Speeding fine

[GT 276]

Can you contest a speeding fine when there is two cars in the photo!?
There would be not even a car length apart..

[Ben73]

Depends whether your the car in front or not. Could get a fine for tailgating?

[flooded one]

yes you can but it might be costly thou???

[GT 276]

1st car in middle land and 2nd car in outside lane with the bonnet in line of the 1st cars rear tyres

[flappist]

Talk to a solicitor.

[BHDOGS]

i was photographed speeding by a camera car on side of the road in adelaide at the same time as another car was next to me i think i was abit infront like rear of my car next to his rear door and i never received anything of it. could of just been testing the camera or maybe it had something to do with the two cars in the pic not sure.

[Matty4]

I would.
All you have to argue is reasonable doubt.
Request proof that it was your vehicle speeding and that the other vehicle was not speeding. They can't prove that beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law.

If it's only your numberplate visible then they have probably taken a gamble on sending it out hoping you'll just pay it without question.

[Ducati888]

They will maintain that their cameras are smart enought to distinguish between lanes and cars. Was it a mobile camera or a fixed camera? The fixed ones have sensors in the road so it's more plausible that they can detect which lane of the road set off the camera.

To answer your question directly though - yes you can contest anything you like in court. That is your right. Costs if awarded against you in a magistrates court would be the fine itself (and points), court costs of just under $50, and the cost of the lawyer you use.

[ChRiDDa]

depends... how far were you over? if your 10k or under, and havent had any speeding tickets within the past 2 years, write a letter and take your chances....
speeding and drink driving are VERY hotly contested matters in the court system these days... expert witnesses etc will be called and if you lose, the costs that are awarded against you could easily run into the thousands...
have to ask yourself, is it really worth it?

[drew1491]

What state are you in? In WA we have new laser speed cameras that can measure the speed of cars in each lane in each direction, if it was by one of those new cameras you may was well just pay it cos you wont get out of it.

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by flappist

Talk to a solicitor.

this - do you honestly know that you were not speeding
as far as i am aware, they can distinguish speeds from different cars over multiple lanes - they certainly claim that and probably will in court as well if you are not well represented

[GT 276]

Yeah in WA .. I usually know when I get flashed etc, this just came as a surprise and I really don't remember speeding through there...sound as if it'll be more hassle and will just have to "cop" it ;) lol

[jaydee]

The new speed cameras can do up to 3 lanes at the same time and differentiate which ones are speeding.
The old ones couldn't and would self cancel the image, so I'd say you could be in trouble if they sent the fine out to you.

[FGX-351]

I'm thinking of the old saying "do it once, do it righ!"

+1 with talking to a solicitor.

[05_ENFORCER]

I heard a rumour that there's a new one on the Loftus street overpass commissioned yesterday

80-100 klm zone

.

[drew1491]

Originally Posted by 05_ENFORCER

I heard a rumour that there's a new one on the Loftus street overpass commissioned yesterday

80-100 klm zone

.

wouldnt be active yet cos its on on this site, unless it hasnt been updated yet but i doubt that

http://www.police.wa.gov.au/Traffic/...5/Default.aspx

[The G6ET Spot]

Originally Posted by SixTApeal

Yeah in WA .. I usually know when I get flashed etc, this just came as a surprise and I really don't remember speeding through there...sound as if it'll be more hassle and will just have to "cop" it ;) lol

And that is what they hope will happen when cases like this arise.

From my understanding, if there are 2 cars in a photo the onus is on the police to prove which car is actually the one speeding. IMO for the expense of what court costs are it would be worth the punt to find out and make them prove that it was you speeding.

[05_ENFORCER]

Originally Posted by drew1491

wouldnt be active yet cos its on on this site, unless it hasnt been updated yet but i doubt that

http://www.police.wa.gov.au/Traffic/...5/Default.aspx

Let me give you a tip, and that is all this is, it is active, it is just not reporting infringements as yet


.

[GT 276]

Originally Posted by 05_ENFORCER

I heard a rumour that there's a new one on the Loftus street overpass commissioned yesterday

80-100 klm zone

.

Funny you say that it was fway near loftus street!!!

[Shonky.]

Originally Posted by drew1491

wouldnt be active yet cos its on on this site, unless it hasnt been updated yet but i doubt that

http://www.police.wa.gov.au/Traffic/...5/Default.aspx

wow

we don't have anything like this in QLD do we?

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by The G6ET Spot

And that is what they hope will happen when cases like this arise.

From my understanding, if there are 2 cars in a photo the onus is on the police to prove which car is actually the one speeding. IMO for the expense of what court costs are it would be worth the punt to find out and make them prove that it was you speeding.

Of course you can't...here in Queensland anyway they proudly told the media some years back that they would no longer be throwing out perfectly good speed camera pictures that had more than one car in frame, as they had been doing for years...because they "had figured out how the cameras work when multiple cars are in view" and now knew which car was speeding...in a static photo...of several cars at once...

My son got busted a year ago on the main road into Rockhampton where it goes from 60 to 70 (if you know the town, you'll know where I mean, near the Tourist Info building where they are always set up), and he was in the closest lane, behind him was a Range Rover, and in front of them disappearing out of frame was a hatchback of some kind.
Guess that's what he gets for being closest to the camera and the only car in the picture on which a number plate could be read...

Here's the linky...
http://www.police.qld.gov.au/Resourc...alibration.pdf
"Question 2" says it all when someone asks about more than one car in the photo...

"There is often more than one vehicle in the photograph travelling in the same direction. Members of the Queensland Police Service, Traffic Camera Office are specially trained in the deployment of cameras, adjudication of offences and can accurately identify offending vehicles."

Oh they must be amazingly special all right...

I would challenge any photographic expert in the world to distinguish which vehicle in a photo of traffic on a street is travelling fastest...

[-RADICAL-POSTURE-]

Get an in car video camera. I have a blackvueDR400G-HD it has GPS and records speed and has adjustable G-force settings for event recording including parking mode. It also has very good HD footage even in low to no light. Audio is ***** and sounds very muddy, but really so what if it saves your *** and can prove your in the right.
It may well just have saved my hide, as the other day I was driving through an intersection with a fixed camera at 53K's and got a double flash. If it was me that gets the ticket then I will have some good evidence to prove me a good boy. the video has a date stamp, time and speed.

[-RADICAL-POSTURE-]

Get an in car video camera. I have a blackvueDR400G-HD it has GPS and records speed and has adjustable G-force settings for event recording including parking mode. It also has very good HD footage even in low to no light. Audio is ***** and sounds very muddy, but really so what if it saves your *** and can prove your in the right.
It may well just have saved my hide, as the other day I was driving through an intersection with a fixed camera at 53K's and got a double flash. If it was me that gets the ticket then I will have some good evidence to prove me a good boy. the video has a date stamp, time and speed.

[-RADICAL-POSTURE-]

O no double post sorry..

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by -RADICAL-POSTURE-

Get an in car video camera. I have a blackvueDR400G-HD it has GPS and records speed and has adjustable G-force settings for event recording including parking mode. It also has very good HD footage even in low to no light. Audio is ***** and sounds very muddy, but really so what if it saves your *** and can prove your in the right.
It may well just have saved my hide, as the other day I was driving through an intersection with a fixed camera at 53K's and got a double flash. If it was me that gets the ticket then I will have some good evidence to prove me a good boy. the video has a date stamp, time and speed.

Yep, I can vouch for them...not sure if it;s the same model, but it sounds like it...one of the guys I work with out here had a very close call with a truck at a level crossing in the train, and when I worked with him a while ago, we were getting our stuff squared away in the cabin of the locomotive, and he pulled out this little black box shaped thing, plugged it into a power socket, and suckered it to the lower corner of the windscreen. I asked him what it was and he told me virtually what you said there...it took great video but the sound wasn't that good. Even in the darkness of early morning before dawn it took pretty good video.
When we got back one of the supervisors said that control had complained we took too long to get the train moving after our sign on time...you have around 20 minutes to be on the train and moving to keep the system working, and they seemed to be claiming we took well over half an hour. Anyway, we knew damn well that we had, so he pulled out the SD card from this thing, put it in a reader, and plugged it into a computer. It had a graph showing movement, and also time, date, GPS location, and speed. We told the supervisor that we'd turned up on time, signed in, drove down to the other end of the yard to the train, got the other crew off, packed our gear away, and asked for a green light from control. The camera showed we got a light and started moving at 23 minutes after our sign on, so they had nothing to complain about and the matter was dropped. Not exactly "saved" us as it was an informal thing, but it backed up our claims with solid evidence, and if it'd been a more serious disciplinary thing, we would have been able to prove where and when we were.
I'm really thinking about getting one for the car...

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

I would challenge any photographic expert in the world to distinguish which vehicle in a photo of traffic on a street is travelling fastest...

wouldn't the software be able to take a different reading for each lane

and within reason, wouldn't the speeding car be a set distance away from the camera when the photo is taken. if the shutter speed is one second, then for sure a car doing 120 would be much further down the road than a car doing 60, but if the shutter speed was very fast, then i would have thought that the placement of the car along with the software should be able to give them an accurate idea

now i am sure that being run by the government and having people working them means that they may not be totally trust worthy, but i would think that the technology is all there to be accurate when set up properly

[xisled]

The new camera's in Vic messure distance. That is how they can tell which car.

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by Matty4

I would.
All you have to argue is reasonable doubt.
Request proof that it was your vehicle speeding and that the other vehicle was not speeding. They can't prove that beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law.

If it's only your numberplate visible then they have probably taken a gamble on sending it out hoping you'll just pay it without question.

In traffic you do not have to be 'proven beyond reasonable doubt', you been watching too much Law and Order, it goes on 'balance of probability'.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

In traffic you do not have to be 'proven beyond reasonable doubt', you been watching too much Law and Order, it goes on 'balance of probability'.

if it goes before a magistrate and there's doubt in his mind as to which car has been detected speeding
he might throw the case out but you better be prepared with all the facts and be prepared to lose too.

[ED Classic]

Originally Posted by jaydee

The new speed cameras can do up to 3 lanes at the same time and differentiate which ones are speeding.
The old ones couldn't and would self cancel the image, so I'd say you could be in trouble if they sent the fine out to you.

This ^^^^