Decision, decisions...

[BENT_8]

So the eldest lad turned 18 recently, he's been working in his job since soon after turning 14 and is training to become management.
Last week he came to me and asked about getting a newer car under finance.
At first i baulked at the idea, then i remembered that i was a teenage boy once too and couldnt wait to get into a better car than i had.

My first car was a 77 TE Cortina 2.0l 4sp, that was in 93 making it a 16yr old car at the time.
In February the lad got his first car, a 97 VS Esteem in really good condition but still a 19yr old car.

After a little nagging i said i'd come and have a look with him, i fugured he'd probably just go and try without me so i might aswell try and steer him in the right direction.
We looked around for a few days and stumbled across an 04 BA XR6 with 112k's in mint condition for $8k.
He's been going on about getting an XR6 for ages and so, whilst at the upper extreme of what you'd ever want to pay for a BA these days this one ticked all the boxes for what he wanted, all the boxes until we enquired about financing a car of that age. As you can imagine it wasnt going to be easy so after a few knock backs we sat down and discussed the situation.
The wife and i offered to help him get it but he wanted to go in alone.

See the problem he faced was that anything with an XR badge commands a premium, so you either get a crappy one in his budget or a good one of earlier vintage that finance companies wouldnt look at for the term he needed.

Anywho, to cut a long story shorter, kind of, we put him onto the bloke who we use for finance. He works for an independant yard that specialises in late model cars at good prices compared to the dealers.
He offered to get him pre approval at a fair rate for a first timer, so he knew how much he could spend in his budget and not waste any more time running around chasing his tail.

Thats when he spotted a VE SII Commodore on the lot.
It surprised me at first as we'd been searching for BF/FG XR6's for the last week but i took a closer look.
The car was in really good condition, grey, good service history, he was really keen, then the salesman said someone had put a deposit on it pending finance.
He said he had another one in stock, white, same k's, good history, it was a nicer car to be honest.
Just then one of the salesmen rolled in with an FG2 at the same price so we had a look at that aswell, it was nice but didnt have the same presence as the Commodore.

So im standing there between the VE and FG and im thinking my god, what a compomise.
On one hand is the VE II, arguably the best looking Commodore to ever roll off the line, with a hideous V6.
On the other hand is the FG2, plain looking compared to the Commodore but sporting the bullet proof Barra.

It was so frustrating to love the look of the VE but know the FG contains the better driveline.

In the end he bought the VE, i let him make the choice as he has to live with it and pay for it. He loves it and its packed full of gizmo's and safety features which should keep him content and hopefully in one piece, but i cant help but feel he bought an inferior car in every way bar looks.

Now im not trying to start a **** fight or trolling, just being honest with the situation we found ourselves in.
Anyway it got me to thinking, of all the cars produced by Ford and Holden over the recent years, what would make the perfect car.

For mine it would be...

VE Bodyshape...just has a certain presence
FGX Sprint I6T motor...do i need to explain
ZF 6sp...i doubt anyone would argue this point
VF Chassis...get it all down without spitting out bushes
FGX interior...fit and quality

It would be a true frankencar, all the best bits brought together in one.

[Adamz Ghia]

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

Took some pics today .... as I had a go with with a Microfibre applicator pad and Meguairs Ultimate compound ... result ... very promising ... even when done by hand. I reckon i took about 80-90% of the swirls out with by hand with 2 goes over the one section (half a boot lid)

Also took a few pics of the headlights as well ... it looks like whatever was spilt on them as etched into the top UV coating of them ... I had a good go with Meguiar's Ultimate Compound on them and it did clean up a little of a light cloudiness on them ... but when parkers are on ... you can see the etch lines.

I remember my first loan. 16.9%!!

[Junkyard-Dog]

The Commodore handles a lot better than the Falcon and I think it has much better rear-suspension in particular but I agree the V6 feels a bit gutless compared to the Barra. The V6 doesn't have as much torque as the I6 and it sounds especially weak at revs but I still would've chosen the Commodore anyway.

[TUF_302]

If only it was a an SS, personally id have pushed him into the FG, i think they are a better looking car so, i do get why you felt the way you did

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

In the end he bought the VE, i let him make the choice as he has to live with it and pay for it.

Just don't be surprised when he jabs you with his evil red light-sabre.

[Crazy Dazz]

It reminds me of the time I helped my daughter buy her first car (as opposed to our AU she had been driving.) A nice enough, late model, low k, Nissan Tiida.
After the deal was done, she glibly reminded me that I had once proclaimed that I would never help her buy a car that didn't say Ford on it.
She thought this was funny, until I pointed out the Licence plate frames. (Car was purchased from a Ford dealer.)

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Adamz Ghia

I remember my first loan. 16.9%!!

He managed 11%, not too bad considering his age and being his first ever attempt.
He'll pay around $70pw which is pretty fair to own a 2012 plate car of its type, i remember paying $100pw for an EA Fairmont in the mid 90's.

The killer is the excess on the insurance should he ever need it...$1900

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by TUF_302

If only it was a an SS, personally id have pushed him into the FG, i think they are a better looking car so, i do get why you felt the way you did

An SS would have been perfect, only it would have to sit in the driveway for 12 months till he got off his 'P's.

The old man would be obligated to take it for a strap every now and then...

[roddy1960]

G'day , I certainly don't mind the last couple of Commodore models , VE and VF ..best looking for sure..You did the right thing leaving it up to your son to choose..He drives it , he chooses it...That said , I would always choose a Falcon in the same circumstances your son and you had..I am biased though because I love the FG and why I bought one in March (Mk1 XR6)..I honestly think that the amazing Barra hooked to the ZF 6 speed is pretty darn good..Looks wise Commodore VE is one of their best , and outshines for me the messier overkill of the VF but the FG in my eyes looks pretty cool here too..but that is just me of course..I hope he really enjoys his new Commie and has a great run out of it..Cheers Rod..

[menil]

11 % I have a few dollars in the bank earning about 2%

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by menil

11 % I have a few dollars in the bank earning about 2%

And they complain about their profit margins.

[Brazen]

Good on him, good to see the young ones still interested in Aussie cars.

The VEIIs were really well sorted, much better than the VEs in the interior. Loved mine, still think Holden nailed the ride, handling and steering on it - it felt like one cohesive unit with everything all working together. With the 6 speed auto and direct injection, found it economical too.

[Raptor]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

....what would make the perfect car.

For mine it would be...

VE Bodyshape...just has a certain presence
FGX Sprint I6T motor...do i need to explain
ZF 6sp...i doubt anyone would argue this point
VF Chassis...get it all down without spitting out bushes
FGX interior...fit and quality

...all the best bits brought together in one.

I think you've nailed it

That's why Australia needed its own automotive industry rather than allowing a few US, European and Asian outfits to set up local outposts, that quite frankly were in no way central to their main game. All competing against each other in a very small pool of buyers. It was never going to last, the benefit of hindsight maybe.

What you have described would have been competitive with anything globally and there wouldn't have been any barriers to export it either.

Oh what could have been

.

[mik]

I remember my first car ........ i think ? it was a fixer upper , a smashed 1960 ish pink and grey fb holden (some people just have no shame ) .

Its good the young bloke did his own thing and didnt just hit the oldman for a couple of bucks , and its good the old fella helped give him a steer in the right direction(well done old fella),
i wish my old fella was a bit more accommodating in the fatherly pursuits .... i digress. .
you couldnt really go wrong with either choice i think ....... diff bushes on the henry , big deal if that is the only real item that might be on the slightly higher maintenance list , its small potatoes for what is other wise a very good car.

If cars the calibre of those two models had been around when i was young , perhaps my young driving history may have been a bit less colorful .

[mcflux]

Good purchase, hopefully it doesn't have any issues for him.

The downside to the loan is it's at 11%...

The upside to the loan is your young bloke will now have a credit history, which will help later in life when he's looking at his first house, etc.

[Giant Cranium]

make sure he services it sooner than the 15k mark. that motor is known for doing timing chains due to oil build up. i had a ve that did one at 110 and 160 and it had a perfect service record.

good on you for pointing him into a safe modern car.

[Big_Daz]

The VE Series 2's are a good looking car, their biggest problem is the ****** 3 litre V6 in the Base model.. I had one as a company car for 3 years its a horrible engine, you have to rev it to get anywhere and when you do rev it, it sounded like a washing machine... Everything else about the car was great for a base model though.. When I got into my FG XR6T on the weekends Id end up using the same throttle to take off id use in the VE and end up sideways...lol...

As for the OP's Question, I think the VF Series 2 SS V Redline is a good car as it sits but I would leave the Redline as is apart from Substituting the LS3 for the FG F6/Spring Engine with a Manual Gearbox.. now THAT would be the perfect car for me...

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Giant Cranium

make sure he services it sooner than the 15k mark. that motor is known for doing timing chains due to oil build up. i had a ve that did one at 110 and 160 and it had a perfect service record.

good on you for pointing him into a safe modern car.

Cheers, yep, first port of call after picking it up was Supercheap for a new filter and 7L of Penrite 5w30 goodness. 20% off at the minute.

$80 every 10k is where its at.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Ghia5L

The upside to the loan is your young bloke will now have a credit history, which will help later in life when he's looking at his first house, etc.

Well funny story that, about 3 weeks ago he came to me and said he wanted to move out with some friends, a couple he works with.
I sat down with him and worked out his daily expenses and found he would be around $250pw out of pocket if he left home.
I said why not stay home, put that into your savings account for 2 years and then buy a house, i said you'd have close to $30k in the bank.

We discussed the pro's and con's and agreed to give it 12 months and agreed to bank $200 with the balance paying for the car.
As he's just turned 18 his pay increased $2.50ph, we hadnt factored that in at the time and he now finds his payrise alone covers the car and insurance.

So in 3 weeks he went from moving out and spending half his wage on living expenses whilst driving a 19yr old car, to staying home with a plan for his immediate future, building credit history and a 4yr old car.

Im as proud as punch to be honest.

[Mercury Bullet]

Love the OP.
It reminds me of when I went to get my first real car.

I wanted that sexy white coupe with the blue stripes. Dad was adamant that it was cop bait and I would spend the next few years talking to Mr Plod.
Of course I ended up driving out in a shiny XC Cobra.

I showed dad what they were selling for just before he died. I received the biggest smile in return. He secretly loved the car, but he wasn't going to tell me that.

Some of the best Father/Son times we had were out searching for cars.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Mercury Bullet

Some of the best Father/Son times we had were out searching for cars.

Thats exactly how i feel about it all.

We spent some real quality time together and spoke about things weve never discussed before.
I had the opportunity to teach him about little things to look for, particularly with regard to the Falcon's we'd seen, and he seemed to love the dance with the salesmen as we made our way around.

Good times indeed.

[BLUEYBA]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Well funny story that, about 3 weeks ago he came to me and said he wanted to move out with some friends, a couple he works with.
I sat down with him and worked out his daily expenses and found he would be around $250pw out of pocket if he left home.
I said why not stay home, put that into your savings account for 2 years and then buy a house, i said you'd have close to $30k in the bank.

We discussed the pro's and con's and agreed to give it 12 months and agreed to bank $200 with the balance paying for the car.
As he's just turned 18 his pay increased $2.50ph, we hadnt factored that in at the time and he now finds his payrise alone covers the car and insurance.

So in 3 weeks he went from moving out and spending half his wage on living expenses whilst driving a 19yr old car, to staying home with a plan for his immediate future, building credit history and a 4yr old car.

Im as proud as punch to be honest.

Hi

Just wondering if you told him you were proud of him??

Not knocking you or anything just a genuine question

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by BLUEYBA

Hi

Just wondering if you told him you were proud of him??

Not knocking you or anything just a genuine question

All good, certainly did, numerous times infact.

[BENT_8]

Hey, seeing as the thread is titled decisions, decisions, i found myself facing a moral dilemma on Sunday.
Following on from the purchase of the lads new car, we had to move on his old wheels.
So to set the scene, we picked up his first car, a 97 VS Esteem, from an elderly lady in February this year.
She'd owned the car for 16yrs and had serviced it with Hamilton Holden like clockwork ever since, it had 183,000 genuine k's on it, Panther Mica, everything working and 5 months rego, even the roof lining was perfect.
The only let down was the body, it had a few scrapes around the bumper corners and a dent below the drivers door moulding.
She wanted $1300, we gave $1100.

Fast forward to last weekend and we have not spent 1 dollar on it except for a new fuel cap as he left it sitting on a bowser somewhere.
So after looking through Gumtree at what they are pulling, and only having 1 weeks rego left, i wacked it up Saturday night for $1100 and figured we'd be happy with $1k and he'd break even as he'd had 5 months of free rego.
Within minutes i had my first call and a promise to buy if i'd give them till the following morning at 10am so she could confirm things with her husband.
I agreed as it was fairly late saturday night and i wasnt showing it to anyone that late.
Anywho, at 6am Sunday morning i begin getting bombarded with messages about it. I explained that i couldnt do anything until 10am, soon enough i had a dozen names and numbers of people who wanted to be rung if it was still available, then they started offering overs to jump the queue.
Im getting offers up to $1400 on the spot to let it go, im like WTF, its a VS Commodore.

In the end the people who rang first bought it, didnt even haggle, i was still recieving calls during the test drive.

So since letting it go i've had people telling me i was mad for letting it go for $1100 when i could have had $1400. I get the point but it wouldnt have been right from my perspective.
What would you guys do.

[lra]

If you advertised it for $1100, and the buyer paid $1100, you got want you wanted, unless you are a real estate agent who thinks that gazumping is not immoral.
Gentleman's agreements are hard to find these days.

[mike_nofx]

One option I'm surprised more people don't take up for lower value loans under $10k is when banks offer 0% interest on balance transfers, yes there are sometimes transfer fees but they work out waaaaay less than the average personal loan.

So what you do is take out a credit card or use your existing credit card but bump the limit to say $10k. Buy the car from a dealer with credit card. Immediately transfer the balance to the 0% balance transfer bank, I think there is about a 2% transfer fee - $200. Then pay it off interest free for 2 (or whatever the term is) years.
Collect creditcard points for the purchase.

Of course you need to ensure you'd qualify for both the $10k credit card AND the bank offering the balance transfer. Another neat trick I believe you can do (at least with some banks) is you can transfer the balance BEFORE even making a purchase. So your current credit card can go into a $10k credit while you look for the car.

Happy to be corrected on any of the above info, but I did very similar myself once but there was no 0% rate at the time, I just transferred from my 18% credit card to a 5% bank.

[BLUEYBA]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

All good, certainly did, numerous times infact.

Mate good stuff

[BLUEYBA]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Hey, seeing as the thread is titled decisions, decisions, i found myself facing a moral dilemma on Sunday.
Following on from the purchase of the lads new car, we had to move on his old wheels.
So to set the scene, we picked up his first car, a 97 VS Esteem, from an elderly lady in February this year.
She'd owned the car for 16yrs and had serviced it with Hamilton Holden like clockwork ever since, it had 183,000 genuine k's on it, Panther Mica, everything working and 5 months rego, even the roof lining was perfect.
The only let down was the body, it had a few scrapes around the bumper corners and a dent below the drivers door moulding.
She wanted $1300, we gave $1100.

Fast forward to last weekend and we have not spent 1 dollar on it except for a new fuel cap as he left it sitting on a bowser somewhere.
So after looking through Gumtree at what they are pulling, and only having 1 weeks rego left, i wacked it up Saturday night for $1100 and figured we'd be happy with $1k and he'd break even as he'd had 5 months of free rego.
Within minutes i had my first call and a promise to buy if i'd give them till the following morning at 10am so she could confirm things with her husband.
I agreed as it was fairly late saturday night and i wasnt showing it to anyone that late.
Anywho, at 6am Sunday morning i begin getting bombarded with messages about it. I explained that i couldnt do anything until 10am, soon enough i had a dozen names and numbers of people who wanted to be rung if it was still available, then they started offering overs to jump the queue.
Im getting offers up to $1400 on the spot to let it go, im like WTF, its a VS Commodore.

In the end the people who rang first bought it, didnt even haggle, i was still recieving calls during the test drive.

So since letting it go i've had people telling me i was mad for letting it go for $1100 when i could have had $1400. I get the point but it wouldnt have been right from my perspective.
What would you guys do.

I would have done the same thing. The way I look at it is I try and treat people the same way I would like to be treated. I know not everyone thinks like this but as long I feel as though I have done the right thing then I'm happy.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by lra

If you advertised it for $1100, and the buyer paid $1100, you got want you wanted, unless you are a real estate agent who thinks that gazumping is not immoral.
Gentleman's agreements are hard to find these days.

Yeah, you're spot on.

Its amazing though, some of the messages i recieved were unreal, you could feel the frustrated tones in some of them to the point where one clown got abusive because i wouldnt understand that he had the money burning a hole in his pocket and could be here in 5 minutes if only i'd agree.

All for a VS Commodore

[Junkyard-Dog]

On the topic of selling the VS for $1100 honestly I think the price was just fine. Last year I sold a mint 96 VS (Acclaim I think) for $1500 and I have had people tell me I'm crazy for selling it "so cheap" but I really think that is all they are worth. Let's not forget they are 20 years old now... and I only paid $1000 for it anyway.

I also notice that none of the people who told me it was worth $4k turned up to offer me the money either.