Driverless car insurance plan fund by taxpayers?

[Maka]

Hi guys, heres a interesting article from our friends at "The West Australian" news outlet -

"Taxpayers could be forced to pick up the insurance bill for people injured in autonomous cars made by some of the world’s biggest multinational companies under a plan by Federal bureaucrats."

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/car-a...ng-b881035114z

Some WA insurance industry bigwigs suggest its a backdoor taxpayer subsidy etc, any thoughts?

cheers, Maka

[Jastel]

The Government is asleep at the wheel as normal.
Uber has already cost the government billions and will cost them more as well.
While I agree the public should not be left out new laws and CTP categories need to be enacted yesterday for this coming menace.
The public also needs to know how it is programmed...will it swerve to miss a dog and kill you...unacceptable...will it swerve to miss 10 kids on a crosswalk and kill you...more acceptable (unless you are in the car).
Who is responsible when it is hacked, what if Telstra goes down and it cant communicate??

There will be steering wheels for a while yet.

[Ben73]

Nah. These car companies say autonomous cars are safer than human driven cars so let them put their money where their mouth is.

If they won't do that how about the owner insures it with an insurance company like we do with every other car. Insurance companies should have no issues with this since we are told autonomous cars crash less than humans.

[arronm]

I cant even be bothered reading it, but. The car will be registered and insured by the owner. SO>>>>>>

Additionally if it is driving itself and hurts someone the car company maybe liable. There will be so many safe guards crashes will be minimal.

[MITCHAY]

Why would autonomous cars be any different to what we have now? They would still have a registered owner whether someone was driving or not so is not insurance up on them?

[Jastel]

You should read the article...

They are talking about CTP (you or in this case the robo car are at fault and kill someone) not comprehensive (you ding another car)...it will cost us all more in higher CTP premiums if the companies doing this don't pay a fair share.

If you (the person) are not "driving" as such, how can you be liable?
If you are not liable then who is? The manufacturer, the software company, the computer chip maker, the programmer?

Also many of these companies will not be selling cars to the public as we are too dumb to maintain the hi tech vehicles and software, they have said as much, so they will be robo taxis really, you will not own it so you cant insure it.

[MITCHAY]

I really don't see how this is complicated. Whether there is no one, a robot or dildo driving the car it still has to registered to someone so ultimately there is liability because at least where I live CTP is part of rego.

[LTDHO]

Should be insured by the owner.

[Maka]

Heres a couple of good links on Autonomous cars & insurance -

https://venturebeat.com/2018/01/26/3...ance-industry/

https://hbr.org/2017/12/driverless-c...rers-can-adapt

https://www.the-digital-insurer.com/...uto-insurance/

Manufacturers of driverless vehicles will accept liability which is happening already, Volvo is one company of many who have already publically announced it.

cheers, Maka

[simon varley]

in Victoria they already do. TAC covers all road injuries.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Jastel

when Telstra goes down and it cant communicate??

Geeze that made me laugh. Had to fix that for you.

[Sabantien]

If I borrow your car, you, the owner, has paid the insurance, including the CTP.

Doesn't matter if you are the person operating it or not.

In an incident the at fault vehicle's insurance pays. Why would this need to be any different?

[Jastel]

You hope I have paid the insurance/rego...
If I haven't I am not at fault as YOU were driving the unregistered car.

There is no person operating it...or there may be multiple persons/entities found to be operating it depending on definitions and what systems used.

Uber, Facebook, Google, Volkswagen et al have all been so trustworthy so far with doing what is best for society and not their own bottom line...

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Jastel

You hope I have paid the insurance/rego...
If I haven't I am not at fault as YOU were driving the unregistered car.
.

Wouldn't surprise me if the govco require a system that would shut the car down if you don't pay. Like not paying your phone bill.

We're talking about gov taxes and you don't stuff with that.

[MITCHAY]

Originally Posted by Jastel

You hope I have paid the insurance/rego...
If I haven't I am not at fault as YOU were driving the unregistered car.

There is no person operating it...or there may be multiple persons/entities found to be operating it depending on definitions and what systems used.

Uber, Facebook, Google, Volkswagen et al have all been so trustworthy so far with doing what is best for society and not their own bottom line...

And how is that different to now?

[Jastel]

Read the second line...now someone is liable, in the future maybe nobody is, which was the base for the article we are discussing, or maybe many people are involved.

Uber has been scamming off the private car CTP pool for the last few years until recently when the govts finally made them their own class. The government is so far behind it would be funny if it wasn't serious.

[MITCHAY]

Originally Posted by Jastel

Read the second line...now someone is liable, in the future maybe nobody is, which was the base for the article we are discussing, or maybe many people are involved.

Uber has been scamming off the private car CTP pool for the last few years until recently when the govts finally made them their own class. The government is so far behind it would be funny if it wasn't serious.

They are liable whether they have paid the rego or not. Whether you will get the money is another thing entirely. Like I said no different to how it is now.

I understand what you're saying about the proposal and it's effective shifting of responsibility but why are the government or manufacturers not liable now when one shirks that responsibility?

Why does this suddenly become an issue because the cars are autonomous? **** me we are a dumb country.

[Jastel]

If you get hit by a self driving car tomorrow and end up in a wheelchair...who pays?

[wodahs]

Originally Posted by Jastel

If you get hit by a self driving car tomorrow and end up in a wheelchair...who pays?

I don't know about the state your in but here in western australia the rego covers injury to persons in the event of a car accident

What does WA Rego cover?
Compulsory third party (CTP) insurance is a minimum and compulsory level of cover in Australia. You automatically get CTP insurance in WA when you pay your car registration. CTP covers you against personal injury you might cause to another person in a car accident or incident.
Do I need CTP if I have comprehensive?
First off, all car owners need Compulsory Third Party (CTP) insurance – it's a legal requirement. CTP protects people injured by your car if you cause an accident and, provided your car is registered, you'll already have it. ... It includes accident damage, fire and theft and damage to other people's cars and property.

so If you get hit by a car today and end up in a wheelchair the CTP in the vehicles rego covers you and tomorrow I think self driving cars will still have rego so If you get hit by a self driving car tomorrow and end up in a wheelchair the same CTP in that vehicles rego will still cover you
and before you say well what if the autonomous vehicle isn't rego'd , well come on that's not lets hate on autonomous vehicles that's lets hate on stupid owners

[Maka]

For people who havent read the story yet (with thanks to The West Australian & author Daniel Mercer) -

"In a proposal that has bemused the WA Government, the National Transport Commission has suggested extending State-backed motor vehicle injury insurance to driverless cars to ensure victims were not left in limbo.

Under the NTC’s plan, State governments would have to pay out passengers of autonomous cars injured in crashes and seek to recover those costs from the manufacturers of the vehicles."

"But the NTC has drawn fire from the Insurance Commission of WA, which runs the State’s compulsory third-party motor vehicle insurance scheme.

According to ICWA, which opposes the NTC’s proposal, shifting liability for injuries caused by autonomous vehicle crashes would leave taxpayers on the hook for failures of private companies. It said this amounted to a subsidy for some of the world’s biggest companies, such as Tesla and Google."

cheers, Maka

[HI PSI]

What if you got hit by your own autonomous car??

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Maka

For people who havent read the story yet (with thanks to The West Australian & author Daniel Mercer) -

"In a proposal that has bemused the WA Government, the National Transport Commission has suggested extending State-backed motor vehicle injury insurance to driverless cars to ensure victims were not left in limbo.

Under the NTC’s plan, State governments would have to pay out passengers of autonomous cars injured in crashes and seek to recover those costs from the manufacturers of the vehicles."

"But the NTC has drawn fire from the Insurance Commission of WA, which runs the State’s compulsory third-party motor vehicle insurance scheme.

According to ICWA, which opposes the NTC’s proposal, shifting liability for injuries caused by autonomous vehicle crashes would leave taxpayers on the hook for failures of private companies. It said this amounted to a subsidy for some of the world’s biggest companies, such as Tesla and Google."

cheers, Maka

While i do agree with them, of course they are going to oppose it considering it would steal their business.