Round abouts

[peterr]

I have a thing about roundabouts no one knows who gives way to who ! Yesterday was a good example wife and i were turning right around the thing, as far as i know if you are the first car in the round about you have right of way, as i was a white gt falcon, newish not for long driving like that,drove through the roundabout. We missed by a coat of paint.My wife is not long out of hospital following two heart attacks, neither of us wish to spend another six weeks in one, if you wish to thats up to you but remeber we dont have a big hospital here.So or were driving through Bowral yesterday go read your road rules.Got your rego number also but wont post it.

[Nic85]

Give way to cars already on the roundabout. If the exit off the roundabout you wish to take is full of traffic, you cannot sit "on" the roundabout in traffic. Left hand lane in and out for first or second exit, right hand lane in and out for second or third exit. You cannot change lanes on a roundabout. You must always indicate when exiting a roundabout, regardless of if you're going straight through or not.

That's about it really. Glad to hear you and the wife are okay! I always drive as if everyone is out to get me and that everyone will always do the wrong thing.

[KIWI-1]

Which State are those rules for?

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Nic85

Give way to cars already on the roundabout. If the exit off the roundabout you wish to take is full of traffic, you cannot sit "on" the roundabout in traffic. Left hand lane in and out for first or second exit, right hand lane in and out for second or third exit. You cannot change lanes on a roundabout. You must always indicate when exiting a roundabout, regardless of if you're going straight through or not.

That's about it really. Glad to hear you and the wife are okay! I always drive as if everyone is out to get me and that everyone will always do the wrong thing.

Sounds about right (for NSW at least). Rarely actually followed however! The amount of cars I see flowing through a round about in quick procession then car number 7 stops hard because a car to their right is slowly approaching.....

Both younger and older drivers seem to not know the rules as well... or younger drivers being taught by older drivers who don't know the rules.

[rancidpunx]

[poppa smurf]

Hah! roundabouts would have to be one of the simplest forms of intersection and yet so many get it wrong

main problem is that folks dont want to give way or share the road with a fellow motorist in any way shape or form any where

[Nic85]

Originally Posted by KIWI-1

Which State are those rules for?

They are for QLD, although I would think they should be national. Common sense of course, too.

[KIWI-1]

National, YMBJ. You live in the State that used to allow wheels 25mm wider than placard when all the others were 26mm. Given that an inch is 25.4mm our wheels were illegal in Qld.

Almost the same as Vic - main difference is that in Vic you only need to indicate IF PRACTICABLE. Also most pedestrians do not realise that the rule to give way to pedestrians when exiting is abolished.
Vic overview posted below:

Giving way
When entering a roundabout, you must give way to any vehicle in the roundabout and any tram entering or approaching the roundabout. There is no requirement for vehicles to give way to pedestrians at roundabouts unless there are specific crossings provided.
Cyclists and animal riders
In a roundabout, cyclists and animal riders have the option of turning right from the left lane, but they must give way to drivers exiting the roundabout.
Turning left
If there are multiple lanes you must approach in the left lane and stay in that lane. You must indicate a left turn on your approach to the roundabout and keep the indicator on until you have left the roundabout.
Turning right
If there are multiple lanes you must approach the roundabout in the right lane and stay in that lane. You must indicate a right turn on your approach, and indicate left, if practicable, just before the exit you are turning into, keeping the indicator on until you have left the roundabout.
Going straight ahead
If there are multiple lanes, approach the roundabout in the left or right lane. Drive in the same lane through the roundabout. Do not signal on your approach to the roundabout, but if practicable, signal left as you exit.

[Nic85]

Yeah, I think the "If practicable" line leaves some room for people who may be changing gears, operating the steering wheel and trying to reach over with their wrong hand to indicate to exit, lol. It's evidently a requirement in QLD to indicate when exiting a roundabout.

[Jim Goose]

Originally Posted by Nic85

Yeah, I think the "If practicable" line leaves some room for people who may be changing gears, operating the steering wheel and trying to reach over with their wrong hand to indicate to exit, lol. It's evidently a requirement in QLD to indicate when exiting a roundabout.

its says "if practicable", its always been there.

The idea is that on a small roundabout say in a suburban intersection where the roundabout is very small, its not practicable to indicate when exiting because by the time you actually manage to indicate your exiting, you have already exited due to the very short distance.

On very large roundabouts wheere you have plenty of time to indicate your exiting, you must indicate. Otherwise traffic may actually think your still turning right and pull out in front of you.

You also "shouldnt" be changing gears while turning.....

[zilo]

Do you have to give way to the right?
Or is it simply whoever is in first?

What if you and someone on your right are both sitting still cause you both had to give way to someone else?

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Ugg

Do you have to give way to the right?
Or is it simply whoever is in first?

What if you and someone on your right are both sitting still cause you both had to give way to someone else?

No give way to the right rule any more. It is 'Give way to cars already in the round about'.

If you are approaching a round about and to the right there is also an approaching car that is 1 or 2 car lengths further back than you it will be you who has right or way as you will be in the round about first.

Of course, if that car is doing a high speed and has no intention of stopping you're best to let them through first.

[66GT]

Close to home there are several small round abouts. It seems that the people passing through the area on the more major road believe that they have right of way, & fly into & through. Because of high fences etc there is limited vision of any possible on comming traffic from all directions - yet they simply refuse to slow down just in case. I believe some push the "give way to traffic already on the round about" rule by speeding up, or not slowing down. They therefore would consider themselves already on the round about in the event of an accident. I just stop & wait, but it still gets to you.

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by Ugg

Do you have to give way to the right?
Or is it simply whoever is in first?

What if you and someone on your right are both sitting still cause you both had to give way to someone else?

Under the Australian Road Rules, at a roundabout...
"Give way means the driver must slow down, and stop if necessary to avoid a collision."
...but State and Territories can (and do) vary the definition.

[mike_nofx]

Funny you should mention the White GT, About a month ago at the round-a-bout at the bottom of Mount Ousley off ramp to North Wollongong, I was almost run into by a White GT. Almost exactly in the way you describe. I was well and truly on the round-a-bout, the GT was approaching as a guess 80kmh+. With the speed limit being 60, and with most considerate drivers slowing down before entering, he approached much quicker than I expected.

I considered sending in my dash cam footage to a police station, but felt nothing would be likely to happen anyway. There was no accident, I cant prove his speed, and i didnt check but most likely couldnt read a licence plate at the angle we both entered.

[mike_nofx]

Also worth noting about round-a-bouts is that at least 50% of people still believe the law is "give way to your right" OR dont care what the law is and do that anyway.

So when approaching a round-a-bout, expect that the driver approaching from your right has a 1 in 2 chance of wanting to slow down, even if technically you are doing the right thing.

So only enter if it looks safe, and dont expect the guy on your right to slow down. I'd rather let some knob-jockey take my spot than be T-boned.

[Moo Man]

With the speed that many drivers approach roundabouts I find that the "safe gap" rule is for all intents and purposes the same as giving way to the right.

My pet hate is people travelling in the opposite direction to you who are going straight through the roundabout but indicate right as they approach (usually the same people that don't bother to indicate as they exit the roundabout).

FFS why would you use your right indicator if you're going straight ahead. Cars that go straight through from the opposite direction usually "block" traffic from entering from your right creating the safe gap that you need to enter the roundabout but no, they decide to indicate right as they approach and you have to sit there waiting for them to turn across in front of you. By the time you realise they are actually going straight ahead you've got another car approaching from your right at full speed.

My advice for roundabouts, look at the direction the wheels are pointed. They give a much better signal of the direction that the car will be travelling in than the goose operating the indicator stalk.

[4stanger]

Originally Posted by Nic85

They are for QLD, although I would think they should be national. Common sense of course, too.

Accident happened to my wife's Outlander in Rockhampton, about 12 months ago with an older victorian couple (we're in our 40's) in a Camry hire car.
Wife was travelling home from work, she was in the left approaching the roundabout, stayed in the left through the roundabout to exit the second exit, there is arrows painted on the the road approaching the roundabout showing you can do this, the victorian couple were in the right lane but half way through the roundabout decided to change lanes to take the second exit in the left lane.
My wife had the feeling that they were under the impression that they did nothing wrong, which makes me wonder what are the Victorian rules are for roundabouts.
Had a little trouble descibing this over the phone to the insurance company but when I drew a diagram the insurance took the claim up against the hire car insurance, Car is fixed, I didn't pay a cent, the last I heard about this 6 months ago, was that the hire car insurance company was taking this to court.
Another thing the my insurance company mentioned during the initial claim, was that most accidents on roundabouts usually go 50-50, meaning pay for your own damage.

[mike_nofx]

Originally Posted by Arnaldo

Another thing the my insurance company mentioned during the initial claim, was that most accidents on roundabouts usually go 50-50, meaning pay for your own damage.

Of course, insurance companies would love that. They still need to pay out the total cost of repairs for both cars (provided you both are comprehensively insured) but collect 2 lots of excesses and raise both your premiums for losing NCB.

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by Nic85

Give way to cars already on the roundabout. If the exit off the roundabout you wish to take is full of traffic, you cannot sit "on" the roundabout in traffic. Left hand lane in and out for first or second exit, right hand lane in and out for second or third exit. You cannot change lanes on a roundabout. You must always indicate when exiting a roundabout, regardless of if you're going straight through or not.

That's about it really. Glad to hear you and the wife are okay! I always drive as if everyone is out to get me and that everyone will always do the wrong thing.

EXACTLY. Now tell me why police...if they care about safe driving...never post themselves near roundabouts. besides the officer in stitches all day long at some of the DUMB ar$@#$ things people do...youd think it a no brainer. Id put it a 90% ratio as to how often im on a round about and someone breaks the road rules.

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by Arnaldo

My wife had the feeling that they were under the impression that they did nothing wrong, which makes me wonder what are the Victorian rules are for roundabouts.

You must enter and exit using the same lane in Vic. (See my post #8)

[gtxb67]

roundabouts are simple
if the car on the right is close enough to hit you when you enter - give way to it
while driving through the roundabout it is illegal to actually drive into anybody else, which in effect means you are giving way to those already on the roundabout

in short, if it is safe - enter
if it is unsafe - do not enter

[cobramania]

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

On very large roundabouts where you have plenty of time to indicate your exiting, you must indicate. Otherwise traffic may actually think your still turning right and pull out in front of you.

If you don't indicate & traffic thinks you are still turning right, why the hell would they pull out in front of you? Forget the fact those entering have to give way to you already on the roundabout, why would you pull out in front of someone turning right in front of you? Is this something you often do?

Maybe forget indicating at all would be a better option to the rule, & make entering drivers give-way to all already on the roundabout & wait till it's truly safe to enter (knowing for certain when/if someones not going to turn in front of you). Technically the rules state, "you shouldn't enter the roundabout unless it's safe to do so", without hitting or near miss with someone else, (same as any intersection).
Indicating is really only a courtesy gesture, but the rules seem to have recently had more importance on the actual indicating your intentions as being absolute, rather than holding back, surveying the situation & proceeding when absolutely certain it's safe to do so.

You also "shouldnt" be changing gears while turning.....

You shouldn't be changing gears while turning, but in a roundabout scenario & some other general intersection situations, when towing heavy loads or driving a vehicle with short gears, it's often necessary to change gears after coming to a stop & proceeding through the intersection/roundabout.

Technically if you're driving correctly with your hands at quarter to three positions, neither hand will be anywhere near the indicator stick whilst turning through a roundabout, as they'll be in the roughly six 'o clock positions (top & bottom of the wheel). Your hands shouldn't move on the wheel until your arms are about to cross. i.e. performing a tight turn where you have to turn the wheel more than 3/4 of a turn. Therefore under the rules it's impracticable to indicate when on a roundabout. To be in complete control of your vehicle you should have 2 hands on the wheel at all times, the indicator & wiper stick are positioned where they are, so you don't have to remove one hand to operate them, an extended finger when your hands are correctly placed on the wheel can turn them on & off. Having one hand off the wheel while changing gears or operating any other feature (a/c, vents, radio, etc.), if anything was to happen & they wanted to press the issue, you could be charged for not having complete control of the vehicle, another reason why cruse control & radio/bluetooth controls are now on the steering wheel, within easy finger reach only access.

[Itsme]

Can some one actually show a copy of the road rules book where it states you must indicate when exiting when you travel through a round about when not turning left or right......

PS: I never seen this rule in the Victorian rule book.

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by trublu

Can some one actually show a copy of the road rules book where it states you must indicate when exiting when you travel through a round about when not turning left or right......

there has been a link before - you don't actually travel through a roundabout. you enter it, drive around it to the point you want to exit and then exit it

the rule is seldom (if at all) enforced, but it is there and to my knowledge always has been

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by gtxb67

there has been a link before - you don't actually travel through a roundabout. you enter it, drive around it to the point you want to exit and then exit it

the rule is seldom (if at all) enforced, but it is there and to my knowledge always has been

As I said show me the rule in the book....

[KIWI-1]

Originally Posted by trublu

As I said show me the rule in the book....

See my post #8, it is the overview from the Vicroads site.

With respect to the rule book as you called it, in Vic the Australian Road Rules 1999, and the Road Safety Act 1986 and the Road Safety Regulations 2009 cover most things.

[cobramania]

Originally Posted by trublu

As I said show me the rule in the book....

I'm in NSW & have never been to the Vic roads web site before, but it was quite easy to find. As KIWI-1 states, it is correct, but since you wanted a link to prove it to you here it is. http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/Home/...oundabouts.htm

[Itsme]

Thanks to cobramania, Kiwi-1 & gtxb67 for clarification.
I checked the SA,Vic & NSW road rule sites.

This one from NSW was a good example if you pass through a small round about.

Indicating

When approaching a roundabout, you must give sufficent warning to other road users of your intention to turn left or right by indicating as you approach the roundabout.
When exiting a roundabout, whether you are turning left, right or even going straight ahead, you must always indicate a left turn just before you exit, unless it is not practical to do so.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by KIWI-1

Cyclists and animal riders
In a roundabout, cyclists and animal riders have the option of turning right from the left lane, but they must give way to drivers exiting the roundabout.
Turning left

I don't know about you guys, but I wouldn't be riding a horse on the road anyway, let alone try take it through a roundabout.

As everyone pointed out it is give way to all vehicles in the roundabout, not "give way to your right", but everyone gives way to their right anyway so its easier just to play nicely with everyone else and do the same, because otherwise it will end in tears one day.

My license examiner had a go at me for "not giving way to my right" during my license test, I drove through because the people on my right stopped to give way to their right, they were blocked off by people going straight, so I went and my license examiner spat chips big time about it. Tells me I'm the worst driver she has ever tested, then gives me my license anyway? You're supposed to walk on the grass, not smoke it.