VE Commodore Front Structure

[Citroënbender]

AKA “Asking for a Friend, V2.0”
(Different friend, but also uninsured, his “Sunday car” mint VE Calais - driving it while the locksmiths repaired his work van’s steering lock!)

It looks like the offside rail is fine, the nearside maybe pushed down 5-6mm at the end.

So he’ll need this (clipped from Dumbtree):

Is a Calais bonnet different? What about the headlights?

How does the pictured front clip fix to the rails - are there sacrificial spars? Or do the rail ends crush and need sectional repair?

Any other comments about stuff that’s a repair “gotcha” from this generation of Commodore, would be appreciated.

[MrEL]

Will end up bring a repair that keeps costing more and more.
There will be lots more to be replaced then it looks.
Suddenly makes insurance cheap.
If he was insured he would getting a cheque.

[prktkljokr]

Used to wreck these from home when they were new, (you couldn't buy parts from Holden for the first 18 months ) very easy to drop the whole nose off in 1 hit, pop the bumper off and headlights out and just unbolt the rad support ( Rad support with bar reinforcement, washer bottle etc) the radiator and air con will sit there on the crossmember, the Calais headlights are different from the standard and there are 2 types, 1 has the standard globe the other has the projector, the bonnet mould will fit a standard omega bonnet, grille and front bar are Calais, Statesman type set up.

Looks like a high hit, I would say the rails will be ok.

[Interceptor]

Originally Posted by prktkljokr

Used to wreck these from home when they were new, (you couldn't buy parts from Holden for the first 18 months ) very easy to drop the whole nose off in 1 hit, pop the bumper off and headlights out and just unbolt the rad support ( Rad support with bar reinforcement, washer bottle etc) the radiator and air con will sit there on the crossmember, the Calais headlights are different from the standard and there are 2 types, 1 has the standard globe the other has the projector, the bonnet mould will fit a standard omega bonnet, grille and front bar are Calais, Statesman type set up.

Looks like a high hit, I would say the rails will be ok.

5 years behind the parts counter at Holden, I'm pretty confident in backing the advice from this bloke

[Citroënbender]

Good info, thanks. These are were projector lamps, right?

There’s just a slight misalignment where the NSF guard meets the screen pillar, it’s kicked out maybe 3-4mm if that; why I think the left rail is pushed down just a little. Sounds like bar and lower grille will be the hardest parts to source. Any real differences in radiator/condenser quality across the market (assuming both need replacement)?

It’s 2010 by the rego, is that a Series 2?

Insurance is a good thing, I think a lot more people are skimping on it now though. This fellow is not a leaner, he’s still paying his way well past when many of us have ceased work - or even life. But, yes, he would have been 100% better off with cover.

[prktkljokr]

Yeah projector headlight, the guards move heaps when they take a knock to the front, the headlights do it as they push the guards out, rails are pretty low, may have bent the cap on the end of the rail that the red support bolts to, but they are easy replaced.

[Interceptor]

2010 should be a VEII, 2009.5my was the changeover

[commodorenutt]

My wife’s VE got backed into by an SUV. Pushed the LH headlight in about 3 inches, popped the bonnet, and pushed the guard out. Insurance quote was over $7k. There was so much hidden damage. The rails weren’t touched. If they were, they said they would have written it off. I priced up all the bits 2nd hand for under $2k, and this was my backup plan. But in the end, insurance fixed it.

I’d be checking the rails carefully. As soon as any of those pre-formed dimples are folded up, they will want to write it off. Not saying you can’t fix it yourself, but it’s not a simple case of pulling the rails back out if they have been compressed.

I saw one at pick & Payless around 2017 that had a compressed rail on one side. The repairer fitted home-made plywood spacers between the rail cap and the radiator support to get it to all align….. anything is possible…. Only needed longer bolts….

[Citroënbender]

I had a deeper look, there probably is a little rail end damage but for now I’ll work with what I can. VIN plate says April 2010, so they’ll be the extra rare Series 2 projector headlights, right?

Any thoughts on why it will crank and start, but not stay running? 265K on the clock, two senior owners. It was already due for chains.

[prktkljokr]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

Any thoughts on why it will crank and start, but not stay running? 265K on the clock, two senior owners. It was already due for chains.

Yep it would have a hole in the intake pipe from the air filter to the throttle body, MAF will be giving a wrong reading.

[commodorenutt]

My brother in law recently fitted stock style aftermarket projector headlights into his VE2 to replaced crazed & frosted originals. They are comparable in beam spread, light consistency and cutoff, when compared to the near new OEM ones in my wife’s car (VE1 Calais V). Unlike the TYC ones for the FG….. which are crap compared to the OEM ones.

Can’t help you with the V6 though, as I only play with V8 VEs, but it would be worth doing an OBD2 scan to see what code it chucks up. Did the airbags pop? If they did, it might need resetting before it will run.

Edit: just read the comment above, and looking at the damage again, I’d say that the intake plumbing is the likely issue.

[prktkljokr]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

I had a deeper look, there probably is a little rail end damage but for now I’ll work with what I can. VIN plate says April 2010, so they’ll be the extra rare Series 2 projector headlights, right?

Some non gen headlights will do the trick
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/12120976...3ABFBMoP2VhvVh

[Citroënbender]

Originally Posted by prktkljokr

Yep it would have a hole in the intake pipe from the air filter to the throttle body, MAF will be giving a wrong reading.

Ah, yes, it certainly does. Thanks.

I’d have thought that just put it in a conservation mode, weak throttle response to limp home.

No pyrotechnics deployed, there’s an airbag warning light on but I suspect sensor wiring or something.

[prktkljokr]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

image

Ah, yes, it certainly does. Thanks.

I’d have thought that just put it in a conservation mode, weak throttle response to limp home.

No pyrotechnics deployed, there’s an airbag warning light on but I suspect sensor wiring or something.

You can see in that image how the headlights destroy the guards.

[Citroënbender]

I’m now finding some elements of Mr EL’s comments ringing in. Like the broken intake section which seems to be a SIDI only part, therefore dearer/less common.

Picking up a complete radiator support tomorrow for $200, will see what else pops up. Any spots within striking distance of Sydney are welcome.

[Syndrome]

That dirty engine bay means this is not a mint car.

[Interceptor]

I'd be calling a Holden service agent and asking them if its the series 2 update, theres one niggly little thing that doesnt look right to me...
IIRC VE s1 MY2009.5 saw the SIDI update, but in the engine bay pic its missing the redesigned plastic panel at the base of the windscreen that covered the horn to prevent a problem they were having when the horns got wet.
https://carsales.pxcrush.net/carsale...ze=1795%2c1195
https://carsales.pxcrush.net/carsale...ze=1795%2c1195
If you look in the back RH corner of the engine bay beside the brake master cylinder, you'll see what I'm talking about.
Funny what you remember when you get the "official" training course....

At a minimum the series 2 got a new shape headlight, grille & bumper cover, radiator support & associated parts I dont think changed a whole lot.

[Citroënbender]

Argh. Is it a “9.5” update, not a true S2, then? Horns are in the outer corners of the radiator support below headlights. It’s going to be fun assembling enough pieces of a headlight shell to read a part number. Ballasts are not on top of the aluminium reinforcement either, if that makes a difference.

One win from all this, is I’ll now be the shop expert on washer reservoirs. They seem to have the flexible filler tube loose from reservoir on every second car that comes in.

Syndrome: The car identifies as mint; their choices are supported both by a therapist and all four road wheels. They hope to one day work with disabled animals in a neurodiverse safe shelter, but for now are hustling as a travel influencer.

[prktkljokr]

Bonnet
https://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/camp...ais/1293772443
Here is someone who is wrecking a few VE's
https://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/hass...s1-/1310564086
Calais front bar
https://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/smit...828/1286987387

[Interceptor]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

Argh. Is it a “9.5” update, not a true S2, then?

I'm thinking so.

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

Horns are in the outer corners of the radiator support below headlights.

Take a lookin the drivers side rear corner of the engine bay beside the brake master cylinder reservoir, IIRC its the horn for the cars security system.

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

It’s going to be fun assembling enough pieces of a headlight shell to read a part number. Ballasts are not on top of the aluminium reinforcement either, if that makes a difference.

The part number should be on the upper horizontal surface of the headlight on the black plastic part, in the pics you've put up they look like they'll be hidden under the plastic of the front end "module".
Ballasts? what ballasts? The headlights on SWB Commodore variants are all standard halogen bulbs, regardless if projector type or not, IIRC H7 and H9.
The only time the VE range got HID headlights was in the statesman/Caprice range, easily identified by a black trapezoidal panel midway along the bottom edge of the headlight lens where the headlight washer unit was mounted.

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

One win from all this, is I’ll now be the shop expert on washer reservoirs. They seem to have the flexible filler tube loose from reservoir on every second car that comes in.

That filler hose, on VE's, had a reputation for splitting.... used to keep 3-5 on the shelf at all times.

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

They hope to one day work with disabled animals in a neurodiverse safe shelter, but for now are hustling as a travel influencer.

And again in english?

[Citroënbender]

Thank you both. I’d assumed projector lenses meant HID units in these.

STwins was already on the shortlist as were JJ and Oz Car Parts (they’ve made a good bit off me since about 2017).

And again in english?

I was referencing the thread in here, where people were awkwardly criticising “the youth of today”.

Worked out the electric vacuum pump on front of the motor is for brakes and maybe other things. Its plastic elbow got broken.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

Worked out the electric vacuum pump on front of the motor is for brakes and maybe other things. Its plastic elbow got broken.

We're looking at one of those to see if its suitable to **** off the vacuum pump alternator in mates Land Cruiser so he can move to something with more oomph.

[Citroënbender]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

We're looking at one of those to see if its suitable to **** off the vacuum pump alternator in mates Land Cruiser so he can move to something with more oomph.

https://bluewireautomotive.com/produ...e-vacume-motor
Someone’s already re-branding them.

Do you or Interceptor remember the vacuum connections - was it just pump to reservoir and booster via a one way valve and tee, or is it more involved? Hoping I don’t have to replace some vacuum harness that requires massive dismantling just because of the front elbow being snapped. Will be shonking it with heat shrink for a quick fix.

[Dr Terry]

Originally Posted by Interceptor

I'd be calling a Holden service agent and asking them if its the series 2 update, theres one niggly little thing that doesnt look right to me...
IIRC VE s1 MY2009.5 saw the SIDI update,

At a minimum the series 2 got a new shape headlight, grille & bumper cover, radiator support & associated parts I dont think changed a whole lot.

AFAIK the first SIDI engines weren't introduced @ MY9.5 they were introduced in Aug 09 (MY10 VIN ALxxxxxx), so @ April '10 it is a MY10.

Having said that, VEII wasn't introduced until Sept '10 (MY11 VIN BLxxxxxx).

I don't believe that the car pictured is a VEII, it's late VEI (MY10).

Dr Terry

[prktkljokr]

If its just the plastic elbow, can you use a Bunnings black poly retic elbow as a replacement, they do a few automotive sizes from what I have seen

https://www.bunnings.com.au/holman-1...elbow_p3120094

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

AKA “Asking for a Friend, V2.0”
(Different friend, but also uninsured, his “Sunday car” mint VE Calais - driving it while the locksmiths repaired his work van’s steering lock!)

image

It looks like the offside rail is fine, the nearside maybe pushed down 5-6mm at the end.

So he’ll need this (clipped from Dumbtree):

image

Is a Calais bonnet different? What about the headlights?

How does the pictured front clip fix to the rails - are there sacrificial spars? Or do the rail ends crush and need sectional repair?

Any other comments about stuff that’s a repair “gotcha” from this generation of Commodore, would be appreciated.

You have a few friends that need educating about insurance, if there are more let them know it’s worth the cost of getting it (especially if “at fault” and another vehicle being involved).

[Citroënbender]

Yes, I’m doing my best to educate. Beemer bloke is lurching from one mishap to another at the moment, though.

It’s a big part of why I was asking about those $180 3-way dash cams last week.

It’s funny in a way; I’m really tight/picky about how and what I spend on but still consider certain insurances essential.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Fordman1

You have a few friends that need educating about insurance, if there are more let them know it’s worth the cost of getting it (especially if “at fault” and another vehicle being involved).

Third party fire and theft costs SFA, I've got it on all my ****box fleet so if I rear end someones Lamborghini Urus I'm not paying them off $10/week for the next 300 years

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

https://bluewireautomotive.com/produ...e-vacume-motor
Someone’s already re-branding them.

Do you or Interceptor remember the vacuum connections - was it just pump to reservoir and booster via a one way valve and tee, or is it more involved? Hoping I don’t have to replace some vacuum harness that requires massive dismantling just because of the front elbow being snapped. Will be shonking it with heat shrink for a quick fix.

The only one I've ever had to replace was on a Volvo I5, and it was just a disconnect and reconnect job on that, it just had a simple vacuum line running to it.

[prktkljokr]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Third party fire and theft costs SFA, I've got it on all my ****box fleet so if I rear end someones Lamborghini Urus I'm not paying them off $10/week for the next 300 years

I have 9 cars insured, can only drive 2 at any 1 time, seems a bit of a waste, but you have to have it, had 1 car run into in the driveway while we were out, so it pretty much paid for having it insured.

Was going to look into one of those business blanket insurance that covers you for whatever car you are driving in the event of a accident, but I don't know if it would cover the cars that are parked up?

[Interceptor]

Originally Posted by Dr Terry

AFAIK the first SIDI engines weren't introduced @ MY9.5 they were introduced in Aug 09 (MY10 VIN ALxxxxxx), so @ April '10 it is a MY10.

Having said that, VEII wasn't introduced until Sept '10 (MY11 VIN BLxxxxxx).

I don't believe that the car pictured is a VEII, it's late VEI (MY10).

Dr Terry

*shrugs* I'm just the guy who got paid to have his brain numbed crunching those numbers and staring at the catalogue every day....
Vague memory from way back when (I havent worked for Holden since the end of 2018) was that the SIDI engines were released mid 2009, I couldnt remember the dates from when the S2 was released but it wasnt all that long afterwards.

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

Do you or Interceptor remember the vacuum connections - was it just pump to reservoir and booster via a one way valve and tee, or is it more involved?

Unfortunately, I never got involved with the vac pump further than supplying a couple to some local hot rodders