Rear fog light mod?

[b2tf]

Is there any word on a howto doco for this? Im keen to do it but Im not too sure about what I'm doing, would like some pics for reference :hihi:.

[Timmeh]

A few people have done it, but noone has sent me any pictures or information at www.eurofordclub.com so I can do a write up.

I haven't done it myself as I spend alot of time in foggy conditions, but I know alot of people have. Get me some info and pictures you slackers!

ing_sm

Tim

[b2tf]

Tim you need to edit that link, spelt wrong so it wont work.

I'm happy enough to do it and take pics as long as i know exactly what I'm doing i.e. wire colours etc etc.

[Timmeh]

Originally Posted by back2thefutura

Tim you need to edit that link, spelt wrong so it wont work.

I knew I kept you club members around for some reason.... :

Tim

[EFFalcon]

if u do it... please remember to turn it off!

[Timmeh]

Originally Posted by EFFalcon

if u do it... please remember to turn it off!

The mod is to remove the fog light for another reverse light, not add a fog light. That comes standard.

Tim

[b2tf]

Originally Posted by Timmeh

I knew I kept you club members around for some reason.... :

Tim

I'm actually not a EuroFordClub member :P.

[Timmeh]

That's coz you're a smart aleck! The clubs IQ is higher with this arrangement too. (jokes.... join the club already!)

:dr_Evil:

Tim

[b2tf]

Bah. IQ is just a number ;). I'll get round to joining once i get some better pics.

[brother]

Does anyone out there who's done this have a quick how to? I will be doing it very soon before I fit my skirts.

Nothing fancy is needed. Just which wires, if any, need to be cut and connected to where.

Cheers guys

[b2tf]

Zetec gave me a very brief rundown of how to do it but Im not keen on adding/cutting wires without seeing pictures of how to do it first. If you like I'll post up what he told me (or better still he can tell you!) and you can have a go.

If you do do it, PLEASE write up a howto and take plenty of pics. When I think of all the botched wiring jobs I did on my Falcon it scares me, hence why Im being very cautious about this mod.

[Keepleft]

Timmeh - A couple of things,
a) Although ADR52-ECE38 (rear fog lights) is optional, for now, those cars supplied with them should not have them disconnected, or wired as additional brake lights (an offence in itself) or removed in favour of another reverse light sourced from the spare parts bin in another Continent. The car was issued ADR compliance on its as 'supplied basis'.

b) Why would anyone wish to disconnect the rear fog light? Do you really spend 'THAT' much time in reverse?? Should also take into account the switch remaining AND a future buyer of the unfortunate vehicle.

I see some stupid stuff on patrol, but when I do see in heavy fog an inoperative rear fog that's been rewired to some other lamp function, or disconnected, I put it down to natural selection.

In any case, standard 5watt red taillights are 100% useless in heavy rain, bushfire smoke, dust on gravel roads, heavy snowfall, let alone dense fog.

By all means hate the rear fog light (I couldn't give a stuff about front, which always remain optional, everywhere) but remember mis-use is driver fault. Growing penalties in the wind I think.

[brother]

Originally Posted by Keepleft

Timmeh - A couple of things,
a) Although ADR52-ECE38 (rear fog lights) is optional, for now, those cars supplied with them should not have them disconnected, or wired as additional brake lights (an offence in itself) or removed in favour of another reverse light sourced from the spare parts bin in another Continent. The car was issued ADR compliance on its as 'supplied basis'.

Nope, it comes from spare parts in australia. It's a pre-delivery thing if you are getting the factory body kit fitted, so it is in a 'supplied basis'. If you choose to do it afterwards (I am fitting the factory body kit) the doesn't change the final result. Check out www.fordfocus.com.au under the configure and price section. It says that the 'Rear fog lamp is replaced with reverse light when fitted' in the body styling kit popup (That's why I did it). The way I did it (detailed below) is the exact way that they are all done here by ford themselves, I asked.

Originally Posted by Keepleft

b) Why would anyone wish to disconnect the rear fog light? Do you really spend 'THAT' much time in reverse?? Should also take into account the switch remaining AND a future buyer of the unfortunate vehicle.

I always thought it was a pretty good idea to let people know when I am about to reverse, not just those to the left of my car and I spend much more time in reverse than I do in fog, but that won't apply to everyone here. Plus, if you know enough to change it to a reverse light, it's extremely simple to change it back, so it's hardly an unfortunate vehicle.

Originally Posted by Keepleft

I see some stupid stuff on patrol, but when I do see in heavy fog an inoperative rear fog that's been rewired to some other lamp function, or disconnected, I put it down to natural selection.

???

Originally Posted by Keepleft

In any case, standard 5watt red taillights are 100% useless in heavy rain, bushfire smoke, dust on gravel roads, heavy snowfall, let alone dense fog.

By all means hate the rear fog light (I couldn't give a stuff about front, which always remain optional, everywhere) but remember mis-use is driver fault. Growing penalties in the wind I think.

For those that do plan on doing it (every person I've spoken to at ford thinks it is really weird they only fitted one reverse light) it's quite simple and I have pics, but will post them later, maybe on eurofordclub.com.

1. First, take both lenses off following the bulb replacement guide in the manual.

2. Use a small flathead screwdriver to lift the tab holding the buld holder to the wiring harness on both sides. Push the harness back into the bumper till it falls out the bottom to give yourself some more room.

3. Cut the green wire to the rear fog light (green is the active wire, black is the earth)

4. Strip some insulation off the green wire to the reverse light to expose the wiring.

5. Get some wire (about 2m, I got mine for free from ford my ford dealer) and connect up both ends and seal with electrical tape.

6. Be sure to securely attach the wire to the inside of the rear bumper and ensure that it can never touch the exhaust pipe or muffler. I was a bit concerned the insulation may melt and short out the circuit.

7. Reconnect the bulb holders and lenses.

[Timmeh]

Just for the record, I am not one of the people who is looking to change my rear fog light with a reverse light. But if someone is going to do it anyway, getting a definitive write up on it for the club site is worthwhile.

Tim

[whippet_zetec]

I am not one that is going to change my rear fog light over, especially considering the fog from this morning here in Western Sydney. I feel much better having it on in the fog than not at all...the more visible I am the less chance I have of some Sydney Moron driving up my **** on the roads......and before anyone quips I am one that knows how to use the rear fog light as it is designed and legally allowed to be used, front fogs well I use them all the time ;)

[Keepleft]

Brother:-

1. The reverse lamp (UN/ECE 'AR') located on the left is photometrically designed to show a 'wide' light to the rear. If someone cannot see one when approaching the vehicle 10 metres out from a lane adjacent to a driver, then they'd best stop driving for the betterment of all.

If you cannot see well enough with the reverse light then get your eyes checked. The reverse lights key function is to alert rear approaching drivers that your in reverse gear, I'll say again - they'll see you on approach, the light @ 21watt is plenty strong enough for that.


2. I didn't locate the bodykit, but suspect it might be Continental EU (right hand reverse, left hand fog) or US sourced. The yanks have twin reverse but slowly the North American market 'accepts', at it learns, the existence of rear fog lights and the weather conditions to which they are designed. (SAEJ1315).

If the kit (genuine or not) is supplied by Ford and fitted by genuine Ford dealers, then the vehicles Compliance, in the removal of a Certified vehicle lamp function, becomes unclear, UNLESS Ford also sent for ADR Compliance a bodied kitted car. The question remains as to what happens to the rear fog switch, by now useless.


3. If you've spoken to people at your local Ford, or Ford at large, who think it is odd that you have a single reverse light, it is purely symptomatic of 'sheer (QLD??) ignorance' of their product knowledge, and for what the rear fog light feature is intended. It's Certainly NOT expert opinion on the role of safety equipment as supplied and certified. IF one of their knuckle dragging employees continues to see otherwise, they can call me and we'll organise discussion with DOTARS as why we should ban rear fogs in favour of twin reverse function, be prepared to be laughed out of the building.

Most manufacturers choose to fit a single rear fog light to minimise the possibility that some ignorant or inattentive motorist mistakes it (were they twin) for brake-lights'. (Every Aus market MB car from 1972-4 has a single rear fog, BMW from 74).


4. At the end of the day, you have a choice, either a purely **** factor look at me modification which merely highlights to world travelled, world class drivers, the stupidity and negligence of the person directly in front, or you can maintain the supplied safety feature, so designed for use in heavy rain and snow, in bushfire smoke, when on gravel roads or in heavy fog,- all to reduce or prevent in totality, some blind Bogan from running up your **** and pushing your vehicle into oncoming traffic, or having it blow-up whilst desperate people try to free the trapped inside. (I attend crashes). Your twin reverse lights AND your standard 5watt taillights will do absolutely zilch when in hazardous weather conditions. Like I say, natural selection.

There is this: If one does the modification, you could still legally add an additional rear fog light, hanging pendant to the right of centreline. A slim height Robert Bosch unit would suffice. (Robert Bosch Part No: 0 313 109 001). That lamp unit is suited to XR's and other low height vehicles. This would give you your desired twin reverse, but also maintain its rear-fog integrity.


Whippet-Zetec: When next you are in such heavy fog conditions, activate the rear fog AND you left indicator. Walk back and count the seconds between when the standard taillight fades from view (fast) and the difference between the flashing amber and rear fog. The rear fog outshines the amber flasher despite having the same bulb owing its unique polished reflector. Many seconds of extra warning is given to following vehicles.

The rear fog light can be a pain when mis-used, blame the driver and the teaching system, not the light.

[b2tf]

Excuse me, but Im not too impressed with your post. I take it you're a cop.

For clarity's sake, I'll tell you now that the reason I intend to do this modification is because I have a long driveway which can get a little tricky when reversing down it at night. Just tonight I had to take it VERY slowly because it was raining quite heavily and I couldnt see much. I have no problem with going slow - Im not a hoon, and Im not doing this mod as you put it 'for **** factor'. I intend to do it because I think the more I can make both the car and the area behind it visible, the better.

Call me a hoon if you want to, fact of the matter is you dont know me and you dont know how I drive. My Focus gets treated like a bloody king - not flogged around and most definately not modded in such a way to look ridiculous or be unsafe. So I'll thank you not to make your classifications and judgments via the Internet towards people you have never met.

Natural selection has seen me drive with only 1 incident (where i was not entirely at fault) in 2 years of driving. Thats driving 100kms every day. Not much I know but it is still better experience than some others have.

F**k the rear foglight, I never use it anyway so I may as well have something I would use A LOT in place of it.

[zetec]

Keepleft I welcome your comments and appreciate your concerns, I'd like to offer my entry into the discussion just to clarify where I stand, in no way an attack on anyone's point of view.

1) When your XR patrol car has rear foglights fitted as standard, or any Australian built vehicle for that matter, then I'll fully support a moral push against those who disconnect them or don't have them at all. My Focus was designed as a European vehicle where fog and heavy rain is an almost daily ocurrence for months at a time. How do I know? I lived in Belgium for 12 months and learnt to drive there, I have a fairly sound understanding of road courtesy and reading traffic beyond your average Australian muppet having seen many many kilometres on German Autobahns, Belgian and French highways in all kinds of conditions at speeds that would kill according to the Australian government. Whilst I am not proclaiming that this translates into driving ability, I will definitely offer that I know how to use my hazard lights on a highway, how to leave a gap, read ahead of the traffic and how to drive defensively at speed. I'm not perfect and don't claim to be and am as susceptible to human error as the next person, but I feel I have a sound knowledge and comprehension of what it's like to SHARE the road, unlike the vast majority of idiots out there with a plastic card in their wallet that makes them seemingly invincible and knowledgeable.

2) I left the original circuit hooked up and simply piggybacked the new linking circuit between the bulbs. The bodykit is Australian designed produced and fitted by Ford. I changed the red lense to a white lens as fitted standard for a Focus ST170 sold from the showroom floor
(factory fresh), or a lesser-Focus with a bodykit fitted by the Dealer. This means I now have 2 lights when I engage reverse, which increases my visibility when reversing. Considering I also spend FAR more time reversing than I ever do in fog, I consider that safer to my fellow motorists that they can see me when reversing now from a wider angle, regardless of what the design rules SHOULD stipulate. Fact is, my bumper is curved and ther is DEFINITELY higher visibility from behind, mush like double sides on any Aussie built vehicle. I can also be seen reversing from the right hand side, handy if I happen to reverse onto the opposite side of the road where the right hand side of my vehicle would normally obscure the light shown by the lower left light. This circuit can be disconnected at any time when the vehicle is sold (which I'm not aiming on doing!! I love it too much) and have retained the original lense so it can be returned to factory spec. I made the conscious decision due to the fact that I never drive in fog unlike Tim who says he is often in foggy conditions and prefers the standard settings. So based upon my own (perhaps flawed) opinion, I feel my reverser is safer than my foglight. If it's good enough for Ford to sell the ST170 with no rear foglight, a useless but still present switch and twin reversers and the vehicle is ADR compliant, then it's good enough for me. I would never willingly flout any ADR rule and if told, would convert it back within 15 minutes, the time taken to collect my pliers, keys and jump into the boot.

3) In the event of thick fog, I believe it is a recommendation by the NSW RTA from memory (where I was granted my licence), that I turn on my hazards in the event of thick fog, if no rear foglight is fitted. No problems. That still makes me FAR more visible than if I did nothing but switch on my headlights. Whether or not the rear foglight is brighter may be the case, however I am not only still far more visible than the VAST VAST majority or drivers, but average joe wouldn't even have the autonomous cranial capacity to consider turning on their hazards, they'd just flick on their high-beams and charge on into the fog. Says less about me and more about proper trajining in my books.

4) The majority of people, as previously mentioned, still have no clue how to use rear fogs correctly, it is FAR more dangerous and distracting for someone to use them in the dry and daylight personally than not use them in fog. I don't have data to back that up, it's just a seat-of-the-pants opinion. Until Jim Henson's average driver can take some smart pills and actually learn how to use them, I think we're safer not fitting them at all than mandating them and not educating. Front fogs are bad enough and Holden should be publicly shamed for their "driving lights" law-bending. There is no need for such ridiculously blinding searchlights, not in fog, not in daytime, not at night. High beams are for those conditions where needed and all ADR compliant High beams should be more than adequate at night.

I hope this shows that some thought and consideration has gone into my decision to do what I did, I most definitely made a conscious decision being a city based driver and not a country driver. Yes it looks good, yes it's convenient, but I personally feel it is safer. I feel the average motorist wouldn't know where to start with half the switches in their vehicles and personally feel that it is just amazing to think that you guys cop a bad rep (pardon the pun) for whoever it is that decides not to train drivers about these extra issues.

[Timmeh]

Some good discussion here guys, just a friendly reminder to keep it cool calm and collected. :eclipsee_

Tim

[zetec]

Originally Posted by Keepleft

There is this: If one does the modification, you could still legally add an additional rear fog light, hanging pendant to the right of centreline. A slim height Robert Bosch unit would suffice. (Robert Bosch Part No: 0 313 109 001). That lamp unit is suited to XR's and other low height vehicles. This would give you your desired twin reverse, but also maintain its rear-fog integrity.

That is a very good suggestion and one that sadly not many people would consider or know about.

That fact that a disturbingly large number of people constantly told me that one of my reversing lights was broken kind of hinted to me that it was safer to have it fitted as it seems they were expecting two to light up... we're all used to Aussie cars it seems.

I used to sell and deliver Fords not long ago and I can assure you that I rammed it home that the rear foglight was to be used only in fog, likewise for the fronts. So I understand the frustration and tried to contribute as best I could to an otherwise inadequate education about the abilities and safety features of motor vehicles.

Don't even start me on ABS. A system so effectively simple and useful that some idiots will even contradict their natural reflexes and lift off the pedal when hard braking because they feel something is wrong... these are the same idiots who have potentially slowed down the progression of ABS into lower spec cars as standard due to the added cost of things such as Emergency Brakeforce Assistance to subtract the driver's stupidity from the equation by holding down the pedal for them. I personally feel the ABS pulsation is a sharp reminder that my vehicle is trying very hard to stop and it communicates to me that something is awry with the road surface (or that I'm stopping incredibly quickly on a dry surface perhaps down a hill). These fools pay the added costs of having this system in their vehicle, get bamboozled by the salesman when he tells them it's fitted, they boast how many features their car is equipped with, yet to use your own phrse, are subject to natural selection when they have to use them once, get scared, lift off, hit the object they're trying to avoid, and die... sad fact that presence of ABS has actually increased accidents rates or mortalities or whatever it officially is stated as. How do I know this? My roomate has recently completed his honours thesis into knowledge of ABS, it's operations, limitation and effectiveness. His results are positively frightening and make me want to stay at home and play GT4 just to be able to drive a car without the risk of some idiot killing me...

[b2tf]

I agree whole heartedly with Matt's posts, to further add to my own - we've just had 2 days of rain and VERY thick fog at low levels - I couldnt even see up the end of my own street from my house it was so thick, and its only abuot 50 odd metres.

After reading this thread I did a test - put the rear foglight on as well as the hazards, left them going and walked about 50m away from my car. Which do you think I could see easier?

[brother]

Originally Posted by Keepleft

Brother:-

1. The reverse lamp (UN/ECE 'AR') located on the left is photometrically designed to show a 'wide' light to the rear. If someone cannot see one when approaching the vehicle 10 metres out from a lane adjacent to a driver, then they'd best stop driving for the betterment of all.

I've never seen light bend when travelling through light. Hence, if you can't see the lens, you can't see the light. This is only made worse by the rear skirt.

Originally Posted by Keepleft

If you cannot see well enough with the reverse light then get your eyes checked. The reverse lights key function is to alert rear approaching drivers that your in reverse gear, I'll say again - they'll see you on approach, the light @ 21watt is plenty strong enough for that.

I never said I couldn't see. I think your eyes need checking to read posts correctly.

You said it, the reverse light is to alert other drivers you are coming back. Have you ever stood to the right behind a focus when reversing? Then you can make a call about what's enough. If you have, then it's your opinion.

Originally Posted by Keepleft

2. I didn't locate the bodykit, but suspect it might be Continental EU (right hand reverse, left hand fog) or US sourced. The yanks have twin reverse but slowly the North American market 'accepts', at it learns, the existence of rear fog lights and the weather conditions to which they are designed. (SAEJ1315).

If the kit (genuine or not) is supplied by Ford and fitted by genuine Ford dealers, then the vehicles Compliance, in the removal of a Certified vehicle lamp function, becomes unclear, UNLESS Ford also sent for ADR Compliance a bodied kitted car. The question remains as to what happens to the rear fog switch, by now useless.

Who cares about a useless switch? The ST170's are in the same boat as mine is. I do have a genuine ford body kit so I can only assume ford has taken care of the ADR compliance. Hardly my worry.

Originally Posted by Keepleft

3. If you've spoken to people at your local Ford, or Ford at large, who think it is odd that you have a single reverse light, it is purely symptomatic of 'sheer (QLD??) ignorance' of their product knowledge, and for what the rear fog light feature is intended. It's Certainly NOT expert opinion on the role of safety equipment as supplied and certified. IF one of their knuckle dragging employees continues to see otherwise, they can call me and we'll organise discussion with DOTARS as why we should ban rear fogs in favour of twin reverse function, be prepared to be laughed out of the building.

Wow, what a mature comment about QLD ignorance and ford employees.

Originally Posted by Keepleft

Most manufacturers choose to fit a single rear fog light to minimise the possibility that some ignorant or inattentive motorist mistakes it (were they twin) for brake-lights'. (Every Aus market MB car from 1972-4 has a single rear fog, BMW from 74).


4. At the end of the day, you have a choice, either a purely **** factor look at me modification which merely highlights to world travelled, world class drivers, the stupidity and negligence of the person directly in front, or you can maintain the supplied safety feature, so designed for use in heavy rain and snow, in bushfire smoke, when on gravel roads or in heavy fog,- all to reduce or prevent in totality, some blind Bogan from running up your **** and pushing your vehicle into oncoming traffic, or having it blow-up whilst desperate people try to free the trapped inside. (I attend crashes). Your twin reverse lights AND your standard 5watt taillights will do absolutely zilch when in hazardous weather conditions. Like I say, natural selection.

Geez, what a **** factor.......two reverse lights, it's like i've install neons or something. So I assume you are calling me stupid and negligent? Like I have maintained all along, it is a FORD recommendation that when fitting the rear skirt you should change the rear fog light to a reverse light. If you have an issue with this, take it up with ford.

Originally Posted by Keepleft

There is this: If one does the modification, you could still legally add an additional rear fog light, hanging pendant to the right of centreline. A slim height Robert Bosch unit would suffice. (Robert Bosch Part No: 0 313 109 001). That lamp unit is suited to XR's and other low height vehicles. This would give you your desired twin reverse, but also maintain its rear-fog integrity.

Fair enough. That's a good idea.

[whippet_zetec]

Originally Posted by brother

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keepleft
3. If you've spoken to people at your local Ford, or Ford at large, who think it is odd that you have a single reverse light, it is purely symptomatic of 'sheer (QLD??) ignorance' of their product knowledge, and for what the rear fog light feature is intended. It's Certainly NOT expert opinion on the role of safety equipment as supplied and certified. IF one of their knuckle dragging employees continues to see otherwise, they can call me and we'll organise discussion with DOTARS as why we should ban rear fogs in favour of twin reverse function, be prepared to be laughed out of the building.



Wow, what a mature comment about QLD ignorance and ford employees.

well QUEENSLANDER'S did decide to do without daylight saving because the extra sun fades the curtains and it ruins the cows milking patterns .... lol

[brother]

That was pretty ignorant ;-)

[Keepleft]

Zetec - that many have told you your reverse light is broken when it is a rear fog light, is symptomatic of driving reality in Australia today, more so I suggest outside NSW and ACT where we have, at least for many years now, taught folk what they are. It is also a true reflection on the 'optional' nature of ADR52 rear fog lights, to date.

But, it is my view that changing a lamp function, to in effect, fit in with the ignorant, is not an 'overall' improvement to your or other drivers safety. I would have pointed out its design function and intent. We can then be very thankful that we were in drought and suffer little fog during summer in CBD's etc. The idea, as with warning triangles, is to not to have to use them at all.

If all vehicles of the MA category (cars) had these, we'd collectively know more of the subject matter. Familiarity. I fight to ensure this happens, in time.

Insofar as your modification, I am confident its a proper job and do not question your ability. Do however consider the Robert Bosch rear fog idea if you want your twin reverse function.

This leads me to your point (3). The use of hazard warning lights on moving vehicles, here intended as an alternative to the rear fog light where one is not fitted.

History: The use of hazard warning lights on moving vehicles in heavy fog and other hazardous weather conditions was initially championed here in NSW back in 1988. A Wollongong 'citizen', probably alcohol and illegal drug infused, on experiencing F6 fog conditions at Bulli (where we have had an 86 car pileup, 53 vehicle pileup etc over the years and so on. Car three in the first was a serving police Inspector) wrote to the Minister and local police vis, 'if fog is considered a hazard, why can't we use our hazard lights?'. Get it...? Gee Fred.

The move gained the support of the ignorant and untrained, primarily NSW police and a Minister, they looked at and adopted a system known as 'Operation Fogdown' from California.

Operation fogdown (god bless it) involved groups of vehicles being escorted by a leading police car with its hazard warning lights flashing, which on those US cars were RED not amber (not emergency flashers since blue is useless in fog) AND those of the public, all flashing simultaneously through the fog. Exciting disco stuff, great for bunching up, eye fatigue, and rear ender crashes whilst the innocent waited their turn.

NSW Illawarra police were (I mean seriously) completely ignorant of rear fog lights at the time, and had they been aware, would have been better advised to campaign for their being changed to 'mandatory' via the then FORS. Or, our State 'could' have forced a change for state registration requiring them. This takes proactive effort by public servants, very difficult for many to do or comprehend. (States rights issue, I am a true New South Welshman).

Now, with the development of the Australian Road Rules, kicked off by Keating in 1993, we had an opportunity to smarten things up in regards to the 'safety tools' available to the national driving populace. Sadly, the NSW allowance then became a national rule where it sits uncomfortably at 221(e).

It is now perfectly legal to drive around in 'hazardous weather conditions' with your hazard warning lights flashing. We don't even say in law 'causing reduced visibility' or 'when visibility is less than 50 metres'. Hopeless and utterly pig-ignorant of the Commonwealth Drafting Office, the NRTC and State employees.

One of the problems with the hazards allowance is the issue of lane changes and of familiarity breeding contempt, - where we have an on-road crash and driver's continue at speed into it, albeit all with their flashing hazard warning lights on, realising too late the vehicles have actually stopped. (The Bargo Hume fog and bushfire smoke crash cost $12 million by initial measure in the first few hours alone).

The allowance also directly contravenes the United Nations Conventions on Road Traffic, Road Signs and Signals of 1968. Australia contracted the 1949 Convention on Road Traffic and so some of our leading State public servants feel we are not bound by such International Conformity. In effect, we are the only place in the world authorising such allowance. Even California stopped doing this, something to do with a Convention......

The 68 and later Conventions only allow hazard warning lights to be used at breakdowns and crash scenes, or a quick flash may be given for rear approaching vehicles of a road hazard ahead. The final Convention allowance, also an ARR here, allows the use of the hazard warning lights on a vehicle driving abnormally slow, for example - a laden truck uphill.

The rear fog light is designed with deliberate intent, in 1980 its brightness level was further increased, GB adopted them as mandatory then. Unlike a hazard warning light it has a polished reflector, by design, inherently 'stronger' than the hazard.

Don't rely on hazard warning lights, fit the suggested rear fog light, Robert Bosch or even Hella now stock them. They are mandatory on NSW Fire Brigade fire fighting vehicles, on the basis of Occupational Health and Safety.

It is in my view 'serious negligence', that manufacturers do not take up the current optional ADR 52 allowance. It is not a defence to hide behind dumbed down criteria to save a buck. If hit from behind in heavy fog or rain, in bushfire smoke, on gravel roads or in heavy snowfall, you can sue on the basis of nervous shock (and more}, as can relatives of deceased. Legal issues - that would take me hundreds of pages to write up. See a lawyer.

I had RTA's F6 vehicle fleet, tow trucks, fitted with rear fog lights late 1980's, I was annoyed by an employees complaint on TV following another crash that; 'its still happened, cars crashing into existing stationary, despite people using hazard lights'. Gee, I wonder why.... RTA now use Euro makes which have rear fogs, even though some employees don't know what they are. Other dimwits fit front fog light to Mercedes vans which already have them built into the headlight itself, all seperately switched!!

To help combat NSW police ignorance of rear fog lights, I harassed Robert Bosch and LE Perei for free samples, which I then targeted at Katoomba Police by installing them to their official vehicles a few years ago. My intention was to have staff learn and use the items, and to have them enforce the correct use of the lights through experience gained.

I observed and they quickly adopted, using them properly. After the some personal experience, some police asked that I fit them to their own private vehicles, I did so on a few occasions. I don't get paid for this stuff, I do it because my Euro leanings leave me frustrated with domestic stupidity in road safety and primitive, childlike responses to the road toll, which continue.

I write 'hazardous weather conditions' text for learner driver handbooks around the world and here in AUS. An example here under 'driving in fog, rain or snow' from New York State, which they have slightly modifed (see fog lights), it remains the only US jurisdiction which actively teaches its pupils that they exist, it took them four years to accept I wasn't lying despite highlighting the recommended practice, SAE J1319. Anyhow, little wonder then why complaints of glare increase elsewhere stateside:
http://www.nydmv.state.ny.us/dmanual...r10-manual.htm

To prevent secondary crashes I now fight, and will win come hell or high water, to have every learner driver manual include a picture of an ECE triangle and to include placement text, intended for single vehicle carriage. NSW will release their new Road Users Handbook soon, it has the UNECE triangle, ACT and perhaps VIC will follow.

I use the Euro triangle because its a much better product in design than our AS3790 north American sourced piece of pottage. Pupil see and source!!

I say this, I hate it more than most of you, when I see people mis-using rear fog lights, I hate it more when an HWP unit merely overtakes the offender. I change things by targeting enforcement law, and education. One day we'll have that EU like 50 metre visibility maximum rule in relation to rear fog lights, that they may be used up too. This will enable police targetting of drivers who use them when it is merely 'misty'.

I won't mention certain evil XR's with front fogs and their ongoing mis-use. We'll not mention the arguably non compliant VX-VY SS Plumbadore front fogs, so surely designed by Osama Bin Laden and his group of smoke induced merry men.

Don't start me on 'keep left' in relation to 3 or more laned freeway, you lot outside NSW have not learn't how to use them.

[zetec]

HE he he. Group bulk purchase of the safety triangle perhaps guys? Sounds like a positive step towards some Eurofordclub road safety, considering the Euro origins of our vehicles!!!!!! Any ideas on pricing and where to buy the better Euro-sourced triangles keepleft?

Thanks for an extremely informative post, you certainly know your stuff, I'm not sure of your official position, but you somehow sound a little above your standard police officer and more like a well respected public figure who has moved up through the ranks for good reason. Am I right?

Thank God for people like you...

[Keepleft]

Zetec - I'm a cantankerous, old (42) Motorist's Advocate, the title was thrown at me thousands of years ago by an RTA chap, one of the progessive folk, it stuck, and I spend my spare time (too much of it) behind the scenes fighting for a better deal, roads, $, standards etc, regardless of the politics and assorted broken academic alcoholics I find in my way. I usually reside at the newsgroup 'aus.cars' along with other cranky road users frustrated with the way things are. Some are professional folk in their road transport and engineering fields.

Warning triangles: You will note some cars, EU sourced mostly, often have an area set aside for a single triangle in the boot, the UNECE storage case will fit right in. They are cheap insurance, and should be a mandatory item for registration. Give it time.

Just do not give in and accept what the jockey behind the auto shop counter will typically offer, an Australian Standard 3790 type or worse, 3790B. This latter type is virtually the same Hella supply for the Statesman. It's not Hella's fault, since the product was designed by drunken Aussie Standards professionals and performs best as a toy for children. Therefore, AVOID Hella Part Number 2900!!!

Hella Part Number 2928 is best left for trucks and caravans till extinct, this represents an AS3790 compliant Unit.

DO however purchase Hella Part Number 2901. The Euro/UN type, it exceeds functioning parameters of the AS and is laughingly 'accepted' under it.

ONLY seek the UN/ECE27R in Transport warning triangle type, example directly above for your car, again, accept nothing less.

Too often in experience, I have had to walk back to re-set an AS3790 triangle that's blown over or out of alignment. A danger to the scene it seeks to protect, AND to the user. I have not had to re-set an EU/World triangle yet, where it uses 'spidery legs'. The EU standard also gives a brighter low beam headlight return. Don't spend $4-00 on buying cheap rubbish from certain auto-parts stores. Keep such, as a toy at most or for something to throw at pestering burglars.

You can see at this weblink, my Tasmanian triangle placement text. TAS will adopt an EU triangle pic at a later update, warning Pdf, download it first perhaps. See 'Handling Emergencies:

http://www.transport.tas.gov.au/lice...g%20Safely.pdf

I understand from a source that Ford North America have a few thousand EU triangles in storage, initially intended for their EU fleet, going at cheap rates $6-00 US or so I recall. Made for them by the people at www.gebra.com

Gebra also manufacture units for BMW (See the part number on my Sig, about A$35-38 through your local BMW Spare Parts Dealer).

Per the Sig, Hella Part Number 2901 is excellent. Narva do not as yet stock an ECE triangle, this may change.

China now manufacters many ECE compliant triangles, and in domestic regulation, ONLY accepts UN/ECE and not the North American come AS3790 type, though it also makes those for AUS and North American market.

China also raised their freeway speed limit to 120km/h recently.

[zetec]

I guess they say a student is only as good as his teacher will permit him to be. Beyond that, initiative is the centre of future excellence.

Actually I just made that second part up. But sounds cool! We have to teach the government in many occasions because they seem to have an inherent refusal to teach us...

[b2tf]

Well, i finished this off today - made my connections final and cleaned them up etc.

Impressions - very well worth doing if you have a driveway like mine. Certainly makes it a lot easier to see behind you, very good for me as the back window is now tinted.

A few things I am worried about though, for interests sake I turned on the rear foglight switch doing about 40km/hr, and was greeted with a very loud and strong 'clunk' - i think the car was trying to shift into reverse or thought i was or something, not sure, but its driving perfectly fine and is due for a service soon, so any irregularities should be picked up.

Also dont like that the engine/cooling system warning light comes on when i do it, again because I think the car thinks "wtf, he's trying to shift into Reverse?!".

Otherwise very worth doing, a bit tricky to do mainly cos there is not much room to make your cuts and connections, and when you have big dumb hands like mine, it gets fiddly.

Oh, it looks MUCH better at the back too.

[zetec]

DAMN that doesn't happen on mine... gotta be the auto. I don't get the engine warning light

Sounds like you're better off closing the curcuit to the reverser altogether and keeping separate from the reverser, so the circuits aren't crossing and confusing the computer.