Oil change

NZ XR6 · 07-01-2018, 06:57 PM

I'm not quite sure why I bought this given the Fuchs Pro Flex has been so good, but I bought this for the next oil change. It was on special at Repco, and I'm intrigued by the claim that it meets ACEA C2 and C3.

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cobrin · 07-01-2018, 08:00 PM

Yeah that's one of their old/er labels, around the same time Nulon were also changing theirs (which they did again later on) which had me wondering if there were some funny business going on with Low SAPS spec's at the time. I believe it's a suitable replacement where C2 is required so makes sense to put it on the bottle.

Here's one my Father bought at Ford whilst trying to look for Castrol Pro A5 for his ecoboost:

NZ XR6 · 08-01-2018, 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cobrin

Yeah that's one of their old/er labels, around the same time Nulon were also changing theirs (which they did again later on) which had me wondering if there were some funny business going on with Low SAPS spec's at the time. I believe it's a suitable replacement where C2 is required so makes sense to put it on the bottle.

Here's one my Father bought at Ford whilst trying to look for Castrol Pro A5 for his ecoboost:
image

ACEA A1/B1 and M2C913-B??? I do hope he didn't put that in an Ecoboost!

I had to visit a couple of Repco stores to find that - most of their stock was the older C3 only product. I doubt they sell much of the Enviro+ range.

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rondeo · 08-01-2018, 02:28 PM

"I'm not quite sure why I bought this given the Fuchs Pro Flex has been so good, but I bought this for the next oil change. It was on special at Repco, and I'm intrigued by the claim that it meets ACEA C2 and C3."

Meets c2 and c3?

https://www.oilspecifications.org/acea.php

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&r...ykGq_2yjyPiHgj

The C3 claim looks superfluous, pointless etc.

Redundant, another good old Latin? word.

https://www.etymonline.com/word/redundant

rondeo · 08-01-2018, 03:06 PM

P.S.

If it meets C2 it meets C3.

Some old guy said to me once -
'You're not often wrong, but you're right this time.'

NZ XR6 · 08-01-2018, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rondeo

P.S.

If it meets C2 it meets C3.

Some old guy said to me once -
'You're not often wrong, but you're right this time.'

No, because the minimum HTHS for a C3 oil is 3.5, but is 2.9 for C2.

However, a C3 oil can meet C2, except it won't provide the same fuel economy benefits because of the higher HTHS.

What Penrite say in their brochure is that their C3 oil is "suitable for use" where a C2 oil is specified. But it's not the same as using a C2 oil.

I'll see how it goes.

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rondeo · 08-01-2018, 07:40 PM

You're right NZ! Damn! Good work!

I wonder if anyone has compared fuel consumption with eco oils and C3.

I've used C3 for 100's k km and get a long term average of 6.2 l/100km, so would be clear if I changed.

However I buy on special at $80/10 litre and have 30 litres in store!

stefcio007 · 11-01-2018, 08:36 PM

I literally just put Penrite C4 in 2 days ago. Much better for the DPF as my DPF loading gauge sits on the low end a lot. Less build up than what I was using previously.

NZ XR6 · 12-01-2018, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stefcio007

I literally just put Penrite C4 in 2 days ago. Much better for the DPF as my DPF loading gauge sits on the low end a lot. Less build up than what I was using previously.

Interesting. I think the Mondeo has done one regen since changing to the Fuchs Pro Flex a year ago.

I really don't know why I bought the Penrite instead. I might see if I can return it.

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stefcio007 · 12-01-2018, 12:08 PM

Cobrin that’s the same stuff Ford gave us for the Ranger. Next time we asked for oil they gave us the 20L Castrol drum.

bundybear75 · 15-01-2018, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NZ XR6

I'm not quite sure why I bought this given the Fuchs Pro Flex has been so good, but I bought this for the next oil change. It was on special at Repco, and I'm intrigued by the claim that it meets ACEA C2 and C3.

image

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I have been using the Penrite Enviro C2 oil (0W30) in my Land Cruiser as it is the recommended Penrite oil for the DPF's. Its like sewing machine oil. Seems the goods though expensive ($160/10L)

NZ XR6 · 15-01-2018, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stefcio007

Cobrin that’s the same stuff Ford gave us for the Ranger. Next time we asked for oil they gave us the 20L Castrol drum.

They gave you that Formula E oil for a diesel Ranger?

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stefcio007 · 20-01-2018, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NZ XR6

They gave you that Formula E oil for a diesel Ranger?

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So I thought maybe I misread the bottle you posted but I checked the picture I have an it's exactly the same bottle.

I'm guessing you're post is a surprised tone, so that oil must not be right then?

NZ XR6 · 20-01-2018, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stefcio007

So I thought maybe I misread the bottle you posted but I checked the picture I have an it's exactly the same bottle.

I'm guessing you're post is a surprised tone, so that oil must not be right then?

Exactly. I haven't checked, but the Ford spec on the label was superceded at least 10 years ago. As for ACEA A1/B1, that is their lowest petrol engine oil spec.

That oil is completely unsuitable for a modern DPF diesel.

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Highway cruser · 20-01-2018, 05:41 PM

Ok, new to the Mondeo's and I know if you ask what's the best oil to use you get almost as many oils as you do replays. Mines the 2.0 tdci with DPF and I've been looking at which oil to use but this has me questioning my self again. I was going to go with the penrite 5W-30 fully synthetic as per the picture.
So just wondering the benefits of the c-3/C-4 or any other oils apart from making my pockets lighter?

stefcio007 · 20-01-2018, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Highway cruser

Ok, new to the Mondeo's and I know if you ask what's the best oil to use you get almost as many oils as you do replays. Mines the 2.0 tdci with DPF and I've been looking at which oil to use but this has me questioning my self again. I was going to go with the penrite 5W-30 fully synthetic as per the picture.
So just wondering the benefits of the c-3/C-4 or any other oils apart from making my pockets lighter?

I used this before since the website recommended it, wasn't the best for the DPF or maybe the oil was getting a bit old after 10k km. The only advantage I see is it comes in 6L.

NZ XR6 · 21-01-2018, 03:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Highway cruser

Ok, new to the Mondeo's and I know if you ask what's the best oil to use you get almost as many oils as you do replays. Mines the 2.0 tdci with DPF and I've been looking at which oil to use but this has me questioning my self again. I was going to go with the penrite 5W-30 fully synthetic as per the picture.
So just wondering the benefits of the c-3/C-4 or any other oils apart from making my pockets lighter?

There are quite a few threads here and on the UK Ford forum about oil for diesel Mondeos. I can post some links if you like.

The brief summary is that you should use a mid-SAPS oil because the engine has a DPF. Peugeot, who made the engines, recommend their own oil spec which is basically ACEA C2. You can also use C3, which will provide slightly more protection to the engine.

I haven't noticed any DPF regen cycles since changing to a good quality C3 oil a year ago (Fuchs Titan GT1 Pro Flex).

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NZ XR6 · 25-01-2018, 06:51 PM

Well, I finally changed the oil today. I don't get 0.9 l/hr waiting at the lights anymore.

It will be interesting to see what the economy is like on long trips.

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NZ XR6 · 26-01-2018, 05:59 PM

I was wrong, it will sit at a steady 0.9 l/hr with the a/c off once the engine is fully warmed up.

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ivorya · 29-01-2018, 08:37 AM

Can anyone tell me the differences between Ford oil 913-D and the newer spec 950-A?

What issues would occur if you used the newer spec in an engine that specify's the older?

cobrin · 29-01-2018, 09:32 AM

Ford WSS-M2C913-D
Introduced in 2012, oils meeting this specification are recommended for all Ford diesel engines except Ford Ka TDCi models manufactured before 2009 and Ford Galaxy 1.9 TDi models manufactured between 2000 and 2006. A product meeting this specification is especially recommended for diesel engines where M2C913-B or M2C913-C oils were initially required. An oil meeting this specification must be used in Ford Transit vehicles manufactured from 2012 onward with Duratorq 2.2 engine. Oils meeting this specification can be used with extended oil change intervals and are also suitable to be used in engines running on biodiesel or high sulfur diesel.

Ford WSS-M2C950-A
Special engine oil for Ford Focus Diesel 2.0 manufatured from September 2014 and Ford Mondeo Diesel 2.0 manufactured from 2015. Viscosity should be SAE 0W-30.

Essentially 913D is a slightly thicker grade (5W30) giving a HTHS viscosity between 2.9 and 3.5 mPa.s, where as the 950A will be 0W30 and have a small improvement in fuel economy over 913-D and have a lower HTHS level which i can't currently find. You should get a small improvement on fuel consumption but you might burn a bit of oil in the service interval so monitor, protection wise wouldn't be much of a diffference but if there is any it'll be less protection at higher temps but not enough to damage the engine (IMO). I stick to to 913-D as it's easier to source and no real tangible benefits to be had from 950-A.

ivorya · 29-01-2018, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cobrin

Ford WSS-M2C913-DIntroduced in 2012, oils meeting this specification are recommended for all Ford diesel engines except Ford Ka TDCi models manufactured before 2009 and Ford Galaxy 1.9 TDi models manufactured between 2000 and 2006. A product meeting this specification is especially recommended for diesel engines where M2C913-B or M2C913-C oils were initially required. An oil meeting this specification must be used in Ford Transit vehicles manufactured from 2012 onward with Duratorq 2.2 engine. Oils meeting this specification can be used with extended oil change intervals and are also suitable to be used in engines running on biodiesel or high sulfur diesel.Ford WSS-M2C950-ASpecial engine oil for Ford Focus Diesel 2.0 manufatured from September 2014 and Ford Mondeo Diesel 2.0 manufactured from 2015. Viscosity should be SAE 0W-30.Essentially 913D is a slightly thicker grade (5W30) giving a HTHS viscosity between 2.9 and 3.5 mPa.s, where as the 950A will be 0W30 and have a small improvement in fuel economy over 913-D and have a lower HTHS level which i can't currently find.

Thanks for the info mate.

I've been researching some oils for my Kuga TDCi service and looked at Nulon. They recommend this one https://www.nulon.com.au/products/fu...ent-engine-oil which comply's with the 913-D spec. However, it's very confusing as the bottle states not suitable for DPF. When asked, the technical department said, yes, to use this oil.
I also see on their website, they also suggest this https://www.nulon.com.au/products/di...sel-engine-oil which is the 950-A spec. A specifically designed oil for the diesel, and better value as it comes in a 6L.

Which one would you choose?

cobrin · 29-01-2018, 10:36 AM

I use this one

I went a bit crazy last year and the year before so I now have thirty litres of the stuff and ten litres of the C-4 variant.

For your Kuga can you give the Spec's on the vehicle?

rondeo · 29-01-2018, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ivorya

Thanks for the info mate.

I've been researching some oils for my Kuga TDCi service and looked at Nulon. They recommend this one https://www.nulon.com.au/products/fu...ent-engine-oil which comply's with the 913-D spec. However, it's very confusing as the bottle states not suitable for DPF. When asked, the technical department said, yes, to use this oil.

This is a well known contradiction.
I rang Nulon once but they were unable to explain.
One could try ringing Ford ....

cobrin · 29-01-2018, 02:37 PM

Probably go the C2 black label for it being 6L and designed for DPF's/Full synth/correct grade.

There have been a few contradictions in the past as said, with both Penrite and Nulon. I simply chose Nulon products to use, I don't know enough of Penrite (not having looked into their alternatives) but you shouldn't have any problem with their stuff. Enviro+ C2 that is.

ivorya · 29-01-2018, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cobrin

For your Kuga can you give the Spec's on the vehicle?

Mate, it's a 2014 TDCi, the series 1. The manual says 913-D spec oil.

It's amazing that there can be so many specifications for a grade of oil!!
I mean, they all use the same base synthetics, just the compositions of additives prob change a little...

cobrin · 29-01-2018, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ivorya

Mate, it's a 2014 TDCi, the series 1. The manual says 913-D spec oil.

Yeah don't use that Full Synthetic 5W-30 Fuel Efficient Engine Oil.

Do as you were thinking and shoot for DPF compatible stuff, that is what I do over everything else for my tdci.

rondeo · 30-01-2018, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cobrin

There have been a few contradictions in the past as said, with both Penrite and Nulon.

Also in the present:

https://www.nulon.com.au/products/fu...ent-engine-oil

Check specifications and the cautions tabs.

ivorya · 30-01-2018, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rondeo

Also in the present:

https://www.nulon.com.au/products/fu...ent-engine-oil

Check specifications and the cautions tabs.

Not for use in PDF etc.....

Yes, however, the technical department at Nulon told me that it was OK for me to use in my TDCi, and that label was there as a warning for other manufactures.
He said, the vehicle requires 913-d, use this oil as it meets the specs that ford had put out.

Confused, it's bloody crazy!!!!

rondeo · 30-01-2018, 06:20 PM

Crazy?

Step this way sir,
our service consultant
will take care of you ...

Enter John Cleese.

Problem Sir?
- Well, it's the oil ...

What?
- It says it's not suitable.

Not suitable?
Of course it's suitable
why do you think
I recommend it? (you fart).

Well sir,
- It says it's not suitable ...

Oh that. That's just a precaution.

- a precaution?

In case other manufacturers
get the wrong idea.

- What's the wrong idea then?

Well, Ford has the best mpg,

F88ck the DPF.

etc.