Buy a Fiesta diesel, Toyota Hybrid or similar ?

[Rodge]

So the question I would like to pose is how are you planning to cope with the pending
problems that might be caused by Peak Oil ? Some experts are predicting a massive
shortage of oil later this decade with demand supply imbalance forcing prices
dramatically higher, (2008 is probably a portender of much worse to come IMO).

So is this affecting your vehicle choice right now or soon, or is it a problem you'll
worry about when petrol and diesel hit say 3, 4 or 5 dollars a litre ?
Have you thought about it and what's your strategy if any ?

If you own a high performance car which might have an urban fuel consumption of
close to 20 litres per 100 km's when driven with common-sense, much worse is
possible as we all know), does it make sense to have a city car during the week and
reserve your performance car for the weekends, something like a Ford Fiesta econetic
or the regular TDCi or does the Prius i-tech with all its technology appeal ? (3.9 litres
per 100 km's for urban consumption along with all the tech of a Prius i-tech, I must
admit has some appeal to me, perhaps I'm losing the plot as I get older

Does the many decades of abundant LPG make the new liquid injected LPG Falcon
the perfect solution or is something like the new Titanium diesel Mondeo with 5.4
litres per 100 km's consumption the perfect allrounder answer ?

[flappist]

You are old enough to remember when we ran out of oil in the early 80s and again in the 90s and in 2000 (wait that was y2k) and 2009 (oops global warming that time) and 2010 (oops it got colder so it is now global climate change) and in 2015 when Marty McFly crashed his hoverboard.

Don't worry, there will be a [insert agenda managed media beat up here] tax that will solve any problem......

Buy whatever you like, any problems in the future will be solved in the future.

There are a lot of 1980s cars with state of the art lean-burn technology 4 cylinder engines fitted with econo-gauges that use more fuel that a 2011 V8......

[Mr Hardware]

Peak oil lols
Peak 'cheaply available oil' more like it. There's stacks of oil - some of it is just harder to get to and so at the current pricepoint per barrel isn't worth it.

But just wait they'll come along with a turbocharged and supercharged common rail diesel hybrid hydrogen LPG fumigated injection direct injection lean burn cylinder shutdown that'll do 3L/100klms in a car the size of a falcon within about 15 years so none of it will matter soon.

[Rodge]

I agree the era of cheap oil is over but have you noticed the very serious state of the world's economies, yet we still have $100 per barrell oil ?

IMO The only thing that brought oil back from the edge of going truly ballistic in 2008 was the global financial crisis which by most experts analysis is still ongoing. What happens to the oil price if we get some real growth back into the world's economies ? Are they really going to be able to extract enough daily supply of oil in the shale rock systems in time for the massive fall-off in supply from the middle east later this decade ? Most new developments have lead times of many many years.

How will people cope with much more expensive fuel prices that appear almost inevitable at some stage in the forseeable future, that's the question...

[Powdered Toast Man]

Are we running out of oil again! Time to drill Antaractica (joke).

I have no idea what I will do when oil gets too expensive. But I'm sure I will survive even if I have to use public transport and re-use my plastic containers (oil is used for all sorts of things apart from just burning it). For now I'm keeping my guzzling V8 dinosaur.

PS. My LPG system is playing up so I am actually burning a tank of liquid gold per week instead of BBQ gas.

[Yellow_Festiva]

I bought TDCi Focus earlier this year. Don't really give a toss about consumption (although it does fare better than petrol). Torque was more important as I do a lot of freeway driving and tow the odd load / boat around every now and again.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by flappist

You are old enough to remember when we ran out of oil in the early 80s and again in the 90s and in 2000 (wait that was y2k) and 2009 (oops global warming that time) and 2010 (oops it got colder so it is now global climate change) and in 2015 when Marty McFly crashed his hoverboard.

Don't worry, there will be a [insert agenda managed media beat up here] tax that will solve any problem......

Buy whatever you like, any problems in the future will be solved in the future.

There are a lot of 1980s cars with state of the art lean-burn technology 4 cylinder engines fitted with econo-gauges that use more fuel that a 2011 V8......

Deja Vue.
We were told that peformance cars were dead in the mid 1980s,
in the mid 1990s, then again in the 2000s, now they paint a bleak future.....

But, look at who's doin the tellin'..... do gooder greenies that would
never shell out for a large car let alone something with real go...

You and I are old enough to know that performance never really goes away,
it just changes form and buyers just learn to dance to the new rules...

We may ultmately lose our V8s, our turbo I-6s but that doesn't mean the party is over,
not by a long stretch because for those that really want it, performance is always there..

All it really takes is to just go out and buy something you really like...

[Rodge]

Very Latest (November 2011) Prognosis from the International Energy Agency predicts consumers face near term oil prices of circa $150 !!
http://www.worldenergyoutlook.org/do...nch_London.pdf

This would have petrol and diesel at prices higher than their peak's in 2008.
Even a little scarier, Russia to become an increasingly key player in international energy throught this decade !!

Jpd80 - I agree performance cars will always be available its just that they could become so expensive to run there use as a daily will only be affordable for the fortunate few, perhaps we're almost there allready as the idea of a lengthy trip across a big city every day in a supercharged V8 has very limited appeal to me, and not just for the significant fuel cost either

[Mr Hardware]

I do believe that petrol prices are going to return to and exceed their peak within only a handful of years, yes Rodge. But does that mean peak oil? Nup.

[jpd80]

Yeah but things are relative and nothing spikes inflation like higher oil prices,
so believe me, if Australia started experiencing UK style $2.20/litre prices,
you can rest assure that the UK would be very much worse off than us.

I'm just wondering whether Carbon pricing policies now mean that nice fuels
like LPG will be subject to higher than expected fuel excise levels.
I know that's going back on a political promises but it's also a basic tenent in the Henry report too..

[BPXR6T]

Its a 1000km round trip to visit family so I'll be looking for a more fuel efficent commuter when I eventually wear out my XR8. The XR8 is already on LPG, but still its $125 to fill both tanks and that doesn't seem to last too long. Something that chews 3-4L/100km becomes appealing when paying up to $1.70/litre in some country towns.

[blueoval]

I dont believe there is such a thing as peak oil. I think its a media beat up. They are saying that to keep prices high so they make more profit each year. If it comes down to fuel being too expensive to drive, I'll just ride my push bike around. But I think if/when fuel prices hit $2 a litre, people will still pay for fuel to drive around in.

[Rodge]

Originally Posted by Mr Hardware

I do believe that petrol prices are going to return to and exceed their peak within only a handful of years, yes Rodge. But does that mean peak oil? Nup.

Quite possibly. Interesting the early voting has the liquid injection LPG Falcon as the perfect answer at a strong early lead. Must admitt a G6E so equipped has strong appeal especially if petrol goes to $3 per litre

[pottery beige]

i firmly believe that in the future we will be able to burn cute fury animals as fuel...

[blueoval]

Originally Posted by pottery beige

i firmly believe that in the future we will be able to burn cute fury animals as fuel...

If there is money to be made by doing that, Im sure there will be a legislation made for it.

What about Methane power?

[Rodge]

i firmly believe that in the future we will be able to burn cute fury animals as fuel...

I'd rather walk, cycle, hop or crawl

[wrongwaynorris]

One word for a daily driver ECONETIC

[jpd80]

Why pay a huge premium for a diesel or hybrid car if you can go buy
a petrol equivalent and pocket the difference, I doubt the average
buyer could ever do enough kms to make up the differnce.

[SteveJH]

Originally Posted by wrongwaynorris

One word for a daily driver ECONETIC

I'd go for the normal TDCi over the Econetic. Either that or buy a hot hatch and get it converted to LPG.

Diesel is probably more widely available though.

[Mr Hardware]

why do all you guys
type like this into
the forums its like you're
trying to write a
poem

[Rodge]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Why pay a huge premium for a diesel or hybrid car if you can go buy
a petrol equivalent and pocket the difference, I doubt the average
buyer could ever do enough kms to make up the differnce.

There's lots of small and medium diesel's that arn't that expensive compared to diesel's now and with small diesel's fuel consumption in the circa 4 litres per 100 km's is realistic, medium size circa 5-6 litres per 100 km's.

I believe the average consumer is smarter than many of us large car owning performance petrol heads give them credit for. The significant shift towards smaller and more efficient cars that's been going on for years now actually seems to be gathering pace rather than receeding. I reckon most people have perceived the record fuel prices of 2008 as a clear warning of things to come and would rather be proactive than reactive, or perhaps its just the tighter economic times, not sure ?

Mr Hardware, I sometimes lay posts up on word or another programme to run the spell checker over it and then copy and paste.

[TheInterceptor]

I'll install a system in my rig so it can run filtered used vege oil that i can get for free or ultra cheap.

Ill never buy a hybrid. Im not some brainwashed wowser greenie halfwit.

[Rodge]

Originally Posted by BPXR6T

Its a 1000km round trip to visit family so I'll be looking for a more fuel efficent commuter when I eventually wear out my XR8. The XR8 is already on LPG, but still its $125 to fill both tanks and that doesn't seem to last too long. Something that chews 3-4L/100km becomes appealing when paying up to $1.70/litre in some country towns.

Prices in N.Z. have been stable for some time at:-
91 $2.04
95 $2.12
98 $2.21
Diesel $1.55

Generally speaking salaries and wages are circa 20-30% lower here too. Perhaps its no coincidence a Kiwi member started this thread.
I put nearly $140 of 98 in my SC GT-P on the weekend when it was nearly completly empty. That's good for only about 400 km's local motoring around the hilly area in Auckland city where I live.... maybe a Prius or something similar for the daily duties isn't so silly after all ?

[Mr Hardware]

Originally Posted by Rodge

I believe the average consumer is smarter than many of us large car owning performance petrol heads give them credit for.

I have recently started agreeing with this. All those people with their hyundai accents etc really are having the last laugh - good on fuel, cheap tyres, cheap rego, cheap insurance, very little depreciation because they were cheap to buy in the first place, cheap spare parts.

[SteveJH]

Originally Posted by Rodge

I put nearly $140 of 98 in my SC GT-P on the weekend when it was nearly completly empty. That's good for only about 400 km's local motoring around the hilly area in Auckland city where I live.... maybe a Prius or something similar for the daily duties isn't so silly after all ?

Why a prius? With that differential in price between petrol and diesel i'd be going for a small diesel car instead.

[Rodge]

Mr Hardware - I have recently started agreeing with this. All those people with their hyundai accents etc really are having the last laugh - good on fuel, cheap tyres, cheap rego, cheap insurance, very little depreciation because they were cheap to buy in the first place, cheap spare parts.

__________________


- I'm definitly picking up the sarcastic vibe with that post mate but OTOH maybe something like the new Ford Mondeo diesel, (especially in Titanium spec with all that new technology), are the ones laughing all the way to the bank / diesel bowser. Approx 6 litres per 100 km's in the real world with all that new technology, plenty of torque and plenty of room and comfort must be a real hardship

[mik]

it does`nt worry me, there are other alternative fuels, car manufacturers will adapt to what ever fuel is available and cheapest at the time, cars are becoming more fuel efficient all the time and can still be made way more frugal, apart from gas and petrol we still have 400 years of coal left,
and our little planet will probably be blown up by the crazy`s long before we run out of go resources anyway.

if worst comes to worst............

[Rodge]

Originally Posted by SteveJH

Why a prius? With that differential in price between petrol and diesel i'd be going for a small diesel car instead.

Sorry Steve I should have clarified that, diesel users here no matter how efficient, (read Fiesta Econetic) pay Road user charges on top of that at $4.70 per 100 km's, so effectivly if that car uses say 4.5 litres per 100 km's in the real world, the equation becomes 4.5 litres of diesel at $1,55 = approx $7 plus 4.70 road user charges = $11.70 per 100 km's of motoring.

Prius has no road user charges and lower annual registration being a petrol so despite being a much roomier and arguably more comfortable car (especially for bigger people like myself) works out cheaper to run. say 4.5 litres per 100 km's in the real world x $2.12, (they have to run 95 Octane), = approx $9.50 per 100 km's. Besides the technology in the i-tech model is pretty cool and two year old ones are now coming down to far more sensible prices than they once were. Not saying I'll buy one but the idea is not without some merit for normal weekday motoring

[Franco Cozzo]

People also said they'd give up smoking the day cigarettes went over $1 a packet, 30 years ago, I don't see all the V8 zealots giving up their engine choice because fuel went over $X a liter. They might pick up a run about for daily driving and keep the other car for the weekends.

[Mr Hardware]

I'm definitly picking up the sarcastic vibe with that post mate

Wow, i'm terrible at this sarcasm on the net. No, i'm being stony-cold serious. Thats why I bought my mrs a corolla - even if you say the cost to buy, fuelling costs and insurance is higher than my gas falcon, the fact is in 5 years time it's actually going to be worth money where as a same year ford (BFII) won't be worth a cent in 5 years.