RAM 1500 Diesel now available

[Franco Cozzo]

Apart from the MY19 RAM 1500’s new ‘high viz’ badging, the updated RAM 1500 V8 Express also gains a reversing camera and Trailer Brake Control, but the diesel won’t be available in entry-level Express form, which like the bigger RAM 2500 Laramie gets a longer (6’4”) tub – up from 5’7”.

That’s because – contrary to expectations -- the majority of demand is for more expensive Laramie versions, which account for about 60 per cent of RAM 1500 sales.

And while there’s bigger demand for the RAM 1500 in cities than rural areas, where more RAM 2500s are sold, Stewart said diesels will account for only around 10 per cent of RAM 1500 sales.

“Diesel will be a very small percentage of our [RAM 1500] sales,” he said. “It will appeal to a certain part of the marketplace.”

https://www.carsales.com.au/editoria...leased-119237/

RAM Trucks Australia has sold more than 1000 RAM 2500s since January 2016, more than 1500 RAM 1500s since July 2018 and will notch up 3000 total sales this year.

Solid demand for an expensive converted product.

Makes sense that they are predicting small market for RAM 1500 diesel, its pretty underpowered for its size, you'd be better off going one of the 6 cylinder or Hipo variants of the Thailand specials as the RAM 1500 diesel is weaksauce on power and torque for the vehicle size.

Obviously the appeal of the American utes is their size and decent engine options - 291KW V8 in the RAM 1500, pricing is on point at $79,950.

[Ben73]

Give me the V8 petrol. How many kms would have to do before you break even on fuel savings over the 10k price premium?
The diesel specs are pretty unimpressive.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Ben73

Give me the V8 petrol. How many kms would have to do before you break even on fuel savings over the 10k price premium?
The diesel specs are pretty unimpressive.

I'll go the 6.7 Hummin Cummins any day of the 2500.
Does it say what this smaller ECO diesel is. ??
edit... reread it, VM built.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Ben73

Give me the V8 petrol. How many kms would have to do before you break even on fuel savings over the 10k price premium?
The diesel specs are pretty unimpressive.

Not much because you'd make significantly more than the petrol come resale, no different to any diesel v petrol depreciation consideration.

The 1500 diesel is not meant to be the answer to all your towing needs, but it'll easily do what an Asian Ute will do with more room and presence, get the 2500 for the real stuff.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Not much because you'd make significantly more than the petrol come resale, no different to any diesel v petrol depreciation consideration.

Depends on the market though - in the case of a Land Cruiser, sure, the diesel variants are worth significantly more than the petrol variants.

Given that the majority of the RAM 1500 sales are predicted to still be the petrol variants, this may effect resale down the track - there is a huge difference in power between the petrol and diesel variant.

Think of Ecoboost Falcon - its the redheaded stepchild of the FGII-FGX Falcon and they're just about stacked 10 high at the tip on the second hand market - they're sub $10K these days on the second hand market.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Depends on the market though - in the case of a Land Cruiser, sure, the diesel variants are worth significantly more than the petrol variants.

Given that the majority of the RAM 1500 sales are predicted to still be the petrol variants, this may effect resale down the track - there is a huge difference in power between the petrol and diesel variant.

Think of Ecoboost Falcon - its the redheaded stepchild of the FGII-FGX Falcon and they're just about stacked 10 high at the tip on the second hand market - they're sub $10K these days on the second hand market.

Aussies have a love affair with diesels right now and until this time that hasn't been an option for those seeking a RAM, time will tell how these sell but I wouldn't expect to see them stacked up at the wrecker.
The little 2.7l V6 diesel Terri easily outsold the much more powerful 4.ol petrol including the turbo version and command a premium on the secondhand market.

[smoo]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Not much because you'd make significantly more than the petrol come resale, no different to any diesel v petrol depreciation consideration.

The 1500 diesel is not meant to be the answer to all your towing needs, but it'll easily do what an Asian Ute will do with more room and presence, get the 2500 for the real stuff.

The V8 1500 is also like a luxury car with a proper tray and engine compared to an overpriced drum braked Thai special. A 1500 goes above the Thai utes in that it will tow at their upper limit a lot more competently and safely. Slot in between a Thai ute and the 2500 pick ups.
I think it’s a stretch to say a 3.0 diesel is going to have better resale than the hemi. A lot of the appeal of the Ram is because of the V8, and this will be more so when both are up in the mileage.

[naddis01]

Originally Posted by smoo

The V8 1500 is also like a luxury car with a proper tray and engine compared to an overpriced drum braked Thai special. A 1500 goes above the Thai utes in that it will tow at their upper limit a lot more competently and safely. Slot in between a Thai ute and the 2500 pick ups.

It's a pity though if you want to tow the Ram 1500s maximum rated tow capacity and you are fat, you can't legally drive it. You need a smaller friend to do it for you.

[smoo]

Originally Posted by naddis01

It's a pity though if you want to tow the Ram 1500s maximum rated tow capacity and you are fat, you can't legally drive it. You need a smaller friend to do it for you.

Similar story with the Ranger as well isn’t it... At 3.5 towing the Ranger only has around 200kg to play with before exceeding GCM?

[naddis01]

Similar for the Ranger but not as bad. It's around 250kg. The Ram 1500 is approx only 80-90kg for the 4500kg towing model and around 110kg for the 3500kg model.

So the Ranger actually has a higher payload than the 3500kg towing 1500 while towing 3500kg.

[Franco Cozzo]

I was whizzing about Melbourne CBD in an electric prototype rigid truck two weeks ago, we had 3750KG in the back, we were over legal weight because all 3 of us in the front were real fat bastards

[smoo]

Originally Posted by naddis01

Similar for the Ranger but not as bad. It's around 250kg. The Ram 1500 is approx only 80-90kg for the 4500kg towing model and around 110kg for the 3500kg model.

So the Ranger actually has a higher payload than the 3500kg towing 1500 while towing 3500kg.

The Ram with the tow pack leaves 1100kg to play with to max GCM if towing 3500kg.
Refer to my first post of the Ram being a better vehicle if one is towing at the upper limits of the utes (3-3.5t) on a regular basis.
If one is often towing up around 4.5 t, better off stepping up to a 2500 class pick up and 5th wheel.

[GXA]

Originally Posted by smoo

The Ram with the tow pack leaves 1100kg to play with to max GCM if towing 3500kg.
Refer to my first post of the Ram being a better vehicle if one is towing at the upper limits of the utes (3-3.5t) on a regular basis.
If one is often towing up around 4.5 t, better off stepping up to a 2500 class pick up and 5th wheel.

Last time I looked, the max F&R axle weights for the Ram1500 were 1750kg.
That would pretty much exclude carrying anything in the tray while towing.

[naddis01]

Originally Posted by smoo

The Ram with the tow pack leaves 1100kg to play with to max GCM if towing 3500kg.
Refer to my first post of the Ram being a better vehicle if one is towing at the upper limits of the utes (3-3.5t) on a regular basis.
If one is often towing up around 4.5 t, better off stepping up to a 2500 class pick up and 5th wheel.

Yes, if you have the 3.92 diff you have over 1T payload if towing 3500kg. However the fact is if you are towing the maximum rated capacity for either model (3.21 or 3.92 diff) then you can't be fat and legally do it.

Edit: I hadn't seen the axle ratings.

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Not much because you'd make significantly more than the petrol come resale, no different to any diesel v petrol depreciation consideration.

The 1500 diesel is not meant to be the answer to all your towing needs, but it'll easily do what an Asian Ute will do with more room and presence, get the 2500 for the real stuff.

Possibly, but other similar vehicles like the LC200, the diesel is a significantly better engine than the petrol and is more fuel efficient. In the LC to upgrade to the diesel you are gaining 210nm for the loss of 27kws. That’s a good trade off.
The Ram diesel it’s hardly a better engine. You gain a mere 13nm but lose 110kws.
I guess we will have to wait and see if the 1500 diesel holds it’s value better. I’m not as confident in that than with other large 4x4s

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by naddis01

Yes, if you have the 3.92 diff you have over 1T payload if towing 3500kg. However the fact is if you are towing the maximum rated capacity for either model (3.21 or 3.92 diff) then you can't be fat and legally do it.

That may be so but look what happen when you give up 300 Kg and tow a 4,200 Kg trailer

First, Gross Combined weight......7,237 Kg (for 4,500 Kg Max Tow w/70mm ball)
Less Gross vehicle weight...........3,450 Kg (max 800 Kg)
Equals 90% trailer weight...........3,787 Kg (Total Trailer wt is 4,200 Kg)

First, Gross vehicle weight............3,450 Kg
Less Vehicle Weight.....................2,650 Kg
Equals Max Payload........................800 Kg
Less Tow Ball Weight......................420 Kg (the other 10% trailer weight counted as payload)
Equals Passenger Weight.................380 Kg.........or 4 x 90 Kg people...



With 3500 Kg towing pack, look what happens with towing a 3120 Kg trailer

First, Gross Combined weight......6,261 Kg (for 3,500 Kg Max Tow w/50mm ball)
Less Gross vehicle weight...........3,450 Kg (max 800 Kg)
Equals 90% trailer weight...........2,811 Kg (Total Trailer wt is 3,120 Kg)

First, Gross vehicle weight............3,450 Kg
Less Vehicle Weight.....................2,650 Kg
Equals Max Payload........................800 Kg
Less Tow Ball Weight......................312 Kg (the other 10% trailer weight counted as payload)
Equals Passenger Weight.................488 Kg.........or 4 x 122 Kg people...

[Sprintey]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Depends on the market though - in the case of a Land Cruiser, sure, the diesel variants are worth significantly more than the petrol variants.

Given that the majority of the RAM 1500 sales are predicted to still be the petrol variants, this may effect resale down the track - there is a huge difference in power between the petrol and diesel variant.

Think of Ecoboost Falcon - its the redheaded stepchild of the FGII-FGX Falcon and they're just about stacked 10 high at the tip on the second hand market - they're sub $10K these days on the second hand market.

Franco that's one of the secret sweet spots of LandCruiser pricing - a petrol one that has depreciated for a few years. Far less to worry about compared to the diesel V8 maintenance and problems in the URJ 4.6 petrol which is chain driven too if I recall.

And the Ecoboost Falcon, sub 10K you say? What are the I6 ones asking in comparison? Overall it was a pretty good idea, give or take cleaning carbon off the back of the valves.

[smoo]

Originally Posted by GXA

Last time I looked, the max F&R axle weights for the Ram1500 were 1750kg.
That would pretty much exclude carrying anything in the tray while towing.

Not if towing 3.5 tonne with the 4.5t rated Ram, as per my original point.
That would leave approx 400kg of weight to go on the Ram, with 10% tongue weight taken into account.
I was not aware we had a lower tow/GCM spec available here.
Those figures for the lower spec are pretty poor. And I can only guess Dodge don’t need to post optimistic figures for the 1500 due to the fact they have the heavy duty range to cater for real work.
Contrast to the Jap utes, anyone who has had a 1000l IBC on the back of a double cab or 70 series will know what a crock the 1 tonne figure is.

My 2350kg monocoque SUV on standard 20” wheels has a 800kg pay load and 3.5 t tow rating. Similar figures to the Ram. Except the Rams wheelbase is 750mm longer, track is 100 wider and it tares in another 400kg.
Similar story with the double cab utes. I know what I’d rather be towing 3.5t with.

[Interceptor]

the 735kg payload is a joke, especially considering the 2500 isn't much higher

whats worse is what these vehicles are rated to carry/tow over in the US

it seems as if in Australia that theyre targeted specifically at the posers and caravan draggers

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Interceptor

the 735kg payload is a joke, especially considering the 2500 isn't much higher

whats worse is what these vehicles are rated to carry/tow over in the US

it seems as if in Australia that theyre targeted specifically at the posers and caravan draggers

Well isn't that what most 1500 and 2500 trucks are used for in the USA,
over 75% of all 1500s and 2500s sold there are crew cabs, been that way
now for well over a decade..

Also,
All US manufacturers deliberately limit their 1500s so that they comply with CAFE
and light vehicle emissions, but also to safe guard the heavier 2500 and 3500
trucks away form any moves by government to include them under CAFE.

The biggest joy with a late model Landcruiser is its 6800 KG Gross combined weight rating
you can tow a decent 3,500 kg trailer and load up your vehicle with less fear of exceeding
gross vehicle weight.

[Bossxr8]

They are claiming 11.9 litres per 100 for the diesel, and 12.2 for the hemi. What kind of garbage is that? You would not see less than 20 litres per 100 from the hemi in suburban driving. Where are they getting that ridiculous economy figure from. The diesel is believable. The hemi numbers are laughable. Would struggle to get those numbers on the highway, let alone combined figures.

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by jpd80

That may be so but look what happen when you give up 300 Kg and tow a 4,200 Kg trailer

First, Gross Combined weight......7,237 Kg (for 4,500 Kg Max Tow w/70mm ball)
Less Gross vehicle weight...........3,450 Kg (max 800 Kg)
Equals 90% trailer weight...........3,787 Kg (Total Trailer wt is 4,200 Kg)

First, Gross vehicle weight............3,450 Kg
Less Vehicle Weight.....................2,650 Kg
Equals Max Payload........................800 Kg
Less Tow Ball Weight......................420 Kg (the other 10% trailer weight counted as payload)
Equals Passenger Weight.................380 Kg.........or 4 x 90 Kg people...



With 3500 Kg towing pack, look what happens with towing a 3120 Kg trailer

First, Gross Combined weight......6,261 Kg (for 3,500 Kg Max Tow w/50mm ball)
Less Gross vehicle weight...........3,450 Kg (max 800 Kg)
Equals 90% trailer weight...........2,811 Kg (Total Trailer wt is 3,120 Kg)

First, Gross vehicle weight............3,450 Kg
Less Vehicle Weight.....................2,650 Kg
Equals Max Payload........................800 Kg
Less Tow Ball Weight......................312 Kg (the other 10% trailer weight counted as payload)
Equals Passenger Weight.................488 Kg.........or 4 x 122 Kg people...

Many people probably don't realize how low the payload is allowed to be when they tow 3.5t with their dual cab ute or large 4x4 wagon. With all the 4x4 mods like, bullbar, canopy, draws etc, most people are probably pushing their max payload with the driver only when towing a heavy load.

For comparison while towing biggest trailer allowed the max payload would be

200 series: 260
Wildtrack: 222
XLT: 322
BT-50 4x2: 495
Amarok core: 409

Hilux Rugged X with 3.2t trailer 198kg payload.

So the 1500 diesel payload isn't great, but it is comparable to the rest. The 1500 petrol has a big payload when towing 3.5t

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Sprintey

Franco that's one of the secret sweet spots of LandCruiser pricing - a petrol one that has depreciated for a few years. Far less to worry about compared to the diesel V8 maintenance and problems in the URJ 4.6 petrol which is chain driven too if I recall.

And the Ecoboost Falcon, sub 10K you say? What are the I6 ones asking in comparison? Overall it was a pretty good idea, give or take cleaning carbon off the back of the valves.

One of my work colleagues has an FGII Ecoboost G6 and he got it for around the $10K mark, equivalent I6 variants seem to be a few thousand bucks more on average comparing similar KM.

Put one of these on it, 3" turbo back exhaust and a tune and you'll have a 220KW+/wheels with a fast spool, fart cannon special.

https://gcg.com.au/petrol-performanc...-v-band-detail

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

One of my work colleagues has an FGII Ecoboost G6 and he got it for around the $10K mark, equivalent I6 variants seem to be a few thousand bucks more on average comparing similar KM.

Put one of these on it, 3" turbo back exhaust and a tune and you'll have a 220KW+/wheels with a fast spool, fart cannon special.

https://gcg.com.au/petrol-performanc...-v-band-detail

Could be a real sleeper with top end horsepower improved

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Ben73

Many people probably don't realize how low the payload is allowed to be when they tow 3.5t with their dual cab ute or large 4x4 wagon. With all the 4x4 mods like, bullbar, canopy, draws etc, most people are probably pushing their max payload with the driver only when towing a heavy load.

For comparison while towing biggest trailer allowed the max payload would be

200 series: 260
Wildtrack: 222
XLT: 322
BT-50 4x2: 495
Amarok core: 409

Hilux Rugged X with 3.2t trailer 198kg payload.

So the 1500 diesel payload isn't great, but it is comparable to the rest. The 1500 petrol has a big payload when towing 3.5t

Anytime you add crew cabs, the extra weight and passengers kills your payload but hauling a 3000 kg trailer or van should be a snap for a 1500.
Would love to see Toyota Tundra with Landcruisers V8 diesel

[prydey]

Originally Posted by GXA

Last time I looked, the max F&R axle weights for the Ram1500 were 1750kg.
That would pretty much exclude carrying anything in the tray while towing.

Correct. Rear axle limit for RAM 1500 is a pathetic 1770kg.
What people don't realise is that ball weight, due to being at least a metre behind the axle, actually adds about 45% more weight to the axle. So 350kg on the ball will add around 500kg to the rear axle.

So yeah, sure, the RAM comes with a big engine, but legally as far as weight is concerned you are actually worse off compared to a LC or even a Ranger. A lot of people that tow don't care about legal though.

[hayseed]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

They are claiming 11.9 litres per 100 for the diesel, and 12.2 for the hemi. What kind of garbage is that? You would not see less than 20 litres per 100 from the hemi in suburban driving. Where are they getting that ridiculous economy figure from. The diesel is believable. The hemi numbers are laughable. Would struggle to get those numbers on the highway, let alone combined figures.

There was a Court case recently were someone took a Dealer & the manufacturer (I think Mitsubishi) to court over this. & Won..

[chevypower]

Originally Posted by prydey

Correct. Rear axle limit for RAM 1500 is a pathetic 1770kg.
What people don't realise is that ball weight, due to being at least a metre behind the axle, actually adds about 45% more weight to the axle. So 350kg on the ball will add around 500kg to the rear axle.

So yeah, sure, the RAM comes with a big engine, but legally as far as weight is concerned you are actually worse off compared to a LC or even a Ranger. A lot of people that tow don't care about legal though.

Yeah old Ram 1500 with 5 lug axles was pathetic. The new generation 1500 has 6 lug axles, which bump up the payload. The F150 and Silverado 1500 have had 6 lugs forever, so they weren't as bad. Payload on a 2019 Ram 1500 Laramie crew 5.7 4x4 is 1,840 lbs (836kg). It's fine for its intended purpose. People, fuel, and a 3500kg trailer. Need bigger, that's what the 2500 and 3500 are for. The bigger you get, the more truck-like it is to drive.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I was whizzing about Melbourne CBD in an electric prototype rigid truck two weeks ago, we had 3750KG in the back, we were over legal weight because all 3 of us in the front were real fat bastards

Sorry franco, someone had to post it.
Problem with that is when you hit some tram tracks to fast at 90 deg and you heads bounce off the roof lining.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by roKWiz

Sorry franco, someone had to post it.
Problem with that is when you hit some tram tracks to fast at 90 deg and you heads bounce off the roof lining.

image

Thats exactly what it looked like!

Tell you what how bouncy those Jap trucks are we all should have been wearing our sports bras.