APS Phase 3 300km/h

barra265t · 27-08-2010, 11:56 PM

Does anyone remember seeing a video of an XR6t crack 300km/h? I thought I remember seeing it back in 2004 online somewhere, but now I can't find it. If I recall correctly, it was on sort of an aerial view with trees lining the side.

CAMS290 · 28-08-2010, 12:14 AM

From memory it was done at Avalon Airfield near Geelong, APS might have a link to it on their site, it was their silver development car.
Peter Luxton used to frequent these forums but hasn't been around for ages, I think he might be hiding from all the angry twin turbo LS owners in the states.

Here ya go http://www.airpowersystems.com/falcon/avalon/307kph.htm

barra265t · 28-08-2010, 12:23 AM

Awesome, thats the one.

**Mechan1k** · 28-08-2010, 01:42 AM

Yeah it was a long while ago when i remember seeing that vid as well ... I haven't been able to find it either.

**Charliewool** · 28-08-2010, 09:47 AM

Was front cover of MOTOR Mag August 2004..

Grippy · 28-08-2010, 10:04 AM

I remember that article in Motor. Would be a wild ride at over 300 klicks in a fairly standard handling BA

**Bluehoon** · 28-08-2010, 12:43 PM

Why is he hiding from all the angry LS owners in the US?

6+ years on and that top speed record still stands, far out.

barra265t · 28-08-2010, 03:27 PM

Yeh, not bad for a BA series 1 running a BTR 4spd? Maybe a ZF6 could do better.

How does one hire out Avalon airfield for an hour/day?

F6T · 28-08-2010, 03:34 PM

I've still got the magazine. When it first came out and those XR6T b-series adds were playing on the TV I never wanted something so bad in my life.

Grippy, I remember them saying that things were getting very untidy at over 300km/h especially when they had to hit the brakes at that speed to slow her down.

FPV GTHO · 29-08-2010, 12:45 AM

I think the issues started earlier, somewhere around 260km/h with massive amounts of front end lift drifting the car from one side of the airstrip to the other. IIRC the car wasnt necessarily fitted with a Phase 3 kit, but probably something closer to their Phase 4 kit. The P3 kit was estimated at around 390fwkw, the 307km/h car was putting that out at the wheels IIRC.

**Bluehoon** · 29-08-2010, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV GTHO

I think the issues started earlier, somewhere around 260km/h with massive amounts of front end lift drifting the car from one side of the airstrip to the other. IIRC the car wasnt necessarily fitted with a Phase 3 kit, but probably something closer to their Phase 4 kit. The P3 kit was estimated at around 390fwkw, the 307km/h car was putting that out at the wheels IIRC.

It was phase 3 and with no edit, all done on the piggyback chip, even the speed limiter was removed with the piggyback, only aps could do it though.
They got the top speed by changing the diff ratio too, the car was a 5 speeder, and had the xr8, 3:23 diff ratio fitted....

flappist · 29-08-2010, 10:44 AM

The important message from this is that the B series is aerodynamically unstable at 300km/h++.

I have done long runs at 250km/h in a BA GT-P and BA2 F6 and they were both VERY twitchy compared to some other body shapes I have driven.

No amount of engine or suspension upgrades are going to do much about this and a B series road car is not very much like a B series V8SC really.

It is too fast in any conditions on any surface..........

mik · 29-08-2010, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

The important message from this is that the B series is aerodynamically unstable at 300km/h++.

I have done long runs at 250km/h in a BA GT-P and BA2 F6 and they were both VERY twitchy compared to some other body shapes I have driven.

No amount of engine or suspension upgrades are going to do much about this and a B series road car is not very much like a B series V8SC really.

It is too fast in any conditions on any surface..........

i would have thought the gt-p to be a little better at speed with the extra weight on the front wheels , was their no difference?

**ebxr8240** · 29-08-2010, 01:49 PM

Better front air spoiler and undercarriage would make it more stable ...
I know my old EB is much better with that plastic piece behind spoiler at speed...
Adds to down force or more the point. Prevents up force...
Low front ride height helps too...

flappist · 29-08-2010, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mik

i would have thought the gt-p to be a little better at speed with the extra weight on the front wheels , was their no difference?

They were both "unsettled". The buffeting from the air was quite noticeable and I had to be rather "active" to keep them going where I wanted them to.

This was on the Barkly and Stuart Hwys pre-labor (i.e. it was legal). One interesting observation is that at 220km/h it seemed perfectly OK and just got squirrelly as it approached 250.

The F6 got there are lot quicker and I only stayed there for 20-30 seconds before backing off to 220 because it felt "unsafe". The GT-P I held for maybe 4 or 5 minutes on the big straight between Avon Downs and Barkly Road House and really only backed off when I observed the fuel gauge heading down a bit quickly and it is not fun pushing a GT-P. The GT-P also flt a bit "unsafe" but at the time I did not care due to other circumstances.

The datto is a bit of a trap as it feels perfectly stable at any speed and will creep up quite quickly if you don't watch it.

barra265t · 29-08-2010, 09:00 PM

How come a Magna can pull 280 while still remaining in a straight line?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8Nps2pJous

Ford Aus don't have a wind tunnel I'm guessing

Road_Warrior · 29-08-2010, 09:24 PM

Makes you wonder how an FG would perform, with its slipperier shape and different front end.

But just goes to show that despite all the spoilers and hi-po motors in the B-cars and 'performance' marketing, they cant shed their budget R&D family hack origins. But I've got to wonder how a decent front undertray and splitter would help it.

flappist · 29-08-2010, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barra265t

How come a Magna can pull 280 while still remaining in a straight line?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8Nps2pJous

Ford Aus don't have a wind tunnel I'm guessing

Yeh I had a speedo like that once.......I got it fixed though.

FPV GTHO · 29-08-2010, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluehoon

It was phase 3 and with no edit, all done on the piggyback chip, even the speed limiter was removed with the piggyback, only aps could do it though.
They got the top speed by changing the diff ratio too, the car was a 5 speeder, and had the xr8, 3:23 diff ratio fitted....

I mustve been thinking of the 10.98s C&V Performance XR6T then.

**CAT600** · 29-08-2010, 11:21 PM

Honestly, I've had my AU at 7000rpm in 5th (0.82:1), 3.45:1 diff ratio and 295/30/19 tyres (26" tall) ..... that equates to 311 km/h.

I know its accurate because at the dragstrip I used to cross the line at 6000rpm in 4th and trap 136mph..... with my road speed showing 218 km/h on my VDO corrector box equipped factory speedo

The verdict?

It was not real cool I can tell you right now..... those that say an AU or FG would slip through the air nicer than a B-series have it all wrong

Daniel

barra265t · 29-08-2010, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CAT600

It was not real cool I can tell you right now..... those that say an AU or FG would slip through the air nicer than a B-series have it all wrong

. Care to elaborate more? sorry

SpoolMan · 29-08-2010, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPV GTHO

I mustve been thinking of the 10.98s C&V Performance XR6T then.

That was the 1st 10sec B-Series Falcon was running the APS phase 3 kit.
I got 10.80@131mph from my phase 3 in Street trim and 10.47@135mph in race trim, nice kit looked factory and had an awesome intercooler...

**Full Noise** · 30-08-2010, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Makes you wonder how an FG would perform, with its slipperier shape and different front end.

Probably stuff all difference at those speeds.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

But just goes to show that despite all the spoilers and hi-po motors in the B-cars and 'performance' marketing, they cant shed their budget R&D family hack origins. But I've got to wonder how a decent front undertray and splitter would help it.

Regardless of the slippery shape, these things were never designed to hold top speeds like this. Way too high in the roof line and underneath, an aerodynamic dog’s breakfast. A totally flat undertray and rear diffuser would be the go but I couldn’t see it happening on one of these things.

mrbaxr6t · 30-08-2010, 12:11 AM

v8scs apparently only just reach 300kmh down conrod and info on if they really do is sketchy why do this in a roadcar, v8scs have front splitters for a reason, the people doing this imho are insane, fit a supercar splitter to it you want to go 300kph and inform us of how much better it works compared to stock one I would love to know the answer

**CAT600** · 30-08-2010, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrbaxr6t

....the people doing this imho are insane......

I have been called that before and it does not worry me.

To be honest I wasnt doing it to be insane, I genuinely thought the car was still in 4th and I was actually doing a run to check speedo error at 7000 rpm (Tach max) vs 240km/h (Speedo max) because the car should have hit 240 just before 7000rpm... the idea was also to feel tailshaft vibration at 7000 in readiness for more circuit/strip work.

After I slowed down, I looked at the gear stick and saw she was forward.... that got my mind racing I can tell you.

Daniel

nb_351 · 30-08-2010, 10:45 AM

so you were having so much fun you dont even remember shifting up into 5th lol
good stuff
we used to own a mazda 3 with exhaust etc and i got that to 220 on a certain twisty highway, not that thats anywhere near 300 but for a 2lt non turbo i think it was pretty good... needed swaybars though let me tell you lol
and my eb ghia i ahd with the digital dash i clocked at 199, and it was still climbing and getting very light in the front end ....

**CAT600** · 30-08-2010, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nb_351

so you were having so much fun you dont even remember shifting up into 5th lol
good stuff....

I'ts probably just habit of driving the car 1-3-5 and skipshifting 2nd and 4th that was the culprit... when you change out of 3rd at 4500rpm and stand on it in 5th there is no lack of urge

Daniel

nb_351 · 30-08-2010, 01:08 PM

im sure theres not mate

hehehe

barra265t · 30-08-2010, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nb_351

so you were having so much fun you dont even remember shifting up into 5th lol
good stuff
we used to own a mazda 3 with exhaust etc and i got that to 220 on a certain twisty highway, not that thats anywhere near 300 but for a 2lt non turbo i think it was pretty good... needed swaybars though let me tell you lol
and my eb ghia i ahd with the digital dash i clocked at 199, and it was still climbing and getting very light in the front end ....

How did you get an EB to 199, had one new back in the day and the wind noise was scaring me at anything over 140. Anyone remember the EL GT road test and the embarrassing top speed of something like 185 before the tailshaft came undone?

**CAT600** · 30-08-2010, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barra265t

How did you get an EB to 199? Anyone remember the EL GT road test and the embarrassing top speed of something like 185 before the tailshaft came undone?

Dont remember that, I do remember the manual EB GT ran to 220-odd and the Auto was limited to 205..... as were the ED Sprints. EL GT had a carbon fibre wrapped alloy shaft and the manuals had no trouble reaching deep into the 230's

Daniel