100 Years of Ford Australia history being destroyed

[Yobbo75]

Hi All

Mountains of old documents, photos, designs, parts blueprints, and basically all the old history of Ford Australia are rotting away in a normal unprotected warehouse due to Ford head office politics.

https://www.drive.com.au/news/ford-a...till-in-limbo/

Ford USA want to send these to Detroit to be digitised and stored and blaming the Aust Government for stopping the export.

Most of these items are very old and wouldn't survive the journey to the US. They could easily be digitised and protected/stored here. Ford is penny pinching.

Might be good for us all to contact Ford to try to get these digitised and kept before its too late!

[Itsme]

Problem is quite simple to rectify, donate the documents & photos to the National Library of Australia.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Yobbo75

Hi All

Mountains of old documents, photos, designs, parts blueprints, and basically all the old history of Ford Australia are rotting away in a normal unprotected warehouse due to Ford head office politics.

https://www.drive.com.au/news/ford-a...till-in-limbo/

Ford USA want to send these to Detroit to be digitised and stored and blaming the Aust Government for stopping the export.

Most of these items are very old and wouldn't survive the journey to the US. They could easily be digitised and protected/stored here. Ford is penny pinching.

Might be good for us all to contact Ford to try to get these digitised and kept before its too late!

Opportunity here for AFF to hold it's hand out for government grant to digitize the documents and store here on the AFF servers.

Everyone wins - Australian government keeps the information in Australia, Ford gets it's documents digitized and AFF gets a government grant for it's hassles.

[Dr Terry]

What he said ^^^^ .

Dr Terry

[fgpsi]

surely the lost fpv fgx desings will surface one day

[simon varley]

Originally Posted by Yobbo75

Ford is penny pinching.

that's ****in' hilarious! do you have any idea at all what this would cost to do properly? penny pinching - not. Millions! at a time when they are laying people off. blame whoever you like, but not Ford Australia.

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by simon varley

that's ****in' hilarious! do you have any idea at all what this would cost to do properly? penny pinching - not. Millions! at a time when they are laying people off. blame whoever you like, but not Ford Australia.

I think it was head office in the US that was getting blamed

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by simon varley

that's ****in' hilarious! do you have any idea at all what this would cost to do properly? penny pinching - not. Millions! at a time when they are laying people off. blame whoever you like, but not Ford Australia.

When aren't Ford Australia laying people off? Feels like the usual story to be honest - didn't matter how much tax payer money got thrown at all the manufacturers over the past 20 years, they all left us high and dry the moment the tax payer money stopped coming.

[simon varley]

ok, but they hired MASSIVELY over the last 15 years into engineering to deliver T6. Unfortunately, even that is now ramping back.

including me but the package is good

[Sprintey]

What would it take for AFF to help digitising this history? Trained History grad here, can help.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Sprintey

What would it take for AFF to help digitising this history? Trained History grad here, can help.

Multiples of 6 figures from the tax payer would grease the wheels quite nicely.

+20% for Franco cause it was my idea

[Sprintey]

And an office barista and chef, yoga room and quiet time room

[kevino]

Originally Posted by simon varley

ok, but they hired MASSIVELY over the last 15 years into engineering to deliver T6. Unfortunately, even that is now ramping back.

including me but the package is good

I m sure you will go onto better things!

As for Ford long term I m not sure

I was thinking about the death of Escape today and how very narrow their product range is now -

[au2000]

Sadly always on the cards.. sorry for those on the chopping block, but it was not a secret this was the last Aussie ranger, next one was to be by the USA team unless that’s changed, should just donate it all to the Australian national library with a condition that copies are sent to the us ford archives, Australia takes up the leg work, ford us get their own copies

[b0son]

Considering it's Ford IP, and Ford being a US company, not sure why anyone is outraged. If Ford have made a commitment to digitize it, why isnt the government letting them do so? Some petty bureaucrats that would rather enforce a rule than work toward an outcome. The Australian way...

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by simon varley

ok, but they hired MASSIVELY over the last 15 years into engineering to deliver T6. Unfortunately, even that is now ramping back.

including me but the package is good

Go on and work your magic in the aftermarket like some of your colleagues, there's an absolute guru from Ford Australia who was on the LPG program working his magic in the aftermarket tuning scene, or go look at places like Thales who do defence manufacturing, I'm sure they could use someone with your skills.

and now you're out, feel free to leak information

[DFB FGXR6]

If the government want this material kept here in Australia, then they need to pay for it to be digitized and the originals safely housed. If not, then it should be sent back to Ford in the US. Leaving it to rot is a travesty.

[Franco Cozzo]

Or send it to the VIC State Library and have the poindexters over there do all the archiving and digitizing - it's Australia's oldest public library and one of the very first free public libraries in the world when it was established in 1854.

Established in 1854 as the Melbourne Public Library, State Library Victoria is Australia's oldest public library and one of the first free public libraries in the world.

Our founders believed that access to knowledge was critical for the development of a civil and prosperous community, and created the Library as 'the people’s university' – a place of learning and discovery for all Victorians. They also charged the Library with preserving Victoria's heritage by collecting items of historical and cultural significance for future generations.

These are responsibilities that remain a critical focus today. Each year we add more than 70,000 heritage items to the Library’s rich collection and lead the sector with our ambitious digitisation programs. We also work hard to adapt and remain relevant to our Library users, as well as reach out to new audiences. As a result, Library patronage has continued to increase, with almost two million physical visits to the Library annually and over 4.3 million annual online visits.

https://www.slv.vic.gov.au/about-us/history-and-vision

[EBSXR6]

Originally Posted by Yobbo75

Hi All

Mountains of old documents, photos, designs, parts blueprints, and basically all the old history of Ford Australia are rotting away in a normal unprotected warehouse due to Ford head office politics.

https://www.drive.com.au/news/ford-a...till-in-limbo/

Ford USA want to send these to Detroit to be digitised and stored and blaming the Aust Government for stopping the export.

Most of these items are very old and wouldn't survive the journey to the US. They could easily be digitised and protected/stored here. Ford is penny pinching.

Might be good for us all to contact Ford to try to get these digitised and kept before its too late!

Fairfax Penny Pinched on their historical material and sent it to the USA to be digitized.
The company went broke and the material became part of the liquidated assets.

[commodorenutt]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

….. or go look at places like Thales who do defence manufacturing, I'm sure they could use someone with your skills

This ^^^ is a good idea.

It was like a reunion of GMH engineers at the defence expo last year.

Might need to balance it with a bit more blue 😀😀😀

Although there’s a little uncertainty with land defence spending now. It seems they want to divert it to water…..

[stock1991]

I thought Ford Australia was a subsidiary of Ford Canada, anyway my two cents is put it all up for auction. Allow some of the fans to own parts of it

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by commodorenutt

This ^^^ is a good idea.

It was like a reunion of GMH engineers at the defence expo last year.

Might need to balance it with a bit more blue 😀😀😀

Although there’s a little uncertainty with land defence spending now. It seems they want to divert it to water…..

And missiles I heard.

[Sprintey]

Gotta get over water and through missiles before getting on the land...

[Dr Terry]

Originally Posted by stock1991

I thought Ford Australia was a subsidiary of Ford Canada

That was back n the 60s. Since then Ford US now own all of it.

Dr Terry

[commodorenutt]

Originally Posted by roKWiz

And missiles I heard.

You heard right. The acronym is GWEO, and since there’s bugger all else made locally, there was a strong push from the government to localise as much of the supply chain as possible. Mind you, it’s been pretty quiet since Albo took over in SCamberra.

However, with US designs being chosen, big business owning IP, and the “urgency” on getting it underway, it looks like it will be little more than local assembly from “CKD” so to speak. At least for some time.

They do want local companies to tender for parts supply, but it’s going to be tough for locals to compete on price with lower local volumes, compared to the economy of scale the US suppliers already have.



But back to the Ford documentation issue.

I was told quite a few “stories” by someone who knew a family member involved in scanning & digitising a batch of old court records. The project was massive, and there were very few interested parties. Now this was some years ago, so technology wasn’t as good as today. It was literally put a document on a flatbed scanner, scan it, and change the file name to match the pre-determined pattern of case number, sequentially a signed document number etc. Very labour intensive. They tendered at something like 9c per page, and because nobody else tendered, they got the work. They subcontracted a lot of it out to uni students - paying something like 4c per page. Not a lot of money, but doing 1000 pages could net $40 - but it took hours. When they got a request to do another batch, they turned it down, as they worked out that even though they got the bulk of it done as slave labour, the time it took organising it all meant they made next to no profit. They wouldn’t do it again, even at 15c per page.

So thinking about the Ford files, they wouldn’t all be neat A4 pages you could stack on a multi-feed scanner and let loose. Some of it may end up needing to be page by page, and odd sizes too.

Now they have a warehouse stacked with these documents, most likely on pallets. A pallet of A4 paper (reams, in cartons) is around 100,000 sheets (40 boxes x 2500 sheets per box). Now “used” paper takes up more space, but it would not be too far fetched to suggest 40,000 to 50,000 pages per pallet.
How many pallets do they have stored? They need a warehouse right? You wouldn’t need a warehouse for 1 or 2 pallets - there would have to be dozens of them.

So a conservative estimate would be at least 2 million document pages. At just 10c per page in labour, that’s over $200k. It could easily be 10x that.

Massive project…..

Even though FOA no longer makes cars, they still support parts, dealers, some history, and ever-reducing engineering. There may be commercially sensitive data that they wouldn’t want anyone outside of FOA or the US to see. Because of this, I can’t see them letting “subbies” do the scanning work.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by commodorenutt

You heard right. The acronym is GWEO, and since there’s bugger all else made locally, there was a strong push from the government to localise as much of the supply chain as possible. Mind you, it’s been pretty quiet since Albo took over in SCamberra.

However, with US designs being chosen, big business owning IP, and the “urgency” on getting it underway, it looks like it will be little more than local assembly from “CKD” so to speak. At least for some time.

They do want local companies to tender for parts supply, but it’s going to be tough for locals to compete on price with lower local volumes, compared to the economy of scale the US suppliers already have.



But back to the Ford documentation issue.

I was told quite a few “stories” by someone who knew a family member involved in scanning & digitising a batch of old court records. The project was massive, and there were very few interested parties. Now this was some years ago, so technology wasn’t as good as today. It was literally put a document on a flatbed scanner, scan it, and change the file name to match the pre-determined pattern of case number, sequentially a signed document number etc. Very labour intensive. They tendered at something like 9c per page, and because nobody else tendered, they got the work. They subcontracted a lot of it out to uni students - paying something like 4c per page. Not a lot of money, but doing 1000 pages could net $40 - but it took hours. When they got a request to do another batch, they turned it down, as they worked out that even though they got the bulk of it done as slave labour, the time it took organising it all meant they made next to no profit. They wouldn’t do it again, even at 15c per page.

So thinking about the Ford files, they wouldn’t all be neat A4 pages you could stack on a multi-feed scanner and let loose. Some of it may end up needing to be page by page, and odd sizes too.

Now they have a warehouse stacked with these documents, most likely on pallets. A pallet of A4 paper (reams, in cartons) is around 100,000 sheets (40 boxes x 2500 sheets per box). Now “used” paper takes up more space, but it would not be too far fetched to suggest 40,000 to 50,000 pages per pallet.
How many pallets do they have stored? They need a warehouse right? You wouldn’t need a warehouse for 1 or 2 pallets - there would have to be dozens of them.

So a conservative estimate would be at least 2 million document pages. At just 10c per page in labour, that’s over $200k. It could easily be 10x that.

Massive project…..

Even though FOA no longer makes cars, they still support parts, dealers, some history, and ever-reducing engineering. There may be commercially sensitive data that they wouldn’t want anyone outside of FOA or the US to see. Because of this, I can’t see them letting “subbies” do the scanning work.

They don't have a choice because the Australian Government is preventing the export, either Ford Australia does it, they contract it out to a local archival/documentation business/community group or they rot in storage.

Ford USA might own the intellectual property, but the Australian Government says otherwise due to cultural significance.

The VIC state government already has a group which does exactly this - State Library of Victoria.

I reckon since the government has such an interest in it from a cultural perspective, then the government pays a community group a couple hundred thousand bucks, or multiples of 7 figures if you know what I mean. Ford USA gets its documents digitised for free, the Australian governments keeps the culturally significant documents in Australia and its a positive PR campaign for the federal government about how they solved a problem and supported a community group.

I reckon there's an opportunity for a taxpayer funded payday in it for AFF given the 'cultural significance' and the 'concern' on show by the Government.

The claim about 'having no time' will come up, but if there's $500,000-$1,000,000+ on the table from the tax payer for it for an Australian Ford community, watch how quickly time suddenly becomes available to do this mundane job

I think its worth having the conversation with the local federal MP and signalling intentions, this community already has an archive of information so why not complete it (and get paid by the government)?

They hand out tax payer funding for all sorts of bull****, get in on it. Whats the worst thats going to happen, they say no?

[CyberWasp]

My dumb question of the day is what happened to the equivalent files at Holden when it closed?
Have they been achieved or destroyed for example?

[1970XW351]

They are probably being stored in a special, climate-controlled bunker deep in the heart of Canberra with a team of expert conservators working around the clock to protect them from the ravages of time. (At taxpayer's expense, naturally) Because we all know that Holden is the quintessential Aussie brand and our national heritage needs to be preserved.

Tongue only slightly in cheek.

Cheers, Tony

[commodorenutt]

Almost right. Just move the bunker to SA and power the climate control system by a government purchased Tesla super battery…….

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by au2000

Sadly always on the cards.. sorry for those on the chopping block, but it was not a secret this was the last Aussie ranger, next one was to be by the USA team unless that’s changed, should just donate it all to the Australian national library with a condition that copies are sent to the us ford archives, Australia takes up the leg work, ford us get their own copies

Except that idea to move the Ranger onto the F series T4 platform was dropped as not being viable. So the next Ranger come 2032 will be done here as well. A lot of facilities upgrades in the build to cater for the future work.

Originally Posted by stock1991

I thought Ford Australia was a subsidiary of Ford Canada, anyway my two cents is put it all up for auction. Allow some of the fans to own parts of it

They were, as both being commonwealth countries it allowed for commonwealth subsidies and trade tax concessions. Not sure when that would have ended though. Maybe in the 60's?