Work related question.

stiddy · 30-11-2007, 10:39 AM

Hey all,

Having a shocking day at work today, been in arguments with staff and bosses of stupid little things such as doctors certificates, which they initiated.

ie, A guy at work has forgotten his doctors certificated 2 days in a row, Ive asked him to bring it in, and he's forgotten, today he tells me it went through the wash last night, but he will get a copy from his doctor over the weekend. This guy is not known to be a liar, he's actually straight up and down and a good worker.
My boss above me goes off the deep end and starts on about how he deserves a formal warning and that he's making up stories and what not. I stepped in and said it doesnt need to be elevated that far so me and my boss end up in a full blown argument. This is not the first time.
Ive been with this company for 2 years now, I really dislike parts of the company and alot of the people here. (there are 6 different sections). Ive asked to be moved to a new section which caused another argument.
I love other parts and some of the people here (other sections) and see a future here. But as of this last 6 weeks its been wearing on me and im seriously re-evaluating my place in this company.
What would you do in my position?

thanks in advance,
Matt

FPV GT · 30-11-2007, 10:49 AM

Managing people is one of the most difficult jobs around. The job is made diabolically harder by one up managers who want to run things at your level.

You know your people, you build rapport and understanding, and you are the one they directly deal with. Unfortunately micro-managing is an ill that as managers we have to deal with.

Simplest way of looking at things.
If you can go home each day, and have the knowledge that you have done your best, thats the reward. There will always be politics, and unfairness, the trick is to leave ithat rubbish at the door on the way out.

Regards
Paul

stockel · 30-11-2007, 11:25 AM

See here:

http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11200069

stiddy · 30-11-2007, 11:57 AM

lol thanks for that..

Its like 16 year old school yard here.. quite easy to get a bad perception of yourself from those around you.

Thanks FPV, makes alot of sence. I do that now, well try to, but its easier said then done.

SB076 · 30-11-2007, 12:32 PM

As FPV said managing people is extremely difficult as everyone is different and you cannot cater to everyone which means you are always going to do the wrong thing by someone even when its the right thing by the majority (who are usually silent - as apposed to the minority)

I personally find these issues come about more near Christmas time, whether its people dealing with addtional stress due to Christmas or people thinking of there holidays, or maybe its due to less public holidays leading towards Christmas and people have been couped up together for awhile. After Christmas everything seems to return to normal and than everyone is best of mates again in the new year - then it slowly detriorates throughout the year.

My advice is dont do anything too rash, take time to think of your options and then take it from there. Hopefully you will get a transfer to another section if it becomes too unbearable.

Sam_Boss260 · 30-11-2007, 01:00 PM

Definetly the silly season.

There are politics and games in every organisation, and these games get bigger as the companies get larger.

I try and keep my nose clean and mind my own business and just focus on what I have to do, but sometimes that is very hard, very hard. I've been working here for nearly 6 years and I now know the battles to take on and the ones to walk away from.

But having a manager who is difficult is hard. I am very lucky that my immediate manager respects me and I respect him. Above him...??? Don't get me started !!!

Take a deep breath, wait until after Christmas and re-evaluate things then. This is what I would do.

paule11 · 30-11-2007, 01:01 PM

Use a position based argument get a white board write down your position the other managers position what outcomes you would expect such as employess bringing in certificates also not spending heaps of time in disputes or disciplinary actions
Write down what the other boss wants find what is in common circle them and then talk it out . If you have some positions that are the same you may be able to reason .
If not remain very calm, as you are being abused let him rant and rave for ages and then raise a finger in the air as if you have just had an brilliant idea and say Im begining to sense that you are upset but for the life of me I cant work out why.
Then when he really snaps tell him that his actions are not in accordance with the values and behaviours of the organisation.

steevo d · 30-11-2007, 08:13 PM

being able to post on forums on work provided PC's & work provided internet??
is it really that bad??
i have to admit although i'm not in a management position nothing annoys me more than people doing something other than the job you are employed to be doing.
especially excessive internet usage & bouncing emails between mates while on the clock.

i had the boss above me surf the net all day at work & meanwhile
it was "hell in a handbag, here we come!"

gtfpv · 30-11-2007, 08:47 PM

YEP . I AM GOING THROUGH HELL AT THE MOMENT AT WORK . TO THE POINT WHERE I HAVE BEEN ARGUING WITH PEOPLE DAILY. sorry caps ; it gets to the point where the stress can get out of hand . you can start driving into work wondering whats going to happen today. i ended up spitting the dummy at work and left site . came back the next day . with tunnel vision. and really shouldn't have been there . after 2 more weeks of this , rostered 2 weeks holiday fell, my way. i actually turned up to work with a nose bleeding profusly once , just from seeing the driveway.

take some time off . it's the best thing you can do. let it all go.
when you think about it . your situation is not your problem . it is your bosses and the employee's. dont get involved in it .
the way i look at my situation . is , life is a learning curve . and tuff times pass . when it gets too tough . take some time out .

Sam_Boss260 · 30-11-2007, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steevo d

being able to post on forums on work provided PC's & work provided internet??
is it really that bad??
i have to admit although i'm not in a management position nothing annoys me more than people doing something other than the job you are employed to be doing.
especially excessive internet usage & bouncing emails between mates while on the clock.

i had the boss above me surf the net all day at work & meanwhile
it was "hell in a handbag, here we come!"

I get online at work, what's the big deal? We need the internet as part of our job (IT). But the boss doesn't complain when we start early, finish late, travel in our own personal time, work through lunch etc and not get paid extra as we are on salary.

It's all about give and take.

StealthAu · 30-11-2007, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV GT

Simplest way of looking at things.
If you can go home each day, and have the knowledge that you have done your best, thats the reward.

Thats a load of crap, my reward is a fat wallet.

Dark Horse · 30-11-2007, 09:50 PM

Sounds like you guys all need to go on a big drink together. :baby bott

Hang in there Matt, keep your cool. There is a lot happening at the moment building on everyone's stress levels especially with all the stuff happening come Christmas and New Year's. As a means to alleviate that tension, venting in some form or another is bound to be inevitable for certain personality types.

Leave your work issues at work, don't take arguments too personally - there will always be differences in opinion and perception amongst the people you work with. I've seen some pretty heated arguments amongst colleagues during meetings. Yet at the end of it all, they'll all go down together to the same watering hole and have a few rounds amongst themselves.

Concentrate on where you are now, and where your future lies. Don't let the petty arguments sway this.

Ringo · 30-11-2007, 10:07 PM

I feel you pain brother !

I got screwed over for a minor but important promotion by my new boss who appointed the lastest golden child to the role. Golden child has skills, wears funky shirts, smiles a lot and talks a lot more but has no experience using our computer system or actually working in our dept...yet he was deemed the best choice to lead the dept. I and many others wondered what the hell happened....Months in I am still setting up reports for him because he can't do it. He sees himself as some sort of demi god who cannot be questioned.

The team has since bonded with each other through our hatred of him. He is a little pr*ck impersonating a manager who think managing people is about controlling them rather than encouraging and nurturing them. He has numerous confrontations with me about all sort of things and if you say anything, rest assured you will get pulled aside for a one on one. There was a lot more to this but this was the central element.

Mrs Ringo had listened to me go over and over this stuff for months and I ended up in a very dark place, not suicidal but instead entertaining violent thoughts. I really wonder if golden child would have pushed me and pushed me if he had known that while he was giving me a dressing down for what ever i had done or not done that I was wondering what my pen would look like sticking out of his shoulder...Note that I am not violent in any way, never have been, never hit anyone and have the paitence of a saint but I could feel the point coming when I was going to snap...I was wound up tighter than I have ever been and I knew it wasn't going to take much to set me off. This is not me. I felt like someone else. I was a walking ball of stress and pent up emotion.

Can I admit here bloke to bloke that this situation and the months of other more minor and major stuff did my head in and I ended up seeing an independant work counsellor? I couldn't sort it out in my own head so gave up trying and spoke to someone else and asked for help before I did someone damage or Mrs Ringo said that she couldn't take it anymore. The counsellor (actually a pshycologist) helped me a lot in only a few sessions and really just help to reset my anger meter, my perspective on things etc

Anyway I was outta there...I applied for a bunch of jobs and have just got myself one with the opposition, in a better job, the next career step I was after, 6% pay rise and bigger and better bonus scheme and feel fantatsic. They are keen as to get me on board and I feel wanted again rather than rejected, they see potential in me not limitations. Hows that for validation of feeling underappreciated?

I resigned the other week and they decided not to sack me and instead accepted my two week notice...since then Golden Boy has taken the gloves off and this week tried to have me sacked because he thought I was stealing company secrets for my new employer. He kicked me our of the building until he could speak to someone. He thought he had me....he was so excited. The managers said no and so he had to come back and back pedal and say its all ok etc. (please note I was not stealing anything and its only because of his lack of knowledge about what I doing that he lept to this wild accusation)

This is the longest two weeks of my life. The worst year I have had in 15 years of working and has taught me so much about myself, about those around me, and what really important. 2008 is looking like a better year and I'm pleased to say that Mrs Ringo and I are stonger than the day we married...she showed day in day out why she is the one for me and I feel like a recovering survivor.

So what my point? Is it really worth it? It is just minor stuff that will sort itself out or as in my situation getting to the stage where I was worried what ongoing mental scars this could leave on me, or be the trigger for something regretable.

Its because you care that your upset and people who care about doing good work are in short supply. Get out of the negative place your in because there are plenty of other places that will give someone with the right attitude a go. What do you have to lose except the opportunity to try?

My Pshcologist said that so many of her patients have the same job for 15 years that they despise, working for people they despise yet are scared or moving on, of the big bad world, scared that they will fail so never take the risk trying...could it end up being you?

daniel_rossy · 30-11-2007, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV GT
Simplest way of looking at things.
If you can go home each day, and have the knowledge that you have done your best, thats the reward.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stockoau

Thats a load of crap, my reward is a fat wallet.

That aint a load of crap mate.
We spend about a half of our day at least at work, FPV GT is getting at that the best reward is to be happy and get along with everyone, no one wants to spend half their day being abused.
But, on the other hand money makes everyone happy.

What ever floats your boat i guess.

StealthAu · 30-11-2007, 11:29 PM

Just my opinion, If I went hoe each day knowing I had done the best I could and was earning $20k a year less, it would be now reward. And no offence, but "the best you can do" is a cop out, my aim is to get the job done, and done right.

paule11 · 30-11-2007, 11:33 PM

Ringo

I was in a very similar situation to yours got beaten by a golden child sat with him for six months showing him how to do his job . Until he told me he was claiming 16 hours a week overtime then I helped him no more . Beware of the workoplace psychopath and understand that in some workplaces a tongue in the bum is worth more than a foot in the door. I had a foot in the door but would never prostitute my integrity. No one beats Karma

**Stav** · 01-12-2007, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiddy

Hey all,

Having a shocking day at work today, been in arguments with staff and bosses of stupid little things such as doctors certificates, which they initiated.

ie, A guy at work has forgotten his doctors certificated 2 days in a row, Ive asked him to bring it in, and he's forgotten, today he tells me it went through the wash last night, but he will get a copy from his doctor over the weekend. This guy is not known to be a liar, he's actually straight up and down and a good worker.
My boss above me goes off the deep end and starts on about how he deserves a formal warning and that he's making up stories and what not. I stepped in and said it doesnt need to be elevated that far so me and my boss end up in a full blown argument. This is not the first time.
Ive been with this company for 2 years now, I really dislike parts of the company and alot of the people here. (there are 6 different sections). Ive asked to be moved to a new section which caused another argument.
I love other parts and some of the people here (other sections) and see a future here. But as of this last 6 weeks its been wearing on me and im seriously re-evaluating my place in this company.
What would you do in my position?

thanks in advance,
Matt

Stiddy.You know that I know alot of the people in your company an in your industry.We have crossed paths on many occasions.

You have to understand that while there are bagloads of great guys in your industry that 90% are alot of plastic managers as well who have been elevated not by their skills but by who they know and how nasty they are. . So tread lightly and try not to react. Reacting to their crap is a setup you may be walking into.Then ..youre the bad guy..

cowboy · 01-12-2007, 09:37 AM

Cowboys philosophy on work and life: If you wake up in the morning and lay there for a few moments thinking of possible excuses not to go to work that day then it is time for a change of employment. We spend 40-50 years of our lives working, way too long to be unhappy at it. Fat wallet is nice but happy stress free living is better.

gtfpv · 01-12-2007, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cowboy

Cowboys philosophy on work and life: If you wake up in the morning and lay there for a few moments thinking of possible excuses not to go to work that day then it is time for a change of employment. We spend 40-50 years of our lives working, way too long to be unhappy at it. Fat wallet is nice but happy stress free living is better.

why people worry . is because they are in the , one of the best paying jobs they can get . otherwise people would just resign and move on ( problem solved).
it aint always like that . unfortunately business is business . and bosses just dont throw cash your way. often easy going happy jobs just dont pay really well. unless someone else is copping all the stress and crap.
often it's not the job. it's the people you work for, or with. i'm happy for people who move on and it all works out well
some people would have to sell up, and move state, or down grade in living standard . sell the FPV . or pull kids out of private school for that privelidge of moving on .
thats why often people stay in unhappy jobs . OFTEN SALARIES have a stress componant factored in . to retain staff . because nobody would work there for = money of the happy job down the road .

thats why i say . TAKE TIME OUT . GO BACK FRESH . EASY , SKILLED AND HARD .

FPV GT · 01-12-2007, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stockoau

Thats a load of crap, my reward is a fat wallet.

Thats your opinion and like "a holes" we all have them.
Dont take that personal, just as I am not taking your comment about my work ethic being a load of crap.

I must be very lucky....I do go home at the end of a day and able to sleep with the knowledge of a job well done, and I have also as you say "a fat wallet" too.

Regards
Paul

Bucknaked · 01-12-2007, 05:41 PM

Where can I get this elusive fat wallet?

FPV GT · 01-12-2007, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steevo d

i have to admit although i'm not in a management position nothing annoys me more than people doing something other than the job you are employed to be doing.
especially excessive internet usage & bouncing emails between mates while on the clock."

With respect, thats where you maybe a little blinkered. Being in a management posistion has taught me it is the little things that keep the team happy. Acknowledgement, ownership and the belief that as an employee.....you matter. We live in an IT age where the net is unfortunately our basis of communication and commerce. Allowing employees to chalk up some bandwidth........ I have observed de-stresses them and loosens them up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by steevo d

i had the boss above me surf the net all day at work & meanwhile
it was "hell in a handbag, here we come!"

Thats why he has a competant bloke like you underneath him to save his ***.

_2:

FPV GT · 01-12-2007, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucknaked

Where can I get this elusive fat wallet?

With the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow, being guarded by Jim Morrison.

Regards
Paul

cowboy · 01-12-2007, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucknaked

Where can I get this elusive fat wallet?

In the oil industry!

gtfpv · 01-12-2007, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cowboy

In the oil industry!

or the lubrication industry !!! service with a smile

StealthAu · 01-12-2007, 08:21 PM

FPV GT, Whenever someone has not completed a task given to them in time, or in a way that gives the desired result, the excuse given is always "I did the best I could". This is why I say that’s a load of crap. If you had said that you go home each night with the knowledge of a job well done, I would not have posted anything.

Yellow_Festiva · 01-12-2007, 08:43 PM

Hows this for a tough work situation....

I helped run an English Camp in Korea this Jan, I was the 'middle man' between the westerners and the korean bosses... (ie I was the westerners manager)

So anyway, 45 workers recruited from the states, canada, oz, england etc... all under different recruiters, all under different contracts, all promised BS b4 they signed and agreed to come... (just to get em here, they were short staffed and needed workers asap)....

The first meeting was a blast... you should have seen the looks on their faces when I went through the 'correct' contract....

Hmmm took a while, but all problems were resolved.. first meeting they almost killed me, by the end they got me all tanked and ****ed at the bar when it was all over...

So wasnt that bad... Thank god there were some regular laid back "she'll be right mate" aussies that helped me win over the rest...

Its never fun being a manager of people, especially older. But hey you do what you got to do in the end....

FPV GT · 01-12-2007, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stockoau

FPV GT, Whenever someone has not completed a task given to them in time, or in a way that gives the desired result, the excuse given is always "I did the best I could". This is why I say that’s a load of crap. If you had said that you go home each night with the knowledge of a job well done, I would not have posted anything.

Yes the " I did the best I could" is flogged to death.
And a lot of the time "I did the best I could" is all that some can acomplish, and really is their best.
When I was on the shop floor, and the slackos used that excuse, I thought what a .
Now as their manager, I see that it really is thier best, and now adjust their duties accordingly to help them.

The original comment made to Stiddy, as long as he has the knowledge that "he" has done the best he can.
So whats you point, why interfere?

I am so overwhelmed with your zippo amount of help supplied to a forum member who seeked answers.. WELL DONE

StealthAu · 01-12-2007, 09:07 PM

It's not easy to offer help, given the line of work I'm in and the state I live in, my advice is as follows. If you are not happy with what you are doing or where you work, get another job. Also if you go home and all you can say to make yourself feel better is "I've done the best I can" yet again get another job. If the best you can offer is not up to the requirements of the place you are working for then simply you are not going to get anywhere, I worked somewhere where I couldn't cut it, so I quit. Simple. Now I am in the same line of work and am moving along quickly. Now the problem is as I originally stated this is good advice for someone in my line of work, in Queensland, so someone who is in a different field of work in another state could find themselves up shits creek if they chose to take this advice.

351buzz · 01-12-2007, 11:16 PM

NNNN the job, I live for the weekend. (probly why I'm gettin' nowhere FAST)