QLD's Road Safety Summit starts now!

[Keepleft]

You can listen live here, click 'Chamber Audio', top right:

http://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/view/chamber/


The agenda is available here, see the Pdf link:
http://www.roadsafety.qld.gov.au/summit

Period Two Days.

[Keepleft]

Some items to come under discusson, from opening speaches by Premier and Transport Minister:

* Radio frequency identification of motorbikes for speed enforcement.
* Potential 120 hours for Learner candidates.
* Fixed speed cameras PLUS signage of such enforcement.
* Road environment, softening.
* Vehicle confiscation for various offences, incl reckless.
* Targetting modified vehicles.
* Drug driving.
* Double demerit point application.
* And more. . .

Crash victim statement at summit, his website:
http://www.shemboy.com/

[XAGSV8]

Did they even talk about driver education or just about pinging people and getting a little more cash.

[Keepleft]

Still progressing, you can listen in.

Prof Ian Johnston stating 99% of the folk breath tested, pass, no surprise here.

Suggesting QLD move towards ignition alcohol interlock development, cites ongoing EU development, citing smart keys etc.

Suspended driver's and the like look set to come under greater attention in penalties.

Seatbelt enforcement. Non wearers represent 5% or so. Seeks ADR to further 'aggressive seatbelt' reminder system.

Speeding behavioural change - will take a generation, based on the same methodology as drink drivings 'change of culture' over time.

References sociopaths, the 'risk-takers', regardless of driving application subject.

References lowest common denominator regulations - whilst engineering standards improve. He is critisizing the regulation/s. . .

[TheSneakiness]

Originally Posted by Keepleft

Seatbelt enforcement. Non wearers represent 5% or so. Seeks ADR to further 'aggressive seatbelt' reminder system.

That's ridiculous.

Because 5% of QLD morons don't wear seatbelts, the other 95% of us have to put up with more chimes and warnings to put them on.

[GreenMachine]

"aggressive seatbelt reminder"??? Given the amount of noise those things make in new Holdens and Fords, what does an aggressive one sound like?

"PUT YER ИИИИING BELT ON NOW YA ********!!!!"

[Keepleft]

Green - AUII - It would be along those lines.

We are heading in the direction of fighting the 'micro issues'.

[Laminge]

Originally Posted by GreenMachine

"aggressive seatbelt reminder"??? Given the amount of noise those things make in new Holdens and Fords, what does an aggressive one sound like?

"PUT YER ИИИИING BELT ON NOW YA ********!!!!"

No

It would be more along the lines of

"Hey Lardarse, try zipties to hold you in, cause this belt aint going to work"

[Keepleft]

Malakai - road environment, yes barriers - road treatment in relation to the removel of trees etc on routes carrying large amounts of traffic and more. Many years ago Prof Joubert called for the same thing in NSW. Sometimes remedial action takes years. . .

Modified vehicles, 'illegally - yes, but pay attention to any legislative changes. The summit is in recess another 10 or so minutes. Outcomes will be discussed 11am - 12pm Wednesday. REM to listen in, link above.

The next item on the Agenda 10:40am QLD time - Key Performance Areas - Youth & Seniors by Dr Ron Christie. (This chap is working on the EU sourced National Driver Training Scheme).

Thereafter - group discussion, see the Agenda link.

[KEV EB XR8]

Originally Posted by Laminge

No

It would be more along the lines of

"Hey Lardarse, try zipties to hold you in, cause this belt aint going to work"

Sounds like kenny out of south park "lol"

[Keepleft]

Ron Christie - highlights young crash rates and risk behaviour, particularly involving males is 'international'. Naturally....

Single vehicle crashes involving young drivers, reduce in number and experience within 6 months of gaining license.

* This will lead to increased log book hours before gaining P stage. Graduated licensing.

Issues of rear-end crashes, single vehicle - both in run off and country road bend crashes too.

"Optimisim Bias', leads to over confidence, particularly in young.

QLD facing potential young driver curfew, 12 midnight till morning as an example. REM these items are on the table, and are not (yet) QLD Gov Co policy.

Referencing older people impact. Suggests for these age groups 'Graduated De-Licensing', a gradual reduction in allowances.

[Keepleft]

Yes, this should all continue soon per Agenda.

Keep an ear out for the ongoing webcast per that Agenda.

VOICE coverage has re-started. 1pm NSW time, 12 QLD

Youth group panel #1 call for 12 month L period and 120hours with NSW like hazard perception testing. Issues of access and equity, that is implementation.

Group #2 - Driver training & education, and experience: Measures:
* Examine a 'Certificate in road safety' in training. Issues.
* Early driver education.

Group #3 - Concerned with potential penalties (graded point system suggested-where as experience gained you get more points, if you lose points you stay on P's), and lower cost vehicles-issues of their safety.

Group #4 - Looked at rural and remote driving.
Group #5 - Studied P restrictions when 'solo'. Example one passenger allowed with exemptions. . .

[Keepleft]

Group #6 - drugs and alcohol actions, further advocacy of restrictions. Issues of alternative transport, restriction of weekend curfews.
Second area relating to higher deterence and repeat ofenders, group dislike of vehicle confiscation.
Alcohol interlock support, seek further studies.

Those QLD log book hours seem to be set for 120 hours or so & 12 L month holding period.

Minister for Police and Corrective services - Hon. Judy Spence summaries. Highlights multi-cultural issues as an impediment . .

Group #7: Older drivers, awareness of medical problems. A need for campaigns in education, families to monitor older drivers, divided on role of doctors. Calls for improved signage.

Group #8: Similar calls to 7. Desires slower speeds and more speed enforcement of low and fast speed limits. Better education of all age groups.

Upcoming: RACQ road safety poll outcome, then CARRS_Q on Impaired driving and speed. Eyesight testing - call to improve. More forgiving road environment.

Group #9: - Similar to above observations, training and impairment. Improve older driver atitudes.

Group #10: On older driver license restrictions. National consistency.
Group #11: Transport solutions for the young driver. Rural issues.
Group #12: ITS and the older driver, signage improvement etc
Continues 1:30pm QLD time. . . . .

[Keepleft]

Forum continues voice online now - subject of speed coming up, impaired driving etc and so on.

[Keepleft]

Prof Ian Johnston wishes to have greater speed limit reality, suggests 130km/h for high-standard motorway, but lower limits for some rural roads (than 100km/h) and 'rural default' reduction.

Basically, improved speed management.

Desires a Joan Claybrook speedometer, (basically say a 140km/h max).

[max^power]

This is getting worse. The other day i actually passed a guy in a pulsar while i was riding a bicycle, lowering the speed limit has to stop!

Inconsiderate and stupid people are to blame for most accidents - make the tests harder.

[Keepleft]

Forum is back online. . .

A doctor calls for a mandatory first aid certificate before licensing. Another call for additional wire-rope type barriers.

Ongoing. . .

Speed discussiongroup seeks far greater use of speed camera, AND to REMOVE warning signs on approach, but support them after the camera.

[UNR8D]

i dont get what the ИИИИ their obsession is with speed camera's, they do SFA to our road toll, greater use of them is only going to line government coffers they dont stop you from speeding you just get a photo 2 weeks later to pay up, increasing the number of police on the road's, BETTER roads in rural area's and manadatory driver training with a refresher course ever 5 years, then every 2 years after you turn 65, as people who got their licance 40years ago dont know a quater of the new road rules and it shows.

fact is if you dont implement driver training their will be young guys that get a rush of blood to the head and do something stupid, would you prefer a young guy that knows ИИИИ from clay and cant get him self out of the situation or a guy that does something stupid but can recover himself and maybe others from a bad situation......

[fiery]

Originally Posted by max^power

This is getting worse. The other day i actually passed a guy in a pulsar while i was riding a bicycle, lowering the speed limit has to stop!

Inconsiderate and stupid people are to blame for most accidents - make the tests harder.

Well maybe if you didnt add that turbo motor onto your bicycle the pulsar would have been able to keep up :

very very true... yes the test should be made harder (only cos I dont have to take it) :

[MITCHAY]

If anything speed limits do need to be upped not lowered. It's getting to the point where I believe that the only reason why some limits are the way they are, is because the government knows that people think it's stupid and therefore won't obey hence more revenue dollars. Every time I go to the coast I go from a 100 to a 50 zone then back to 100.

I have people overtaking me in a 50 zone for christs sake because if I speed I'll cop 3 points for doing the limit it which should at least be 60, ideally 70. It's just rediculous. I'm sure most people from ACT would know that I'm talking about the King's Highway comming in and out of Bugendore.

Surely in town it's sort of appropiate to do 50 because there is a lot of visitors on the holidays but on the outskirts of the town where I've never seen much traffic in aways of people reversing out of a driveway it should be a higher limit because traffic just gets backed up and it's dangerous.

Every government should take a big look into the reality of it all.

[FJ20ET]

Havent listened in yet but when will they bring mandatory annual vehicle safety checks up here.
Im from nsw originally and I can safely say 99% of nsw cars are in a lot better condition than qld cars. I'd pay 100 dollars a year for a vehicle check safety if it meant getting rid of all the rust buckets and ИИИИ boxes off of our roads.
Then they should look at the way germany conducts their licence testing and implement some of theyre practises,its very difficult to obtain a license there.Maybe if they had proper driver training not just a road rules test!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[fiery]

Originally Posted by FJ20ET

Havent listened in yet but when will they bring mandatory annual vehicle safety checks up here.
Im from nsw originally and I can safely say 99% of nsw cars are in a lot better condition than qld cars. I'd pay 100 dollars a year for a vehicle check safety if it meant getting rid of all the rust buckets and ИИИИ boxes off of our roads.
Then they should look at the way germany conducts their licence testing and implement some of theyre practises,its very difficult to obtain a license there.Maybe if they had proper driver training not just a road rules test!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

yep have to agree with the bad cars but this isnt the worse state for crappy cars.....
mmm driver training, yes have to say thats a good idea.. but hey, if they just taught the drivers in Qld how to deal with round-a-bouts .... part of the battle would be possible won!!!!!!!
Im not sure if its Qlder's themselves or those that migrate here, but blimey... surely its not that hard to figure the rules out is it?????

[qwigybo]

yeah victoria has shizboxes everywhere

[Keepleft]

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

If anything speed limits do need to be upped not lowered.

Professor Ian Johnston did say vis - that he could accept 130km/h speed limits on some motoway category roads, but that limits need to be reduced on lesser quality roads, he meant here both those posted, sometimes, AND a reference to the 'typical' 100km/h rural default.

I would be expecting a drop in this rural default to 90km/h, my view is that this should have been adopted after metrification in any case. REM it is 'just' a default, a safeguard all-round limit, higher POSTED speed limits or DERESTRICTION can still apply to a length of road.

Your actually in 'some agreement' with Menier Johnston.


It's getting to the point where I believe that the only reason why some limits are the way they are, is because the government knows that people think it's stupid and therefore won't obey hence more revenue dollars.
Some folk think that, and I get cynical too, but the issue really relates to what they call the 'speed problem' (Perception).


Every time I go to the coast I go from a 100 to a 50 zone then back to 100.
One of the common complaints to Ministers is of frequent speed limit changes per kilometre, herein your example your dealing with two zones?? If so count yourself lucky. NSW is 'reviewing' the 90km/h and 70km/h zones with a view of removing them, I would suspect the 90km/h zone is to stay, along with new rural 90km/h default.

Our friend Harold Scruby said in 2003 in Canberra that the "SHARED TRAFFIC ZONES" speed limited to 10km/h,- should be raised to 20km/h because that is the start point of some speedometers, he is right on this, AND I must say he's right in that we should rename these as "PEDESTRIAN" zones as they do in the US and EU, here the emphasis is for us as pedestrians, in safety, and their scope of install is limited in any case.


I have people overtaking me in a 50 zone for christs sake because if I speed I'll cop 3 points for doing the limit it which should at least be 60, ideally 70. It's just rediculous. I'm sure most people from ACT would know that I'm talking about the King's Highway comming in and out of Bugendore.

More of the recognised 'speed problem', the issue is GovCo and its agents simply do not target this properly with some speed enforcement type (radar etc) not allowed under 'guidelines'.


Surely in town it's sort of appropiate to do 50 because
Yes, sometimes less as we know that the 'limit' needs not be done full time. .


there is a lot of visitors on the holidays but on the outskirts of the town where I've never seen much traffic in aways of people reversing out of a driveway it should be a higher limit because traffic just gets backed up and it's dangerous.
Right, there is no reason why certain streets cannot be posted with a speed limit higher than the built-up area 50km/h default. The default/s are a limit applying in the absence of posted speed limit signs, by inference - you CAN apply for a higher posted limit on lengths of roads, but you actually need to make the application.

You do this by advocacy to either Council (traffic committee's) and sometimes they will seek RTA guidance, OR to RTA direct. You state the road and exact location of the desire change and give reason why you think it should be so.

NOW - often local government politics comes into play, a 'leftist' or 'green' council will rarely post a higher limit, you could then seek RTA intervention, or vote them out next time. Public office holders really do need to hear from people.


Every government should take a big look into the reality of it all.

Few MP's have personal experience of roads issues to the depths of those of us frequenting motoring forums, they deal with lifes other issues too, the old fight for time matter.

I can probaly name 4 - 8 folk nationwide in power that' I'd consider 'informed' to a satisfactory extent.

MP's of the same party often cannot get information from their own Minister of that same party, the Minister is very heavily reliant on his or her 'agencies' liason/managment personel.

The only way you will get genuine change on the roads and driving sphere is to actually have a level-headed, knowledgable person, an enthausiast if you like. Such characters really need to be aware of the 'pressure' they will come under once voted in and 'Ministerialised', they are decended on by lifes 'regulars'.

REM - Ministers come and go - the public service employees remain, regardless of who is in power. This is one of the reasons why HOWARD 'reminded' the audience at the National Press Club that legislative enforcement power rests with the Parliament. A hint that some employees like to play power games. A NSW Labour MP stated much the same as a warning to his agencies back in 1999.

I can say we lost an enthausiast in Anderson, owing ill health. I know of one WA state Labour member as another still serving, so this can be cross-party expertise, just too few and 'appropriate placement' is often not made in a Ministry, 'wasted-talent' if you like.


ANYHOW - TODAY'S QLD FORUM CONTINUES 9AM QLD TIME, and is soon to start, you can log to listen in via the link provided on the first inital post, when there is a break you might need to log in again.

[Keepleft]

Premiers statement: End of forum, an official TO DO list:

* Repeat offenders, face vehicle confiscation - for being disqualified, for drunk and drugged drivers - etc .

* Second drink driving offence to attract alcohol interlocks.

* More use of road barriers.

* Audible rumple strips, for edge of road markings etc. (A national guideline actually).

* Anyone who incurs a speed fine over 20km/h in 12months "a second time" will lose DOUBLE the demerit points for that offence.

* Fixed speed cameras on the way, signed a la NSW application. On M1 as an example.

* Areas of a recognised crash history to be advertised on net.

* General signs to warn of 'speed camera zones'.

* Investigate electronic number plates for motorcycles to aid in speed enforcement.

* Vehicle modifications to be further investigated, as to potential danger etc.

* Learner log books, hours and further restrictions to be considered.

* Electronic Stability Control- QLD seeks implementation across the vehicle range using a national approach.

* Drug driving - testing technology studying, and legislation after 12 month trial. (Sort makes a 'trial' pointless doesn't it:-)

Details in press shortly.

EVENT CLOSED

[Dav0]

Originally Posted by Keepleft

* Vehicle modifications to be further investigated, as to potential danger etc.

i was wondering about this last night.....how many crashes are caused by modified vehicles (not hot factory cars like F6 : etc) but by someone going out and buying an XC falcon and then doing it up and crashing it etc??

[TheSneakiness]

Did they mention anything about the absolutely disgraceful conditions our roads are in up here and how they're going to fix them?

That would eradicate most ideas they have brought up.

[Keepleft]

In that topic I suspect what will happen is further, more stringment enforcement of the National Vehicle Standards, these are that which apply after ADR process.

Mention was made of aftermarket turbo modification - where for example an air intake is slotted by cutting into the front bumper. To see if this contravenes the Standards in any way - integrity etc and so on.

Literally hundreds of issues and potentials.

Items like blue Led washer units, neons and items that 'distract' would likely be targetted more so. . .

I'd suggest a greater number of vehicle inspectors, I see no raised point as to yearly inspections.

AU II UTE - Rumble strips and barriers:-) Repair of a road will take time, age old argument as to $$$$

[flappist]

RFIDs will never work. They are easy to buy anywhere and are cheap and small so you could read a legit one, work out their coding system and then stick them all over everything with a blob of supaglue.
e.g. on police cars, busses, other bikes, push bikes, Peter Beaties' car

It would be interesting in court getting speeding fines from 10 different places at the same time.

[Keepleft]

I agree many issues with these. Bernd Felsche at the aus.cars newsgroup has some experience with them, holds a similar view I recall.

Unreliable....