about anything, and would rather we shut everything down and lived in caves again.

Yes I'm sure it is until something goes wrong and when it does, it does big time.
TBH Not just greenies with this, Fukashima, Three Mile Island, Cheynobel people tend to remember these events for good reason.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

I watched a docco on the Nuclear subs the US runs.

30 years of fuel on board!

I always thought nuclear was the best option for us, especially with our large open spaces of next to nothing.

Don't you need lots of water for Nuclear ?, something we don't really have inland.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by roKWiz

Don't you need lots of water for Nuclear ?, something we don't really have inland.

True, but nothing a system of pipes couldn't fix. Existing power stations seem to have large bodies of water attached so they can solve this problem if needed.

My other thought was to have the plant based off shore on a ship of sorts and wired to the mainland.

Should there be a disaster it could be evacuated, remotely detached and powered away from our shores.

In actual fact, the more you think about our situation we are a country very suited to Nuclear.

Wonder how many people realise that there is a nuclear reactor in the Sutherland Shire, 35km from the Sydney CBD? It's even covered in a huge steel cage to detonate missiles before impact with the reactor.

[M&Ms]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

This is talking about new car sales.

I guess existing cars will allowed to continue being driven.

I wonder if other countries will follow? Or if future Governments will retract it?

I think this is exactly what will happen.

BoJo gets the greenies off his back for the next term or two, and then as 2030 approaches, unforeseen circumstances mean we can't meet our goal.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

Wonder how many people realise that there is a nuclear reactor in the Sutherland Shire, 35km from the Sydney CBD? It's even covered in a huge steel cage to detonate missiles before impact with the reactor.

Lucas Heights. Been there a long time. It's tiny by comparison to a power station. Used mainly for medical science, I use to do courier work to it back in the 80's.

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

True, but nothing a system of pipes couldn't fix. Existing power stations seem to have large bodies of water attached so they can solve this problem if needed.

My other thought was to have the plant based off shore on a ship of sorts and wired to the mainland.

Should there be a disaster it could be evacuated, remotely detached and powered away from our shores.

In actual fact, the more you think about our situation we are a country very suited to Nuclear.

Wonder how many people realise that there is a nuclear reactor in the Sutherland Shire, 35km from the Sydney CBD? It's even covered in a huge steel cage to detonate missiles before impact with the reactor.

The difficulty with putting nuclear pants out in the middle of nowhere, assuming you can get sufficient water supply (and my understanding is that nuclear plants require substantially more water than a coal-fired plant, for eg) is the ability to be able to transmit that power without significant losses. Which decreases the overall system efficiency substantially.

As an engineer, you soon learn that no design is perfect. Any design is about compromise and that goes for a nuclear plant as well, even without the risk of a nuclear accident.

The problem with your idea of a floating platform is how you make it stable enough in rough conditions. We've seen what can happen, at Fukushima, when stability of foundations is compromised and the plant is subject to flooding. Not impossible to design around, but as per above, there will be compromises as a result of that design.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0

The difficulty with putting nuclear pants out in the middle of nowhere, assuming you can get sufficient water supply (and my understanding is that nuclear plants require substantially more water than a coal-fired plant, for eg) is the ability to be able to transmit that power without significant losses. Which decreases the overall system efficiency substantially.

As an engineer, you soon learn that no design is perfect. Any design is about compromise and that goes for a nuclear plant as well, even without the risk of a nuclear accident.

The problem with your idea of a floating platform is how you make it stable enough in rough conditions. We've seen what can happen, at Fukushima, when stability of foundations is compromised and the plant is subject to flooding. Not impossible to design around, but as per above, there will be compromises as a result of that design.

The large scale solar farm currently under construction at Winton is something people from cities should really see, absolutely amazing the scale of this thing.
Its built right at crossroads (so to speak) of transmission wires crossing from the Snow hydro and high country hydro power stations. There will be another built slightly further north at Greta.
The camping grounds at Winton raceway houses all the workers in their own camp city and mini bussed (about 3kms) out to the site everyday.
Irony of the whole set up is the amount of Road Trains (2 40ft containers per truck) they need to bring the hardware and solar panels onsite with.

[FoxtrotGolfXray 5.0]

Originally Posted by roKWiz

The large scale solar farm currently under construction at Winton is something people from cities should really see, absolutely amazing the scale of this thing.
Its built right at crossroads (so to speak) of transmission wires crossing from the Snow hydro and high country hydro power stations. There will be another built slightly further north at Greta.
The camping grounds at Winton raceway houses all the workers in their own camp city and mini bussed (about 3kms) out to the site everyday.
Irony of the whole set up is the amount of Road Trains (2 40ft containers per truck) they need to bring the hardware and solar panels onsite with.

Here's the google maps view of the Bungala solar farm, largest solar farm in Australia I could find an image of:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Bu...!4d137.8399898

Check out the dimension in comparison to the township of nearby Port Augusta. Gives you a good idea of the scale of these things.

[Burnout]

They forget how much water is needed to keep these solar farms panels clean, something they forgot in California years ago. The whole farm there is is ruins and produces nothing, except broken glass and some alloy waste.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Burnout

They forget how much water is needed to keep these solar farms panels clean, something they forgot in California years ago. The whole farm there is is ruins and produces nothing, except broken glass and some alloy waste.

I read somewhere some of the new panels use self cleaning glass.

[BradEL]

What miserable miserable news

[Adamz Ghia]

We are an island nation, completely surrounded by water.

And we don’t use tidal power.

The oceans will never die in our lifetime, they’re supposed to be even rising. The ocean currents never stop. Endless power that doesn’t stop when the sun goes down and the wind stops blowing. Perfect power source to charge our electric cars.

[Tassie f100]

Originally Posted by Adamz Ghia

We are an island nation, completely surrounded by water.

And we don’t use tidal power.

The oceans will never die in our lifetime, they’re supposed to be even rising. The ocean currents never stop. Endless power that doesn’t stop when the sun goes down and the wind stops blowing. Perfect power source to charge our electric cars.

Yeah can’t really see why tidal power hasn’t been trialled as an alternative source.Big fast flowing water out and in Port Phillip heads 4 times per day everyday and so close to major cities.Solar is a great supply but the need for big battery storage for base load is a bit of a problem.Wind power is a big con,don’t think a big windmill can ever recoup the massive initial cost

[ozrunner]

What a lot of tripe.

Boris can make such a feel good statement to please the lemmings knowing its 10 years away. He probably won't nor his mob be in power then plus circumstances change that can easily be used to modify it and he knows that.

Many Governments of the day have made forward announcements that subsequently get canned or changed by the next incoming Govt, eg like Rudd and his NBN cable to all houses proposal that was then changed to nodes only by the Libs and the list is long.

[ivorya]

No more tradies i guess!!!