cheap labour

[music189]

Theres a buisness seminar in Melbourne tommorrow held by Thialand is going to offer car parts manufacturers labour at $1.16 an hour to move their factories to Thailand.

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by music189

Theres a buisness seminar in Melbourne tommorrow held by Thialand is going to offer car parts manufacturers labour at $1.16 an hour to move their factories to Thailand.

So why is that an issue. If the guy getting paid $1.16 an hour can see a doctor for $5, or can buy a house for $30,000, he wont complain. Unless you think you aint any smarter than him, then you shouldnt have any reason to worry either. Its all relative.

Whats the other option, the Thai car worker should start off on a wage of $25 an hour when other thais are earning $1.00 per hour.

[IceValk85]

Originally Posted by bobthebilda

So why is that an issue. If the guy getting paid $1.16 an hour can see a doctor for $5, or can buy a house for $30,000, he wont complain. Unless you think you aint any smarter than him, then you shouldnt have any reason to worry either. Its all relative.

Whats the other option, the Thai car worker should start off on a wage of $25 an hour when other thais are earning $1.00 per hour.

couldn't have missed the point any further. the problem is this will cost AUSSIE jobs, because tight arsed manufacturers would rather pay 1.16$ ph hour in Thailand than 25$ ph here.

good for Thailand, not good for Aus.

Ice

[Franco Cozzo]

As much as I hate limiting choice with import tarriffs, its the only way you could ever compete against overseas products, is with a massive tax.

But you can't buy an Australian made small car can you?

[bungarra]

We have boatloads of cheap labour coming in. The Navy is going to be escorting them!!!!

[ohzone]

Originally Posted by bobthebilda

So why is that an issue. If the guy getting paid $1.16 an hour can see a doctor for $5, or can buy a house for $30,000, he wont complain. Unless you think you aint any smarter than him, then you shouldnt have any reason to worry either. Its all relative.

Whats the other option, the Thai car worker should start off on a wage of $25 an hour when other thais are earning $1.00 per hour.

What if your job was the one on the line?

[Franco Cozzo]

I'm in a bad position in my line of work, as we fit out emergency vehicles, whats stopping them from swinging the car by China on its way to Australia to be fitted out, then have a small Q/A team here? Everyone is trying to cut costs to increase profit, its the next step.

Hell, even America, they have a lower wage cost than us.

They already make the furniture in China, why not fit it out there?

If you're unfortunate enough to end up in a Victorian meatwagon, all those cabinets are made in China.

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by ohzone

What if your job was the one on the line?

Geez mate, I think I have been in the bosses office 4 or 5 times in the last few months literally begging to get out of my job. And the biggest issue with my job is dealing with lazy, uneducated australian troglodytes who think the 1960's was manufacturing heaven, so they maintain 1960's thinking. Give me an asylum seeker any day.

[flappist]

Yep you are all screaming about this and then 30 seconds later planning your Thai/Bali/whereever holiday then buying the cheapest imported food and other goodies.

You then jump on the net and buy all your gizmos and clothes etc. direct from overseas.

Why? Everything in Australia is too expensive?.......Yep you sure are........

[My poor XF]

I just paid $1200 for a locally made bedroom suite I could have got elsewhere for around $500. Unfortunately more people are doing the opposite and the store I purchased from is going out of business after 50+ years. People would rather buy foreign because it's cheaper. Why should labour be any different.

Sad days.

[2011G6E]

Exactly...it's all relative. Why do you think Australians go to Thailand and other areas for, for instance, dental work? A guy I work with goes there twice a year with his wife, and they get all their dental work done at a nice clinic with qualified and experienced dentists trained in American military hospitals. The money they save pays for the holiday. For instance, later this year he has to get a set of crowns made and a bridge. In Australia the work would cost around $7000. Over there it is going to cost $1200. Last time he got implants for the denture done, and his dentist back here in Oz had to admit it was some of the nicest work he had ever seen.

In those countries the cost of living is...to us...so low it isn't funny. Therefore their wages look "low" compared to ours, but that $1.15 an hour could, for all we know, be a very competitive wage in the industry over there.

There are only two options to keep the unrealistic people happy...raise the wages of everyone in those countries to match ours (won't happen, it would bankrupt the place because of the way their economies are structured on everyone making low wages and paying low prices for everything), or...lower ours to suit theirs to keep it all "fair"...

[The G6ET Spot]

I have just got back into the furniture transport industry after being out of it for 12 years.

It used to be around 10-20% imported furniture.. Now in the time that I had been away it has swung around to being only around 20% locally made.

It is just a fact of life I'm sad to say that we just cannot compete with the asian countries with their cheap labuor.

[302 XC]

So companies are looking elsewhere for cheaper labour .........
Been like that for that long i cant remember
Ummm, snowy mountain scheme in the what 50s/60s ,mostly foriegn workers
Lets look at wages for a sec, $25 base line, then add super,combo,holidays (everyone wants that paid),sickies(how many are really sick in their 8 days paid a year )
That adds around 30 % or more to the base line, then add on the ridiculous rents many pay to earn a living, wearing accounts that many dont pay

When places like crazy clarks,overflow,any $2 junket shop have flocks of people buying cheap imported rubbish, you have to wonder where the country on a wage/manufacture level is goin
Ill tell ya,out to sea, and that ship has left years ago
Ill see a show of hands, whos has everything in their home aussie made, thats everything
Car,trailer,tyres, fruit,veg, cupboards, flooring, bricks,windows,tiles, steel,mowers, chainsaws, TVs, computers, Ipods, stereos,any electrical appliance whatever, its mostly made O/S
When we all buy aussie made and support our failing manufacture industry we have a reason to complain
While we buy on price regardless of its origin of manufacture,we dont care for this country on a manufacture level, we cant complain

As for cheaper base wage an hour,that wont be like that forever, then when they all wake up and ask for more an hour , we as a country will be full of uneducated,untrained workers,with no manufacture base and we will be the country over in their land figting for work

[HappilyInsane]

I think some of you have missed something when it comes to this cheap labour.

What will be the price of the car after it's made in thailand? will their savings be passed onto you? Probably not.

Many banks are sending alot of work offshore because it's cheaper... Are your bank fees lower now? credit card interest lower? etc. Probably not.

Why do certain holden cars cost more for Australians that it does for the Americans who have the car imported and have the car modified. Australian dollar can be good or bad but the prices within Aus dont really change apart from going up.

So who will win if things go to thailand? Trade some out of work thai people for out of work australians, the business makes more money and we save nothing.

Sure, going offshore has been happening for a long time but look what Qantas went through after cutting corners.

[mik]

a moment ago some clever politician was saying in response to yet a couple more companies closing up shop/going over sea`s how we have to be more efficient and export over sea`s.
imo what he is really saying is to trade with these type of countries we have to lower our living standards by half or less probably,
to me it`s beggars belief, these people in power set the rules and policy`s /do the deals, fair trade(unfair trade) set the tax rates,tariffs that we can`t possibly match with countries with like thailand/china/india etc,etc,etc,
as for people buying imports, as long as countries with artificially low dollar/cost goods flooding the country and we have bugger all disposable income ,
Aussies will buy the cheap stuff, i`m a patriot through and through , but also a pensioner, if i can save a couple of buks by buying that cheap car part/car household object, it`s not a case of want to , it`s a case of have to!
disposable income just is`nt there to buy the Aussie stuff more often than not for a big part of the population.
people knock the way things where in the 60`s, maybe things where not perfect, but we owned just about everything, we had services, it was profitable to run engineering factories, textiles, automotive industry, steel mills, farms where probably still hard yakka, but probably better than today.
no doubt we could get rid of sick pay, public holidays, would that really make a difference, for the majority of companies i doubt it,
if they are running on such small margins what hope do they have against these cheap labor countries, being clever and efficient will only get you so far.
if it`s a foot race and you only have one leg having a couple of extra toes on the remaining foot is`nt going to help! that`s my take on it anyway.

[H.G]

last time I was in thailand.. $1 aus was equalled to 30 baht.. so thats a pretty decent wage for them I would hazard a guess.. $30+ per hour..
I guess once jobs are that scarce over her we can all jump on old wooden boats and go take up residency in thailand .. surely they will accept a few refugees seeking a better life for themselves...

[tweeked]

Originally Posted by bobthebilda

Geez mate, I think I have been in the bosses office 4 or 5 times in the last few months literally begging to get out of my job. And the biggest issue with my job is dealing with lazy, uneducated australian troglodytes who think the 1960's was manufacturing heaven, so they maintain 1960's thinking. Give me an asylum seeker any day.

You are obviously not very good at quitting..........

[BroadyFord]

Another example of why we cannot hope to ever compete (or deserve to compete for that matter):

4000 jobs on line amid Ford, Holden industrial dispute

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/40...#ixzz238FnWVmM

THE Baillieu government says it has joined an action at Fair Work Australia in a bid to end an industrial dispute in Dandenong South that risks grinding production lines at Holden and Ford to a halt next week.
The government says the dispute could lead to 4000 Victorian auto workers being stood down.
Federal Workplace Relations Minister Bill Shorten has also intervened in the dispute, helping convene a conciliation meeting between all parties at Fair Work on Sunday.
Since Wednesday, a picket line and lawful strike have hampered production at DAIR Industries, which supplies parts vital to Ford, Holden, Toyota and truck maker Kenworth.
DAIR makes rear bumper assemblies, foot brakes, clutch mechanisms, hood hinges and parking brakes, and employs about 200 people.
For the last three days, striking staff have allowed some workers to cross the picket line, meaning limited production has gone ahead.
DAIR Industries general manager of operations Kevin Boyle said the company had applied to the industrial umpire to end the dispute, because of the economic damage it could potentially do to the state.
"If we continue, this action it will have a significant effect on the economy," Mr Boyle said.
The dispute is largely centred around redundancy benefits at the plant. Mr Boyle said that the strike had not yet affected car production lines.
"But I would expect significant impact by Tuesday," he said.
Victorian Industrial Relations Minister Richard Dalla-Riva said this afternoon that the state government would support an application to Fair Work Australia by DAIR Industries to end the dispute.
"The ripple effect of shutting down supply of parts to other companies across the supply chain will be disruptive in the extreme," Mr Dalla-Riva said.
Workers are the plant are represented by the Australian Workers Union and the Australian Manufacturing Workers Union.
Mr Dalla-Riva said federal Workplace Relations Minister Bill Shorten — a former national secretary of the AWU — should end the dispute.
"Mr Shorten may be a former union chief at the AWU, but his responsibility is to the Australian people, not to his former union. Mr Shorten cannot just sit on his hands. He has the power available to him to order the termination of this dispute," he said.
A spokesman for Mr Shorten said the minister had spoken to all parties yesterday, and they had agreed to conciliation on Sunday with Commissioner Wayne Blair.
Mr Shorten was confident there was sufficient goodwill among all parties to reach a resolution, his spokesman said.
"The Victorian government, rather than rushing out press releases, should instead be focusing on reaching outcomes," he said. "This is not the time for political grandstanding."
The AWU's state secretary Cesar Melhem described Mr Dalla-Riva's decision to join with DAIR Industries as "pointless and contributing nothing to the resolution of the dispute".
Mr Melhem said Mr Dalla-Riva's sudden burst of interest in his manufacturing portfolio smacked of political opportunism.
"He's been minister in hiding through successive challenges to the manufacturing sector, but suddenly he appears out of nowhere to give unions a kicking, and sink the boot into the federal government for good measure,” Mr Melhem said.
AMWU Victorian assistant secretary Leigh Diehm also said Sunday's meeting was a step in the right direction.
"It is massively disappointing to see Minister Dalla-Riva going out of his way to make trouble, when he should be concentrating on looking for a solution," he said.

[mr smith]

Deflation is the only answer for us. We are not smart enough to value add and build on what local brands are left.
Once the mining boom ends, asset deflation will take off along with wage deflation.

[Bill M]

Could someone please tell me that out foreign trading "partners" will not right royally screw us any way they can after our manufacturing industry is flushed down the toilet?
After the mining boom has peaked and it will what will carry Australia through to budget surplus irrespective of who is in Govt?

[new2ford]

Is labour the only factor or does local gouging come into it too?

Every Australian product I've found in Europe is cheaper than it is in Australia - sometimes less than half as much. Average disposable income in Australia is 50% higher than in Germany (Germans are quite heavily taxed) but the cost of living in Australia is 90% higher than in Germany.

Labour much?

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by bobthebilda

Geez mate, I think I have been in the bosses office 4 or 5 times in the last few months literally begging to get out of my job. And the biggest issue with my job is dealing with lazy, uneducated australian troglodytes who think the 1960's was manufacturing heaven, so they maintain 1960's thinking. Give me an asylum seeker any day.

Ring Ms gillard, she will oblige you!!!

[mik]

Originally Posted by new2ford

Is labour the only factor or does local gouging come into it too?

Every Australian product I've found in Europe is cheaper than it is in Australia - sometimes less than half as much. Average disposable income in Australia is 50% higher than in Germany (Germans are quite heavily taxed) but the cost of living in Australia is 90% higher than in Germany.

Labour much?

the very fact that everything is more expensive here and becoming more so really means we have way less disposable income, up the creek without a paddle seems an apt description.

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by Bill M

Could someone please tell me that out foreign trading "partners" will not right royally screw us any way they can after our manufacturing industry is flushed down the toilet?
After the mining boom has peaked and it will what will carry Australia through to budget surplus irrespective of who is in Govt?

Well Australia doesnt make computers, do you think you get screwed when you pick up a $500 lap top today. Australia doesnt make TV's, do you think you get screwed when buying your $500 42 Inch LCD. And despite what people think, even tho we import a large proportion of our fuel, the only thing screwing you is the government taxes.

Remember, we import approx. 87% of the cars we buy in australia, and noone can say they are getting screwed compared to locally made car prices. The only People screwing Australians are other Australians who have vested interests.

[Road_Warrior]

The issue with this "seminar" that the Thai government representative was speaking at, was that it was facilitated by an organisation that is supposedly representing the interests of Australian parts suppliers - and this organisation receives funding from the Commonwealth, Victorian and South Australian governments to carry out it's so-called "industry advocacy" role.

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by mik

the very fact that everything is more expensive here and becoming more so really means we have way less disposable income, up the creek without a paddle seems an apt description.

Yes but why is everything here becoming more expensive if it is made in Asia using cheap labour thus saving costs? Shouldn't that make it cheaper?

Stuft seems an even more apt description.

[nstg8a]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

The issue with this "seminar" that the Thai government representative was speaking at, was that it was facilitated by an organisation that is supposedly representing the interests of Australian parts suppliers - and this organisation receives funding from the Commonwealth, Victorian and South Australian governments to carry out it's so-called "industry advocacy" role.

this is the bit that everyone seems to be ignoring.

your own tax dollars are effectively being used to promote australian job losses.

***** and bicker amongst yourselves about the semantics all you want, but this is the bit that should be getting all the attention.

not whether some worker in a far off land earning $1 an hour is being fairly paid or not.

[302 XC]

Originally Posted by new2ford

Is labour the only factor or does local gouging come into it too?

Every Australian product I've found in Europe is cheaper than it is in Australia - sometimes less than half as much. Average disposable income in Australia is 50% higher than in Germany (Germans are quite heavily taxed) but the cost of living in Australia is 90% higher than in Germany.

Labour much?

I left the engineering field 8 odd years ago ,way back when and even longer we were buying BHP made steel from other countries cheaper than from the place it was made, australia .....
Yep leaves our shores, gets freighted elsewhere, gets unloaded, gets reloaded, chucked back on a ship cheaper than buying it direct ....

[Bill M]

Originally Posted by bobthebilda

Well Australia doesnt make computers, do you think you get screwed when you pick up a $500 lap top today. Australia doesnt make TV's, do you think you get screwed when buying your $500 42 Inch LCD. And despite what people think, even tho we import a large proportion of our fuel, the only thing screwing you is the government taxes.

Remember, we import approx. 87% of the cars we buy in australia, and noone can say they are getting screwed compared to locally made car prices. The only People screwing Australians are other Australians who have vested interests.

Sorry Bob, you lost me when you said
"Whats the other option, the Thai car worker should start off on a wage of $25 an hour when other thais are earning $1.00 per hour."
I couldn't give a rat's about other countries workers living standards,
I am only interested in Australia having a dynamic manufacturing industry ensuring the skills,intellect and ingenuity we have developed over the past 70 years endures. It appears most of the comments made in the media regarding the relevance of the manufacturing sector are based on ignorance.
Bill.

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by Bill M

Sorry Bob, you lost me when you said
"Whats the other option, the Thai car worker should start off on a wage of $25 an hour when other thais are earning $1.00 per hour."
I couldn't give a rat's about other countries workers living standards,
I am only interested in Australia having a dynamic manufacturing industry ensuring the skills,intellect and ingenuity we have developed over the past 70 years endures. It appears most of the comments made in the media regarding the relevance of the manufacturing sector are based on ignorance.
Bill.

Well Bill, all you need to do is come up with a plan (maybe you could share it with us here first), and then it should get picked up.

People always love to overlook things like inflation, investment return, quality etc etc when they think they can come up with a better system.

Simple things like putting a 20% tariff on imports means all cars become dearer. People then buy less cars, and the ones that do buy cars, have less money to spend on other things. Lets hear your plans.