Fuel filler pipe seal

REDDYZ · 14-02-2015, 09:43 AM

Last February I cancelled my Cougar's registration as it was due for rego renewal ($850 here in QLD), needed exhaust repair, tyres and I had plans to replace cams (with SVT ones) and lifters. So, bought a brand new Nissan X-Trail on 1% finance instead. Last December I sold the X-Trail, got my Cougar fixed and registered (didn't replace the cams and lifters though). It passed RWC with no issues.

It was very low on fuel all the time it was being fixed, during rwc, etc,. Disaster after filled tank full of petrol. There is a fuel leak from an unusual place where the filler pipe intersects the fuel tank. There is a rubber seal that seals that joint from leaking fuel. It is a ridiculously stupid design. See the pic below that I sourced from internet. This is not from a Cougar but its the same thing positioned in a different angle.

You can not see the rubber seal in the pic above but you can see it in the pic below.

Fuel tank has to be dropped to change that seal. There is no other way. I tried to take the filler pipe out and no luck. My bad luck is that there is 65L of fuel in tank and there is no way I can drop the tank with so much fuel in Tank.

Making things worst, whilst I was trying to figure out why fuel is leaking from that joint (as couldn't see the seal) unknowingly the leak has become big. Since then as soon as start lowering the car on jack fuel is pouring out from that joint. Did a bit of investigation in other american and uk ford forums and the conclusion was to drop the tank.

Other option is to get the fuel out of the tank. Believe or not, I just couldn't siphon the fuel out with any kind of siphon kit. The siphon pipe just wouldn't go into the tank. (tried various sizes and kinds) The filler pipe is designed in such a way that fuel would only go in and not out. There are so many bends including a 90 degree bend and there is a flap at the end of the pipe that opens only when there is fuel rushing in and as the tank gets full the flap is force closed by the fuel in tank.

Took fuel filter out and tried to pump it out. Thought I would siphon from the top where the pump sits but I will have to cut open the steel to access the pump. Couldn't find a drain plug either. Xmas holidays were approaching and with nothing much I could do, I went and bought a second hand Holden Astra. Since then cougar is sitting in garage since then.

**aussiblue** · 14-02-2015, 10:07 AM

Has it and in tank pump? If so, you could remove it and use a syphon pump. You may be able to replace the grommet by only partially dropping the tank. Some of the stuff here may be relevant http://contour.org/ceg-vb/forum/gene...gas-for-my-car If it's like your car it indicates that a 3/8" hose trimmed to a point can get into the tank. BTW use fuel hose not nylon, plastic or anything that might create static electricity rubbing against the filler pipe.

REDDYZ · 14-02-2015, 12:12 PM

It has in tank pump and is accessible from the top removing rear passenger seats. Problem with cougars is that the hole on the floor is not aligned with the pump. Many chose to cut open the floor rather than dropping the tank to change the pump. I can't tthink of dropping the tank whilst car is on ground with 65L fuel that is more than 75kgs.

I have seen that thread and many others. I agree that I don't need to drop the whole tank but to drop it enough to clear the filler pipe involves the same things to undo in order to drop it. I can't drop it without a hoist just on stands anyway. My plan is just to lower the tank enough to change the seal.

Thanks mate.

**aussiblue** · 14-02-2015, 01:53 PM

So did you try the sharpened 3/8" hose? There is probably an anti-syphon grill or spring that the sharpened end will get through.

REDDYZ · 14-02-2015, 02:23 PM

I haven't tried sharpened hose but did tired lot of different size hoses with edges at the open chopped off. No luck at all. The problem is the filler pipe has so many bends, one almost 90 degrees and its not going straight down either. I know there has to be a way other than hot wiring fuel pump. Will give another shot tomorrow.

Tassie f100 · 14-02-2015, 08:58 PM

I don,t know about the Couger but on earlier vehicles if you houl the ignition key halfway between ON and START the pump will work without starting the engine.So if you hook up a temporary hose from your pump to a container you could empty the tank in a few minutes.

REDDYZ · 14-02-2015, 09:04 PM

Interesting.. I will try that tomorrow. I have a bypass hose in place already from fuel filter into Jerry can. Hope it works with Cougars as well.

Thanks.

thearrow · 25-02-2015, 11:15 AM

When I replaced my fuel pump my mechanic refused point blank to come in through the top of the back seat. If you can't pump it out maybe supporting the tank with a jack and a couple of helping hands might be the answer.

Have you done your fuel pump yet?? If not this is the time to do it.

REDDYZ · 25-02-2015, 01:55 PM

Thought of supporting on jack or stand but its too risky with over 60L of fuel and car being on ground. Anyway, I hot wired the pump manually and pumped out. It's ready to come off. Probably I will give a go this weekend.

REDDYZ · 25-02-2015, 01:58 PM

No. I haven't done the pump yet. Am looking for a heavy duty pump to suit SVT cams with bigger injectors or a 3L swap with SVT cams.

AD26 · 27-02-2015, 10:41 AM

I've been doing alot of research into a 2004 ford escape 3L swap. The option wasn't available when I had my fuel pump assembly changed to the revised US recall pump and I haven't seen the assembly myself but a possible solution could be a spectra pump assembly and fit the turbo focus pump inside. For the record though, the stock pump hasn't caused any problems after svt injectors, cams and tune. The part numbers are 3S4Z-9H307-BC for the pump itself and spectral assembly is SP8020M so you can have a look. The part I had installed was Motorcraft PFS289 to stop the 1/4 tank issue.

REDDYZ · 27-02-2015, 10:53 AM

Stock pump will do the job but at it's peak capacity all the time. It might not be just good enough to get most of the SVT upgrades as per comments in NECO forums.

I had Walbro, SVT and couple of other pumps in mind. Need to do a bit more research.

thearrow · 27-02-2015, 02:19 PM

Good luck changing the fuel pump mine turned into a......NIGHTMARE.

In the end my mechanic had to cobble together the old one and the new one to make it work properly. Honest to goodness Ford must have changed the fuel pumps a dozen times during the short life of the this particular car.

REDDYZ · 27-02-2015, 02:25 PM

I agree somethings are better not touched unless broken. This is one of those things.

Even when I change it, that will be just the pump, not the assembly or sender unit.

REDDYZ · 27-02-2015, 08:47 PM

After a long wrestle somehow managed to get the filler pipe out of the fuel tank. This is how ugly and awkward just to lower the fuel tank while the car is on stands.

Imagine if I had to do this with 65L of fuel in the tank. No way!!

Here is the old seal and the new one side by side.

REDDYZ · 28-02-2015, 07:53 PM

When I lowered the tank to take the filler pipe out, there was a circlip and rubber spacer around the fuel tank filler neck.

I still couldn't figure out what made the old seal leak so bad. Am a bit puzzled over these and couldn't make up my mind to put it back together with the new seal.

This is how the filler pipe came out. I wonder if this is the way to put it back together.

REDDYZ · 06-03-2015, 01:33 PM

After a lot of research I found that the seal has to go first and it has to be pushed in to click and lock into the seat. Failing to do so will result in fuel leak.

It seems that the seal was replaced before or at least tampered for some reason on my car. The way the seal was before wasn't correct. It wasn't fully inserted into the seat as per the above pic.

Anyway, I got all stuff to put it back together (finding the correct lube for the seal was another epic) and gave a go at it few days back.

Believe me it was such a nightmare to get the pipe into the seal

I just couldn't do it. The whole tank has to be pushed up in an angle to align with filler pipe and then seated in place to lock it up.

I just couldn't get the filler pipe into the tank. It is such a nightmare I gave up on it. I will give a go this weekend with another helping hand. It wouldn't be that difficult to this if car is on hoist.

If anyone has to replace fuel pump, my personal advise is to cut open the floor under the seat from inside the car. Dropping tank is risky, complicated and need expensive seals and locks.

I must say that the fuel tank setup is really stupid on Cougars.