Any Ford Mondeo LX 2.3 petrol owners in Toowoomba?

[WagonWheel]

I'm interested in buying a 2010-2011 Ford Mondeo LX MC 2.3 Auto wagon but it's almost 200 kms away and there aren't any LX 2.3 Mondeos for sale in Toowoomba to test drive. Just wondering if there are any LX 2.3 Mondeo owners in Toowoomba who could let me test drive their car (sedan, hatch or wagon). Not looking at the diesel version, just the petrol version. Thanks

[Omega-T]

I can't help you with the test-drive - I'm more like 2000km from Toowoomba - but I do have the 2.3L MC LX wagon that I bought six months or so ago. It's obviously no replacement for a test-drive, but if there's anything you want to know about how they are to drive or live with, I'm happy to try and answer any questions.

[WagonWheel]

Thanks, Omega-T

From what I've been able to glean from the Mondeo forum, the 2.3 LX uses a Mazda L3 motor which I guess is similar to that used in Mazda 6 vehicles prior to 2008 or thereabouts. I know it's not anyway near as punchy as the diesel, but would you say it would be similar to say a pre-2000 2.2 litre Toyota Camry or similar? If so, that would be suitable for my needs.

I need a wagon with a good cargo area, one with a length of at least 1910 mm when the rear seats are folded down, so if you have a measuring tape, that info would really help me.

Also, how is the air conditioning? I believe some Mondeo owners have had to have theirs regassed to make them colder.

And lastly how do you find parking the wagon in car parks? Is the turning circle okay?

[Omega-T]

No problem, I remember trying to look everywhere for information before I took one for a test-drive.

Engine: The Mondeo will be perfectly fine if you're comparing it to a 2.2L Camry. I haven't driven anything similar to the Camry, but all of the performance numbers favour the 2.3L Mondeo, which feels like a decent 4 cylinder aspirated petrol to drive. Plus the extra ratios in the six-speed auto do help the engine out in everyday driving. I used to drive a 4.0L EF Falcon day-to-day - so I took a noticeable drop in power - but the 2.3L Mondeo is good enough that I only actually miss the 4.0L on the occasional country road overtake. So I'd say you'll be just fine with the 2.3L petrol.

Just as an aside, the 2.3L is designed for 95 octane. You won't notice any make-or-break drops in performance if it's running on 91 octane, but my wagon at least seems happier on higher-octane fuel.

Cargo: The rear seats can be folded in two ways - you can just fold the rear seats down, or you can lift the cushions first to fold the rear seats flat. Folded flat gets you a little over 1700mm, so you'd probably need to leave the cushions down and fold the seats non-flat. Doing that gets you to the rear of the front row seats. In my seating position, that's about 1950mm if you need it for something thin. My seat is tilted back though, so the length available drops if you need it for something more than say 50-100mm thick. It's close enough that you would probably have to check one in person to see what it's like in your seating position and for what you need to carry.

Air-con: This summer will be my first with the Mondeo, so I don't have any experience of it above low 30's outside, which it dealt with just fine. The feeling I get from it is that it will be reasonable as things warm up, but isn't anything special.

Parking: Parking hasn't been a problem for me. Mostly because it's a bit shorter than my old EF wagon, so it feels pretty easy by comparison. I should note that the doors are fairly thick, which might be noticeable in tighter spots. The turning circle isn't something I've paid much attention to - it hasn't been noticeably better or worse than I expect from a largish wagon.

[Binny]

My cousin had a 2.3 for 5 years and loved it. Its one of the reasons I bought my TDCi or I would not even thought of a Mondeo as an option.
I think a 2.4 Camry would be a more appropriate yardstick. It will be similar to that.

Its a bit like my Wife's 1.6 beetle in that the 0-100 times are underwhelming but it's quite tractable and unstressed driving around normally so you don't need to rev it out to get it moving. Using 95 will give you more torque and potentially better economy as the ECU can advance the timing more at low revs. If you use 91 the knock sensors can be retarding the timing to stop it pinging.

Aircon is OK and does the job but not as good as any of the Toyotas I've had. If the car has been parked in the sun it will take a while to be effective. I always use the global windows down in summer when I am approaching the carpark and leave them down initially while driving to get all the hot air out until the aircon is pumping out cold air.

The turning circle is no different to other large FWDs like camries. The driving experience on the other hand is so much better.

[WagonWheel]

Originally Posted by Omega-T

Plus the extra ratios in the six-speed auto do help the engine out in everyday driving. I used to drive a 4.0L EF Falcon day-to-day - so I took a noticeable drop in power - but the 2.3L Mondeo is good enough that I only actually miss the 4.0L on the occasional country road overtake. So I'd say you'll be just fine with the 2.3L petrol.

Thanks, that sounds positive. I'll be dropping down from a 3.6L, but that's okay as I used to drive 4 cyl autos all the time.

Originally Posted by Omega-T

Just as an aside, the 2.3L is designed for 95 octane. You won't notice any make-or-break drops in performance if it's running on 91 octane, but my wagon at least seems happier on higher-octane fuel.

Good to know. Thanks. I'll use 95.

Originally Posted by Omega-T

Cargo: The rear seats can be folded in two ways - you can just fold the rear seats down, or you can lift the cushions first to fold the rear seats flat. Folded flat gets you a little over 1700mm, so you'd probably need to leave the cushions down and fold the seats non-flat. Doing that gets you to the rear of the front row seats. In my seating position, that's about 1950mm if you need it for something thin. My seat is tilted back though, so the length available drops if you need it for something more than say 50-100mm thick. It's close enough that you would probably have to check one in person to see what it's like in your seating position and for what you need to carry.

That's brilliant to know. Yes I'll be using them folded down and leaving the cushions down to get the extra length.

Also thanks for your thoughts on a/c and parking. Really appreciate your help.

[WagonWheel]

Originally Posted by Binny

My cousin had a 2.3 for 5 years and loved it. Its one of the reasons I bought my TDCi or I would not even thought of a Mondeo as an option.
I think a 2.4 Camry would be a more appropriate yardstick. It will be similar to that.

Ah, yes, that sounds a bit closer - 2011 Camry Altise 2.4 Max. Power 117kW @ 5700rpm and Mondeo LX Max Power 118kW @ 6500rpm. That would be fine for my needs.

Originally Posted by Binny

Its a bit like my Wife's 1.6 beetle in that the 0-100 times are underwhelming but it's quite tractable and unstressed driving around normally so you don't need to rev it out to get it moving. Using 95 will give you more torque and potentially better economy as the ECU can advance the timing more at low revs. If you use 91 the knock sensors can be retarding the timing to stop it pinging.

Thanks for that. Yes, 95 it will be.

Originally Posted by Binny

Aircon is OK and does the job but not as good as any of the Toyotas I've had. If the car has been parked in the sun it will take a while to be effective. I always use the global windows down in summer when I am approaching the carpark and leave them down initially while driving to get all the hot air out until the aircon is pumping out cold air.

Yep, agree, we use a screen as well, which also helps. Wife wanted dual-zone air conditioning, but it's either a Mondeo without or a Mazda 6 with and the price difference is in the thousands and difficult to justify.

Originally Posted by Binny

The turning circle is no different to other large FWDs like camries. The driving experience on the other hand is so much better.

Thanks for that.

[sailaway]

Originally Posted by WagonWheel

I'm interested in buying a 2010-2011 Ford Mondeo LX MC Not looking at the diesel version, just the petrol version. Thanks

Seriously consider a Diesel Mondeo.

Having just returned from a 4 thousand klm trip Vic to QLD return I cannot speak highly enough of this car. (Hatch not wagon)

Plenty of power and got over a 1,200klms per tank of diesel.

Not too bad for a 2010 car with over 230K on the clock.

Mate in Brisbane is considering a Mondeo diesel wagon after driving mine. Plenty around Brissie if you do a search.

Good Luck

[whitelion65]

That 2.3 engine almost cost me the chance of getting a Mondeo.
The local dealer didn't have the diesel demo in, and gave us a drive of the 2.3LX. The Mrs was FAR from impressed. She was sold on the Titanium diesel a few days later.

The Mondeo wagon does have one of the worst turning circles I have come across, however. Not bad enough to spoil a great car, 'though!

[WagonWheel]

Originally Posted by whitelion65

That 2.3 engine almost cost me the chance of getting a Mondeo.
The local dealer didn't have the diesel demo in, and gave us a drive of the 2.3LX. The Mrs was FAR from impressed. She was sold on the Titanium diesel a few days later.

The Mondeo wagon does have one of the worst turning circles I have come across, however. Not bad enough to spoil a great car, 'though!

Thanks for your input. I appreciate your honesty. I've already done a lot of research on the diesel version, so in this thread, I'm only looking at the LX 2.3 petrol version.

[WagonWheel]

Originally Posted by sailaway

Seriously consider a Diesel Mondeo.

Having just returned from a 4 thousand klm trip Vic to QLD return I cannot speak highly enough of this car. (Hatch not wagon)

Plenty of power and got over a 1,200klms per tank of diesel.

Not too bad for a 2010 car with over 230K on the clock.

Mate in Brisbane is considering a Mondeo diesel wagon after driving mine. Plenty around Brissie if you do a search.

Good Luck

Thanks for your input. 99.9% of my driving involves short trips and I've already researched the diesel version which I know is a great car. In this thread, I'd prefer to stay on the LX 2.3 topic.

[sailaway]

Originally Posted by WagonWheel

Thanks for your input. 99.9% of my driving involves short trips and I've already researched the diesel version which I know is a greathttp://www.fordforums.com.au/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=5785378# car. In this thread, I'd prefer to stay on the LX 2.3 topic.

No problem but the diesel is a great choice whether short or long drives are the norm.

Out of curiosity why do you choose the petrol over the diesel?

[WagonWheel]

Originally Posted by sailaway

No problem but the diesel is a great choice whether short or long drives are the norm.

Out of curiosity why do you choose the petrol over the diesel?

Personal reasons, which I'd prefer not to go into. I too would recommend most people consider the diesel version. Although the petrol version has less power and torque and isn't as economical, it's not a bad car when compared to other cars using the same fuel with similar power, torque and consumption. Comparing apples with oranges is fruitless. I prefer to compare apples against apples and oranges against oranges.

[NZ XR6]

I had a petrol MA for 2 years. They go fine if you put the auto in Sport and give it a good poke.

Similar performance to a 2.4 Camry of the same era, but a much nicer car to drive.



Sent from somewhere using Tapatalk

[WagonWheel]

Originally Posted by NZ XR6

I had a petrol MA for 2 years. They go fine if you put the auto in Sport and give it a good poke.

Similar performance to a 2.4 Camry of the same era, but a much nicer car to drive.



Sent from somewhere using Tapatalk

Thanks, NZ XR6. So how does sport mode work and when do you activate it? I've pretty much always owned autos except for a short time in a manual 1980 Holden Gemini many years ago. I had a Toyota Corona auto in the 80s with a turbo button and a '93 Holden Apollo auto with overdrive. Is this the sort of thing sport mode does e.g., for overtaking etc.

[NZ XR6]

It's like the later Falcons. You pull the lever towards you from D. This also gives access to manual mode.

In Sport mode, the upshifts and downshifts occur at higher revs. Also, the shifts are quicker. For example, if you accelerate from say 80 hm/h it will change down to 4th, whereas in normal mode it would stay in 5th. Very good for accelerating out of corners.

Sent from somewhere using Tapatalk

[WagonWheel]

Originally Posted by NZ XR6

It's like the later Falcons. You pull the lever towards you from D. This also gives you access to manual mode.

In Sport mode, the upshifts and downshifts occur at higher revs. Also, the shifts are quicker.

Sent from somewhere using Tapatalk

Thanks for that. I'll have to try it when I get to test drive one.

[Omega-T]

If you're new to this style of gearbox control, there's a couple of things worth mentioning. Especially since the Mondeo's owner manual doesn't seem to cover this very well.

The first is how they switch modes. Having the selector in Drive means standard automatic operation. From there, moving the selector sideways to the Sport position gives you "Sport" mode - still fully automatic operation, but the more aggressive shifting behaviour that NZ XR6 described. If in Sport mode you push forward or backwards to command a shift, you enter "Manual" mode - the selector is still in the Sport position, but you are now in charge of shifting and the car will not shift unless you tell it to (with a couple of exceptions). To resume automatic operation, move the selector back to Drive. From there you can re-enter Sport mode by moving the selector to the Sport position again.

The other thing worth mentioning is that in manual mode, there is a pretty noticeable delay between asking it to shift and it actually happening. It's not a big deal if you want to downshift for some engine braking downhill, but it can catch you out under hard acceleration.

[WagonWheel]

Originally Posted by Omega-T

If you're new to this style of gearbox control, there's a couple of things worth mentioning. Especially since the Mondeo's owner manual doesn't seem to cover this very well.

The first is how they switch modes. Having the selector in Drive means standard automatic operation. From there, moving the selector sideways to the Sport position gives you "Sport" mode - still fully automatic operation, but the more aggressive shifting behaviour that NZ XR6 described. If in Sport mode you push forward or backwards to command a shift, you enter "Manual" mode - the selector is still in the Sport position, but you are now in charge of shifting and the car will not shift unless you tell it to (with a couple of exceptions). To resume automatic operation, move the selector back to Drive. From there you can re-enter Sport mode by moving the selector to the Sport position again.

The other thing worth mentioning is that in manual mode, there is a pretty noticeable delay between asking it to shift and it actually happening. It's not a big deal if you want to downshift for some engine braking downhill, but it can catch you out under hard acceleration.

Hey, that's great to know. I don't really want to be suddenly in manual mode on a freeway and be distracted, so for me it would be from D to Sport and back again until I got used to the car. Thanks for explaining that 'before' I test drive.

[cobrin]

My thoughts on the trans:

D - 98% of the time for daily driving. The typical set and forget deal.

Sport - 1% times you need higher rpm like overtaking or towing. Sharpens up shift times, TC lockup I think. It still upshifts and downshifts for you.

Manual - 1% times when in the twisty stuff - where you're better off holding a gear than constantly upshifting and downshifting as the condition changes so much. You change it yourself. Though if you're in 4th say and you roll to a stop it'll change down to 1st, but start to take off again and it won't upshift till you manually do it. That's caught me out twice or thrice in the past lol. Good way to blow out the cobwebs and stretch it's legs.

The forgotten High-Idle test I'll call it....you know the legitimate test ;)

[NZ XR6]

Originally Posted by Omega-T

If you're new to this style of gearbox control, there's a couple of things worth mentioning. Especially since the Mondeo's owner manual doesn't seem to cover this very well.

The first is how they switch modes. Having the selector in Drive means standard automatic operation. From there, moving the selector sideways to the Sport position gives you "Sport" mode - still fully automatic operation, but the more aggressive shifting behaviour that NZ XR6 described. If in Sport mode you push forward or backwards to command a shift, you enter "Manual" mode - the selector is still in the Sport position, but you are now in charge of shifting and the car will not shift unless you tell it to (with a couple of exceptions). To resume automatic operation, move the selector back to Drive. From there you can re-enter Sport mode by moving the selector to the Sport position again.

The other thing worth mentioning is that in manual mode, there is a pretty noticeable delay between asking it to shift and it actually happening. It's not a big deal if you want to downshift for some engine braking downhill, but it can catch you out under hard acceleration.

Thanks for clarifying that. I posted with my smartphone, so kept it brief.

The only delay I've ever noticed is downshifts with the throttle closed. It seems quick to me when accelerating - just flick the lever and straight into the next gear.

NZ tends to be a bit hillier than Oz. I find the main advantage of manual mode is that it stops the auto from changing down when braking into a downhill corner.

[whitelion65]

Manual mode a must for roundabouts!

[rondeo]

I normally stay in auto on roundabouts. Sometimes I think the transmission fluid level sloshes and causes some harsh shifts, couldn't do better myself in a manual transmission probably. Only time I used M was coming down a mountain (lake Catani). I seem to remember reading something about gear changes behin inhibited when the steering angle is greater than a set amount, will try to find it. Anyway, more info I remember reading lol:


When driving with normal throttle application, the TCM uses a pre-set shifting program, optimized to shift for economic driving. The shifting program adapts automatically to different driving conditions, e.g., driving on a grade with a trailer or driving at high altitude. Also, the transmission's oil pressure is adapted to give smooth engagement of gears.

The TCM monitors every shift to give consequent and smooth shifts under all driving conditions. This is done by the TCM either lowering or increasing the hydraulic system pressure that is used during actual shifting. The changed pressure levels are stored in the control module's memory when the vehicle is turned off, and are retrieved when the vehicle is started. This gives the transmission better shifting comfort and life. Before the components become too worn, an adaptation can also be used to compensate for wear of components in the transmission.

Powershift uses 4 different adaptations:

· Gear adaptation. Condition, gear engaged and engine's static torque within ±30 Nm.
· Adaptation of clutch application pressure. Condition, no gear engaged, Even or Odd, as well as the clutch not in a torque transfer mode (torque control mode).
· Adaptation of clutch preparation pressure. Condition, clutch pressure not above application
pressure.
· Adaptation of clutch torque. Condition, temperature of hydraulic oil (value from sensor in
oil sump) and clutch surface within specified interval, clutch in torque control mode and
clutch torque within specified interval.

The TCM can change the gearshift pattern slightly when driving uphill. This is to avoid close gearshifts.

When the driver stops and the vehicle is stationary, e.g., at a red light the TCM disengages the clutches, which means that the transmission's forward drive is reduced, as well as the engine load.This reduces both fuel consumption and vibrations. When the driver releases the brake, the
clutch torque increases on the clutch for which the gear is engaged, and drive increases. The following conditions must be met in order for the neutral function to activate:

· gear lever in D or R.
· throttle position 0%
· brake pedal pressed down.
· speed 0 km/h.

When driving for a long time with high load, e.g., slow driving on steep grades or with a trailer, the transmission and clutch work hard, which leads to increasing temperature in the transmission oil and clutch. A function called Hot mode is used to prevent damage to the transmission due to too
high temperature in the oil and in the clutch. The function is controlled by the TCM that, through different steps, tries to prevent the temperature
from becoming too high:
· The flow in the transmission increases by increased idle rpm for better cooling. Gearshifts are made harsher to reduce heat generation in the transmission.
· A message is sent to the Driver information module (DIM) to brake to relieve the clutches.
· The clutch starts to oscillate to warn the driver before the clutches open.
· The clutches open.

ON SOME VARIANTS:

When the accelerator pedal is pressed down past a certain point, the Kickdown function is activated.
This means that downshifting takes place to get faster acceleration.
Quick step makes the gearshifting function sportier when the driver is more aggressive on the pedal.
Lower gears are used for better acceleration.
Fast Off is used to reduce the number of shifts due to heavy traffic in, e.g., city traffic.
The function is activated at fast releases of the accelerator pedal. Even the vehicle's speed, brake pedal, and curve detection affect its function. By keeping a lower gear than normal, unnecessary shifts are avoided. For aborted passing, a lower gear is maintained to be able to take the initiative for future passing.

When the gear selector is moved to the Geartronic-position (M) The TCM decides if shifting can be performed and the DIM will
indicate the current gear. If shifting is allowed, the different solenoids are activated according to the specific pattern for each gear.

However, in certain situations the TCM will take over responsibility for determining shifting. The following applies:

· If the maximum engine rpm should be exceeded when downshifting, then the TCM will prevent a downshift.
· Start from a standstill can take place in 1st or 2nd gear in Geartronic-mode. 3rd gear can be
selected at speeds above25 km/h, 4th gear at speeds above 40 km/h, 5th gear at speeds above
50 km/h, as well as 6th gear at speeds above 60 km/h.
· Change between automatic and manual can be performed in both directions under all driving conditions.
· Automatic upshifting takes place at maximum rpm and at kickdown.
· Automatic downshifts take place in all gears when driving slower than a certain speed and at kickdown. Example: 2nd gear is selected. Automatic downshifting takes place from 2nd gear
to 1st at 2 km/h if the speed before that has been above 20 km/h. Otherwise 2nd gear remains. E.g., situations may arise where 3rd gear still is engaged even when the vehicle has been stopped.
· After automatic downshifting, manual upshifting is required except when kickdown is used
and the pedal position remains in kickdown position.
· Allowed rpms for manual downshifts match those for kickdown upshifts, that is, maximum
engine rpm.
· If the transmission's temperature should become too high, the TCM assumes the decisions about gearshifting.

[Mondaveo]

Love the detailed post about Powershift rondeo, but if WagonWheel is only interested in the 2.3l petrol won't that have the Aisin conventional auto?

[rondeo]

Originally Posted by Mondaveo

Love the detailed post about Powershift rondeo, but if WagonWheel is only interested in the 2.3l petrol won't that have the Aisin conventional auto?

Well. I confess I didn't notice. Still, as you say, interesting I guess.
Ooops.

[Binny]

Agreed. Interesting stuff. You should start a new thread titled Powershift info or something mate and put it in there.