ESP standard equipment on VE Commodore

[QualityCounts]

"Holden will fit ESP as standard equipment on its coming VE Commodore, Statesman and Caprice, and the Captiva SUV".
Credos to Holden for such a smart safety move!
Now, the pressure is on the other three local manufacturers to follow suit.
http://wheels.carpoint.ninemsn.com.a...Alias=wheelsau

[Dr Smith]

"Holden was the first local manufacturer to offer ESP with a locally built sedan when it was specified as standard in 2004 on VZ Commodore Acclaim and V6 variants of Calais, Statesman and Caprice.".....and Ford was the first to offer it on an Australian built motor vehicle...oh that's right the Territory is not a sedan.

[whynot]

Yeah, I know the niggly agro in the press releases by Holden gets to me too. Full credit, however, to GMH for now including ESP in the base models as well. This feature will make a significant reduction in the road toll in the coming years.

I was talking to the Boss (wife) before and the conversation turned to all the car accidents in the wet (it is raining in Brisbane at present). I mentioned to her how the DSC works on the Territory, and that you can hear it by the groaning / chattering noise it makes. Then she exclaims “is that what that noise is!” Apparently she had been out in the wet one night recently and misjudged a corner. The car made loud groaning noise and she first though that she had broken something. But not worry because “it went around the corner real good.” I just had a cold shudder and walked away.

The DSC probably saved a minor accident then and there. It is a great invention that will save plenty of average drivers, including people like the Boss and I, from some of their follies.

[new2ford]

Yes I found I had to use Extra Sensory Perception a lot to get myself out of situations when I owned a Holden.

Holden's never been an innovator but they like to claim they are. They got into the NRMA mag a while ago claiming to be first with radials, disc brakes and auto transmission - none of which they were first with. But Goebbels is alive and well at Holden and the masses continue to swallow it.

[ltd]

Yes, Holden drivers swallow lots of things............press releases, sales tactics etc.
Barina drivers swallow broken plastic, glass and airbags in an accident too. But the press and Paul Gover will still stand upon the mountain and preach to the masses how good Holden are.

Holden means a really really really great deal to a mechanic or a panel beater

[brodfloyd]

esp and DSC are the same thing right???
why are holden claiming they are the first to do it then?
they exploiting the loopholes? cos its not standard on BF xt??? and fpv?
the radio yesterday said they were the first ppl to put it in a locally made car, i nearly crashed, but i was in a BF fairmont, so the dsc kicked in :

ford release dsc and it gets three lines in the paper, holden do it a year later and win australian's of the year.

Man i hate them, and i hope they get cancer, in the head

[Stoney!]

Actuallyif you wanna look at it that way, the Commodore was first to come out with ESP in the 2004 Calais where ford had it in the BF in 2005. And the VYII Adventra LX8 came out with it in 2003 when fords Territory came out with it in 2004. So really they were the first, but only by a smidge.

They were also the first australian made car to come out with Independent rear suspenion (albeit not a very good one but still safer than a liver rear axel at the time) first to have pyrotechnic front seat belt pretensioners in the VT and first to offer side airbags as an option. First to release 4 channel ABS,

But the Magna (as crap as it was at the time) was the first to come out with 4 wheel discs.... I'm pretty sure it was anyway.

Stoney!

[Professor Farnsworth]

Originally Posted by brodfloyd

...Man i hate them, and i hope they get cancer, in the head

steady on ..

[jmc-007]

Can you still change wheel sizes with ESP/DSC or will it upset it

[Pinkbits]

Originally Posted by Stoney!

But the Magna (as crap as it was at the time) was the first to come out with 4 wheel discs.... I'm pretty sure it was anyway.

Stoney!

XB GT, way back in the 70's

[AWD Chaser]

Don't forget the WB Statesman in 78 aswell....

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by Stoney!

Actuallyif you wanna look at it that way, the Commodore was first to come out with ESP in the 2004 Calais where ford had it in the BF in 2005. And the VYII Adventra LX8 came out with it in 2003 when fords Territory came out with it in 2004. So really they were the first, but only by a smidge.

They were also the first australian made car to come out with Independent rear suspenion (albeit not a very good one but still safer than a liver rear axel at the time) first to have pyrotechnic front seat belt pretensioners in the VT and first to offer side airbags as an option. First to release 4 channel ABS,

But the Magna (as crap as it was at the time) was the first to come out with 4 wheel discs.... I'm pretty sure it was anyway.

Stoney!

Actually no Holden V8 has esp/dsc stability control EVER so that makes the Territory the first Australian built motor vehicle to offer it as standard or optional. And only Ford offers it on some V8's. The Holden V6's have it however they didn't come to market before the terry.

[FPV329]

Are they gunna put it on their premium models ( HSV ) or are they gunna try and flog the top models without the top feature ( like FPV )?

[Fairlane]

Well its good to see Holden forge ahead in safety for a change, since airbags were introduced in The VR, holden's safety cred hasnt exactly set the world on fire. In fact to put it simple the VY/VZ commodore's are hideously unsafe in 2004/2006/2006, 160 odd kw and 205 15" RE92 tyres with only ABS and no traction control.

[AWD Chaser]

Ford Firsts (As quoted by their website)

2002 First local manufacturer to include adjustable pedals.
2000 First local manufacturer to offer dedicated LPG engine
1998 First local manufacturer to include dual airbags as standard
1997 First local manufacturer to introduce three year/100,000 km warranty
1996 First local manufacturer with standard airbag in commercial vehicle
1994 First local manufacturer to fit driver's airbag as standard
1993 First local manufacturer to fit centre rear lap-sash seat belts

And I'm sure some ppl can add something about the BA/BF transmission (tiptronic, 6 speed, etc...)

Holden Firsts (as quoted by their website)

(Anything before 1934 is just really the introduction of the automotive industry to Australia)
1934 Produces first coupe-utility
1948 Launch of Australia's first locally manufactured car by Prime Minister Ben Chifley
1966 Australian safety first. Fits seat belts on all models
1968 Introduces energy-absorbing steering column to Australia
1969 Opens first Australian automotive safety design test centre at Lang Lang Proving Ground, Victoria
1992 Australian safety first. Introduces anti-lock brakes (ABS)
1993 Australian safety first. Introduces driver airbag system

The website doesn't list anything after 2003...

[Fairlane]

1934 Produces first coupe-utility

huh

I always Ford invented the coupe utility and i always though Mitsubishi had the First ABS in its Verada.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by REDXR8BLOKE

XB GT, way back in the 70's

I thought the Landau was the first, just beating the GT.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Fairlane

huh

I always Ford invented the coupe utility and i always though Mitsubishi had the First ABS in its Verada.

Ford did invent it first, everyone knows that except Holden who try to BS people by saying they assembled a coupe utility Chev first. Has been proven incorrect but they don't want to accept it.

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by Fairlane

huh

I always Ford invented the coupe utility and i always though Mitsubishi had the First ABS in its Verada.

That was the impression I was under too. Ford were the first to bring it to mainstream in 1992 with the EBII. The Verada was too expensive for the average Joe to afford it, hence Ford winning the 'mainstream' gong.

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by au3 chaser

Holden Firsts (as quoted by their website)

(Anything before 1934 is just really the introduction of the automotive industry to Australia)
1934 Produces first coupe-utility
1948 Launch of Australia's first locally manufactured car by Prime Minister Ben Chifley
1966 Australian safety first. Fits seat belts on all models
1968 Introduces energy-absorbing steering column to Australia
1969 Opens first Australian automotive safety design test centre at Lang Lang Proving Ground, Victoria
1992 Australian safety first. Introduces anti-lock brakes (ABS)
1993 Australian safety first. Introduces driver airbag system

The website doesn't list anything after 2003...

Originally Posted by Stoney!

They were also the first australian made car to come out with Independent rear suspension (albeit not a very good one but still safer than a live rear axle at the time) Stoney!

I would tend to believe what you read on the Ford website but I wouldn't believe what you read on the Holden website.

These were the Australian-made cars that in fact introduced some of the above features first:
Austin 1800 had seatbelts as standard from 1964.
Anti-lock brakes (pressure limiting valve) was on the Mini from 1961.
Independent rear suspension was also on the Mini from 1961.
Other claims made by Holden include: radial ply tyres (Austin 1800 1964), disc brakes (Mini Cooper 1962).
All these features carried through to other BMC models. It took Holden 20-30 years to catch up with some of these developments.

The ABC once did an excellent expose on Toyota's claim to have opened up the Snowy Mtns Scheme with the Landcruiser. Land Rover had all the order books to prove their claim to history. All Toyota could produce was their own publicity brochure! I wish somebody in the media could get stuck into Holden the same way. As I said - Goebbels is alive and well at Holden. If you keep repeating a lie everyone will believe it.

[Lukeyson]

Originally Posted by ltd

Yes, Holden drivers swallow lots of things............

They suuuuuuuuuuuuuuure do. lol

[chevypower]

[QUOTE=au3 chaser]Ford Firsts (As quoted by their website)


1998 First local manufacturer to include dual airbags as standard
QUOTE]

Not that any of those things in the past have much of an influence on what kind of car I buy today, but the VR Commodore was out with the driver airbag before the EF was released - FOrd were still trying to sell ED's
I still remember those dodgy commercials with airbags inflating everywhere...These articles have been using the term "electronic crash avoidance" which implies it uses the system where the car senses a crash and takes control of the vehicle to avoid the collision - but its just electronic stability control, which is ok, but nothing really new - should have been on cars already

[Martyvan]

Originally Posted by QualityCounts

"Holden will fit ESP as standard equipment on its coming VE Commodore, Statesman and Caprice, and the Captiva SUV".
Credos to Holden for such a smart safety move!
Now, the pressure is on the other three local manufacturers to follow suit.
http://wheels.carpoint.ninemsn.com.a...Alias=wheelsau

Have you ever posted anything positive regarding a Ford on this web site?

I think not....

Intersting move from Holden... Maybe they are going to fit decent sized wheels and tyres, or maybe this (Fitting ESP) is to compensate them goingback to a 12" Rim with white walled 100 profile tyres....

[AWD Chaser]

Originally Posted by new2ford

I would tend to believe what you read on the Ford website but I wouldn't believe what you read on the Holden website.

These were the Australian-made cars that in fact introduced some of the above features first:
Austin 1800 had seatbelts as standard from 1964.
Anti-lock brakes (pressure limiting valve) was on the Mini from 1961.
Independent rear suspension was also on the Mini from 1961.
Other claims made by Holden include: radial ply tyres (Austin 1800 1964), disc brakes (Mini Cooper 1962).
All these features carried through to other BMC models. It took Holden 20-30 years to catch up with some of these developments.

The ABC once did an excellent expose on Toyota's claim to have opened up the Snowy Mtns Scheme with the Landcruiser. Land Rover had all the order books to prove their claim to history. All Toyota could produce was their own publicity brochure! I wish somebody in the media could get stuck into Holden the same way. As I said - Goebbels is alive and well at Holden. If you keep repeating a lie everyone will believe it.

This is about Australian firsts....

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by au3 chaser

This is about Australian firsts....

Que? How do you define an Australian manufacturer? BMC was one of the major Australian car manufacturers building cars here of eventually up to nearly 100% local content (cf. the current situation). The parent company was foreign, yes - like GM, Ford and Toyota. The designs were Australian developments of overseas designs, yes - like early Ford Falcons, Camrys etc. And how much of Holdens have been 'Australian' in reality? The Commodore comes from Germany (thus bringing from overseas some of the innovations listed on this thread) and I suspect if you look into it most early Holdens had large chunks of Chevrolet in them because they certainly handled like American cars.

Either you're unaware of the history of the motor industry in Australia or you're setting up a paramater that somehow Holden is the only true blue Australian manufacturer. The Holden PR dept would be happy with that.

If you want to be really narrow - I can think of only two Australian cars from the ground up - the Leyland P76 and the Ford Territory.

[AWD Chaser]

I'm just talking about Australian automotive firsts, regardless of the company or the vehicle...

However, I see my mistake by only quoting Ford and Holden... but I coun't find info on the others for Australian introductions....

[new2ford]

Fair enough au3 chaser but you may see my point that 'Australian firsts' can sometimes be not what they seem. Both BMC-Leyland Australia and, more recently Ford have been strong local engineering innovators. Holden hasn't tended that way - more marketing driven. Which sadly is why they managed to stay at the top of the market, and why they are good at finding clever ways with words to convince people that they were first. Like the use of the word 'sedan' with the DSC claim to carefully exclude the Territory.

And anyway I think with Holden this latest thing is all marketing driven to cover over the fallout from the Barina.

[AWD Chaser]

Looks like they weren't so carefull.

The definition of sedan is as follows:

"A closed automobile having two or four doors and a front and rear seat."

But I know, I know, there are varients of this - coupe, sedan, hatchback, wagon, ute, truck, etc, etc. I guess the only few that don't fall under this definition are convertables, buses, and motorbikes... oh, and don't forget scooters...

[MoreHPformyXR6]

Is ESP & DSC the same thing?

How do they basically work.

Have all Fords Falcons from BA onwards have DSC?

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by MoreHPformyXR6

Is ESP & DSC the same thing?

How do they basically work.

Have all Fords Falcons from BA onwards have DSC?

They are the same thing (electronic stability control) under different manufacturers' fancy names, See:
http://www.mynrma.com.au/easy_guides...ty_control.asp

http://www.mynrma.com.au/files/1/Ele..._factsheet.pdf

The NSW RTA used to have a list of all vehicles fitted with ESC but no longer. Some member of this forum with more knowledge of Fords can hopefully answer you re Falcons.